Cerberus.Senkyuutai said: »
So just like any update on a MMO? Gotcha.
Senkyuutai's unnecessary snark skill went up by 0.2.
Insurgency Possibly Bugged Or Buffed
Insurgency possibly bugged or buffed
Senkyuutai's unnecessary snark skill went up by 0.2.
Let's not pretend this added any level of balance. People always drooling over any possible advantage in this already easy game, it needed to be fixed. There's more than enough power creep in this update without it.
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I'm fine with WSD% affecting all hits provided SE balances around it.
Resolution is proof that they have not.
Resolution is proof that they have not.
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Father time
[1] "Drain" Potency +25%
[2] Weapon Skill Damage +15%
[3] DMG:+15
[1] "Drain" Potency +25%
[2] Weapon Skill Damage +15%
[3] DMG:+15
Asura.Pinsquid said: »
Didn't do any extensive averages or anything, but went out as DRK to Ronfaure to hit wild rabbits with Resolution. Went as /sam, used Caladbolg, 63% total WSD.
TP Return in WSD set was 140, WSed at exactly 1030 tp for a good 15 rounds until I missed the first hit. Average on the 15 was right around 3700-3800. When first hit missed, Reso still did 3715 damage. Repeated that and got the same result again. Obviously can't confirm if it would apply to the other 3 hits of Reso but at least for the first and second hit, WSD appears to be in full effect.
TP Return in WSD set was 140, WSed at exactly 1030 tp for a good 15 rounds until I missed the first hit. Average on the 15 was right around 3700-3800. When first hit missed, Reso still did 3715 damage. Repeated that and got the same result again. Obviously can't confirm if it would apply to the other 3 hits of Reso but at least for the first and second hit, WSD appears to be in full effect.
Wsd has always worked on the first hit
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so would multihit ws outdo single hit ones by an excessively large margin now if this bug/ninjabuff/w.e it is remains?
volkom said: »
so would multihit ws outdo single hit ones by an excessively large margin now if this bug/ninjabuff/w.e it is remains?
There's no blanket answer.
Anything that was good got better
No, we are seeing spike screenshots. It's doing a little higher than before, but single hit (monk offhand, so 2-hit) ws also seemed to get the buff as well. "Excessively large margin" is a huge overreaction based on the reso/blade chi screenshots (one was done on a 119 monster, the other apex bats with master nin and unknown buffs >_>)
Just a thing here though, we already know wsd applied to first hit of ws. Now if the first hit misses, did the game register the "2nd" hit of the ws (the first one that landed) as the "first hit", and thus, wsd always applied to whatever the first hit that landed was? Was that ever tested, or are we now just saying "hey, i missed the first hit of insurgency, but still got the same damage on the second hit. wsd applies to all hits". Haven't seen anything that clarified that bit.
Just a thing here though, we already know wsd applied to first hit of ws. Now if the first hit misses, did the game register the "2nd" hit of the ws (the first one that landed) as the "first hit", and thus, wsd always applied to whatever the first hit that landed was? Was that ever tested, or are we now just saying "hey, i missed the first hit of insurgency, but still got the same damage on the second hit. wsd applies to all hits". Haven't seen anything that clarified that bit.
The buffs don't matter. When someone did Chi testing when Jinpu was the new hot ***, and used all the max buffs, they didn't 99k
(iirc) *** ah search function is garbage, so you're welcome to dig and try to find it, I can't even remember if it was in the nin thread, or an update thread, or something else.
(iirc) *** ah search function is garbage, so you're welcome to dig and try to find it, I can't even remember if it was in the nin thread, or an update thread, or something else.
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okays cool. I was gonna get upset and want torcleaver to do exponentially more damage :)
And you would be incorrect. Chi has and does hit 99k using the appropriate buffs. You just need high tp. The screenshot Ruau posted is misleading because we don't know how much tp was used, nor what buffs were applied. If Zetaking can hit 70k+ on Sang Buaya NM without capped tp, this isn't impressive.
Skip to the 22:50 mark where Hybrids are used, Ruau admits it would be 99k (with more tp)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=64_IXFwv-Q8
Now if that screenshot is him being bare naked, then we have a broken line item. But it was already broken, Jinpu as well, you just didn't know to what degree.
also, on things that matter, Jinpu/Chi don't do nearly as much. They are fun toys to exploit, but in the grand scheme of things, are highly resisted on everything else ilvl and end game.
Skip to the 22:50 mark where Hybrids are used, Ruau admits it would be 99k (with more tp)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=64_IXFwv-Q8
Now if that screenshot is him being bare naked, then we have a broken line item. But it was already broken, Jinpu as well, you just didn't know to what degree.
also, on things that matter, Jinpu/Chi don't do nearly as much. They are fun toys to exploit, but in the grand scheme of things, are highly resisted on everything else ilvl and end game.
Lakshmi.Buukki said: »
Just a thing here though, we already know wsd applied to first hit of ws. Now if the first hit misses, did the game register the "2nd" hit of the ws (the first one that landed) as the "first hit", and thus, wsd always applied to whatever the first hit that landed was? Was that ever tested, or are we now just saying "hey, i missed the first hit of insurgency, but still got the same damage on the second hit. wsd applies to all hits". Haven't seen anything that clarified that bit.
Its literally in the OP post. Insurgency at 3k TP has a 6.0 fTP multiplier on the first hit and a 1.0 multiplier on subsequent hits, it will never "got the same damage on the second hit" as you put it. The damage difference is monumental when the first hit misses. The entire thread came about because the average damage from subsequent hits of insurgency jumped from 2.5k to 4.2k over the span of an update. WSD% just happened to correlate accurately to the difference in before-and-after damage.
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I can confirm this is happening with Resolution, and other WS's have been tested that have nothing to do with REMA. This changes gear optimization quite a bit, but I'd be careful about spending inordinate amounts of gil on what could be a temporary thing since we don't know if this was intentional. After all SE was messing with the WS code in order to fit in the new Augmented REMA damage bonus's. This is the same company that with the same update made Corsair and Geomancy gear not work and has in the past made Sneak Attack work from the front in the same sort of update. Or the time cure was doing 9999 damage to undead.
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Lakshmi.Buukki said: »
No, we are seeing spike screenshots. It's doing a little higher than before, but single hit (monk offhand, so 2-hit) ws also seemed to get the buff as well. "Excessively large margin" is a huge overreaction based on the reso/blade chi screenshots (one was done on a 119 monster, the other apex bats with master nin and unknown buffs >_>)
Just a thing here though, we already know wsd applied to first hit of ws. Now if the first hit misses, did the game register the "2nd" hit of the ws (the first one that landed) as the "first hit", and thus, wsd always applied to whatever the first hit that landed was? Was that ever tested, or are we now just saying "hey, i missed the first hit of insurgency, but still got the same damage on the second hit. wsd applies to all hits". Haven't seen anything that clarified that bit.
Just a thing here though, we already know wsd applied to first hit of ws. Now if the first hit misses, did the game register the "2nd" hit of the ws (the first one that landed) as the "first hit", and thus, wsd always applied to whatever the first hit that landed was? Was that ever tested, or are we now just saying "hey, i missed the first hit of insurgency, but still got the same damage on the second hit. wsd applies to all hits". Haven't seen anything that clarified that bit.
Seriously, I lost few hours testing this with Guillotine for clear and definitive answer and proof and ppl not even bother to check last few pages ><
SimonSes said: »
Seriously, I lost few hours testing this with Guillotine for clear and definitive answer and proof and ppl not even bother to check last few pages ><
Because we already have a definitive answer?
Me and another dude did it with asuran fists
What does this mean for BLU, specifically CDC sets since Expiacion and Savage Blade were already stacking quite a lot of WSD?
Caitsith.Mahayaya said: »
What does this mean for BLU, specifically CDC sets since Expiacion and Savage Blade were already stacking quite a lot of WSD?
That's my question too, you're probably going to want some mix of wsd/critdamage without sacrificing too much crit rate.
You'd need a lot of ws's to find a balance between wsd and crit
Did a couple evisceration in normal set, vs wsd set and they were too wildly different to get good numbers. and I don't want to do hundreds.
You'd have to go to abyssea (with a cor?) to get 100% crit rate with and without WSD... or adjust spreadsheets, that would be quicker
Cant see too many slots outside of reforge wsd and maybe rings where wsd would be a clear winner over crit rate/dmg/ta for blu.
SE such *** for putting WSD on our Shalwar.. No attack, no dex, such garbage.
For BLU:
AF+3 body
Relic+3 legs
Herculean WSD +5% Feet
Epaminondas's Ring
Other things like Ambu cape are less obvious.
AF+3 body
Relic+3 legs
Herculean WSD +5% Feet
Epaminondas's Ring
Other things like Ambu cape are less obvious.
Time to dust these babies off
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Also if this doesn't get fixed, the gap between Resolution job and not resolution job just got bigger ?
Asura.Eiryl said: »
The buffs don't matter. When someone did Chi testing when Jinpu was the new hot ***, and used all the max buffs, they didn't 99k
(iirc) *** ah search function is garbage, so you're welcome to dig and try to find it, I can't even remember if it was in the nin thread, or an update thread, or something else.
(iirc) *** ah search function is garbage, so you're welcome to dig and try to find it, I can't even remember if it was in the nin thread, or an update thread, or something else.
Chi spikes are multiattack procs, got an 88k with most being around 40-50k, probably a Ta proc, QA can be 99k.
geigei said: »
Chi spikes are multiattack procs, got an 88k with most being around 40-50k, probably a Ta proc, QA can be 99k.
40-50k with what buffs? What TP? What set? Also on apex?
Unless DM augment or izuna offhand, ninja doesn't have qa options normally. It's the buffs. They DO matter. Frailty malaise fury fighters chaos dia 3-4 and it will melt. The fighters especially since it can double attack on each hit, and possibly impact the magical portion of it equally as well.
That and jinpu aren't the issue. It's resolution, if this stays the way it is. There will be no way you can convince anybody to use anything other than it in any zerg scenario.
That and jinpu aren't the issue. It's resolution, if this stays the way it is. There will be no way you can convince anybody to use anything other than it in any zerg scenario.
SimonSes said: »
geigei said: »
Chi spikes are multiattack procs, got an 88k with most being around 40-50k, probably a Ta proc, QA can be 99k.
40-50k with what buffs? What TP? What set? Also on apex?
non bolster and close to 1k tp is 30k ish, similar to ten.
Asura.Ccl said: »
Also if this doesn't get fixed, the gap between Resolution job and not resolution job just got bigger ?
This kinda depends. Uphaeval and Torcleaver should still be better at 1250TP. Resolution will catch up and eventually beat them the closer to 3000TP you are.
So imo, other jobs will fall behind a lot in scenario where you zerg with Warcry, especially vs RUN. RUN with augmented Lionheart and Warcry and fully buffed will be just out of the reach for anyone. Not only because of TP bonus and higher base dmg on weapon, but also because of temper, which is even bigger buff, when you limit your multi attack on gear in fevor of WSD.
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