New Character Development System: Master Level.

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New Character Development System: Master Level.
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 Fenrir.Svens
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By Fenrir.Svens 2021-11-25 08:49:53
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Shiva.Thorny said: »
I'm assuming that's the actual reason we have 119 still. They decided against letting trusts get any stronger and continuing a visible vertical progression system, but had already committed to 119. The new gear is clearly generated using the same stat calculators, and higher than 119, but labeled 119 for reasons unknown to us.

I can't imagine it would be that hard to throw on a cap of 119 base on trust(keep in mind we do have ways to increase their level past 119, such as DI gear or the quests). But, I don't expect SE has any interest in relabeling gear to begin with, so it's more of an academic argument than anything else.

I wonder what their plans are for trusts should we continue to increase in master level and fight tougher mobs. It seems like they're at least partially aware given the random tank trusts updates the last 2 months. At the same time, there was that one update that incorrectly increased trusts' levels and had to be fixed.
 Asura.Sechs
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By Asura.Sechs 2021-11-25 08:59:07
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Shiva.Thorny said: »
I'm assuming that's the actual reason we have 119 still.
THE actual reason? I doubt it. One of the plentiful reasons? Quite likely.

My take on the topic is that when they announced all those changes SE had quite different plans for the future of FFXI, supposing they had plans at all, but they didn't expect the game to be still alive and played on 25 november 2021 the way it is now.

They were the first who didn't believe the game would've lasted this long, especially after the human resources cut. (if anything this tells us something about how masochistic us FFXI fans really are, lol)
Because of this they delayed long term plans for ilevel past 119. Thinking they would've raised it only if some "big plans" for the future of the game would've arrived from the higher floors of SE.

This never came to be, and the game unexpectedly survived, and they delayed the "raise ilevel past 119" moment and delayed it and delayed again and again until they reached a point where they had delayed it so long that it was a bit too late to raise it now.


I think it's something like this.
Among the reasons that contributed to this delay that got unexpectedly longer than originally planned, we can surely name the Trust thing, the fear to displease too many players, and probably many other small things.
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By SimonSes 2021-11-25 08:59:37
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Shiva.Thorny said: »
You get the value of the system when you look at wider scale situations. Let's say that you're recruiting for a PUG dyna-d wave 3, planning to fill out all 18 people. If you require everyone to be i130 minimum(at least partial odyssey/malignance), everyone will likely be able to stay alive and contribute meaningful damage. Without that measurement, you can get someone in eschite gear, adhemar gear, etc.. using no swaps. A shitty player with i132 in this circumstance is going to be able to contribute because they'll have adequate accuracy and m.evasion, while a shitty player with i119 would likely spend half the run either on the floor or missing nonstop.

You're only looking at this in the context of your personal understanding of the game, and you're not the target of an improved ilevel system. I would say that almost anyone in this thread understands there are times when you can sacrifice the survivability of newer era ilevel gear to gain damage by using older era ilevel gear. These people aren't going to lose that knowledge just because newer era ilevel gear gets a bigger number slapped on it. It's the people who do not have that knowledge in the first place who would benefit from clarifying effective ilevels.

Nah I disagree with how you think I'm thinking about this.

I'm just asking you how would you evaluate ilvl and how would you like to people understand that evaluation.

You have just wrote
Quote:
A shitty player with i132 in this circumstance is going to be able to contribute because they'll have adequate accuracy and m.evasion, while a shitty player with i119 would likely spend half the run either on the floor or missing nonstop.
but Sakpata for example has very low total accuracy, but would be considered lets say as 132 ilvl for you. Flamma+2 has way higher accuracy and would be considered what? 122? Another problem is sets shared by different jobs. Take Malignance for example. BST can use it, but DRG can't. Now both BST and DRG can use Gleti's. In term of meva, accuracy and DT Gleti's is far behind Malignance for BST, but if you compare it to gear DRG has access to, then meva seems high, accuracy is ok and PDT is very good. It's even harder when you should consider that Odyssey gear should be are the same ilvl, because otherwise people will start asking, why some jobs got ilvl132 gear (sakpata) from this event and other only ilvl 127 (Gleti's).

There is many factors:
* gear shared by different jobs
* various power of gear from same event (Odyssey)
* theoretically higher ilvl (Malignance) gear coming before lower ilvl (Gleti's)
* Gear being cut for very specific use cases. Malignance for example would be considered high ilvl, but try to use it for WS set (we talk about people full timing sets) with uncapped attack and its actually super weak, weaker than many sets you would consider ilvl a little higher than 119.
* some really hard to gauge stats like PDL, which might be completely useless or completely OP.

You whole argumentation is about making it easier to understand for people who don't want to dive deeper into mechanics, but imo you wouldn't achieve that. I can understand people now not understanding value of pdl or critical hit on armor, but you suggest people with eschite, seeing no accuracy on their armor, dont understand that other ilvl 119 armor with +50 accuracy wont improve their Hit Rate. I call that bs. All the basic attributes should be easy to grasp and people should easily tell that something with much higher accuracy make them more accurate and something with more magic evasion make them more evasive against magic. They clearly see they can get something better and I completely don't buy argument that they have no incentive to get better armor, because they don't recognize it as better, because it's not labeled higher ilvl. Now I can easily see many people being confused and asking why this ilvl132 armor has lower accuracy (or whatever different stat) than ilvl122, or why this ilvl132 armor has no attack at all, or more practical, why they do twice less damage in this 132 ilvl armor, than they did with ilvl 122 (with Sakpata for example, which is totally possible since if you full time it you can have very terrible results, especially if you assume casuals, so they wouldn't even know to get haste elsewhere and would run with 16% from set only).
 Shiva.Thorny
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By Shiva.Thorny 2021-11-25 09:08:29
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SimonSes said: »
I'm just asking you how would you evaluate ilvl and how would you like to people understand that evaluation.
It's really not that complicated. It's a general estimation of the item's overall strength. It's not going to guarantee you cap m.eva on a specific target, or cap accuracy on a specific target, or are ideally equipped for specific content. But, it does make it easier to get a general estimation of your current standing and evaluate which content is most likely to provide gear that will improve your current standing. You want rigid spreadsheet style valuations for things that cannot be valuated in that manner due to constantly changing circumstances.

SimonSes said: »
Sakpata for example has very low total accuracy
200 accuracy on the 5 main slots might be low compared to malignance or specific sets, but it's higher than any original era 119 is. It's sufficient for the content.

SimonSes said: »
Flamma+2 has way higher accuracy and would be considered what? 122? Another problem is sets shared by different jobs.
Flamma has ~90 more accuracy counting dex, but no DT, massively lower m.eva, no DA, no attack. It is a generally weaker set, having higher accuracy doesn't change that. Again, the target audience isn't min maxers, it's people who are newer to the game and want a quick idea of where they are at and people who want a quick way to evaluate potential members.

All odyssey gear is the same effective ilevel, it's just weighted toward different stats. I really don't see this as a good faith argument, you're being intentionally obtuse and cherry picking single stats rather than looking at the overall spread of the equipment.

The bottom line, and I think we can both agree on this, is that establishing an ideal equipment set for any event will require understanding of far more concepts than an ilevel can ever hope to provide. Ilevel cannot replace a working knowledge of all the game mechanics when playing at a high level, and I'm in no way suggesting it can or should. I'm saying that the actual stat spread of the gear is increasing in a linear manner to indicate that current gear is close to 135, while older gear is actually 119, and displaying that would be a very low effort way to provide more information to people who have not yet (and probably wont, tbh) done that research.
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By SimonSes 2021-11-25 09:30:21
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Shiva.Thorny said: »
It's a general estimation of the item's overall strength.

You really estimate item overall strength the same for Gleti's and Sakpata?

Shiva.Thorny said: »
Flamma has ~90 more accuracy counting dex, but no DT, massively lower m.eva, no DA, no attack.
Shiva.Thorny said: »
it's people who are newer to the game and want a quick idea of where they are at

I see a problem here.
New people wouldn't have Flamma and Sakpata in their inventory. They would need to get what's possible to get for them anyway. It's not like they can get Sakpata, before they get other gear. It's also not like they will do any hard fights NOT KNOWING they are doing it for better gear. If they don't recognize Relic+3 or Odyssey as better gear and has no incentive to get it, then they will never go to dynamis d or to Odyssey, because for what else?
So logical process is that they would recognize better gear is reward from some difficult event and then they will attempt difficult events to get them. Also seeing like both you and Eiryl want it so much, I kinda feel it's something else hidden in here. Maybe you want casual people to easily identify the bigger carrots to give them incentive to buy more gils, so they can pay merc for them? That would have sense and that would also explain why you think they would have problem with evaluating items on their own, since buying gils, paying merc to get them and not even engaging anything in the process would teach you nothing and you could really have a problem comparing Eschite to Sakapta lol.
 Odin.Foxmulder
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By Odin.Foxmulder 2021-11-25 09:45:08
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Mattelot said: »
Personal attacks/ad hominem is a poor form of conceding. Once those start, the person has instantly lost.

But implying also
Mattelot said: »
someone who calls a moron or bad faith poster doubling down an idiot is a child

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By Shiva.Thorny 2021-11-25 10:06:03
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SimonSes said: »
New people wouldn't have Flamma and Sakpata in their inventory. They would need to get what's possible to get for them anyway. It's not like they can get Sakpata, before they get other gear. It's also not like they will do any hard fights NOT KNOWING they are doing it for better gear. If they don't recognize Relic+3 or Odyssey as better gear and has no incentive to get it, then they will never go to dynamis d or to Odyssey, because for what else?

This might be hard to understand, but someone who doesn't have 15 years of FFXI under their belt and just bought the game because of 14 or whatever, is just trying to play the game. They see a shout for an event that wants a job they have, they go because it's something to do. The people who look up every drop for everything they do are not the same people running around in eschite and considering it 119.

SimonSes said: »
Also seeing like both you and Eiryl want it so much, I kinda feel it's something else hidden in here. Maybe you want casual people to easily identify the bigger carrots to give them incentive to buy more gils, so they can pay merc for them? That would have sense and that would also explain why you think they would have problem with evaluating items on their own, since buying gils, paying merc to get them and not even engaging anything in the process would teach you nothing and you could really have a problem comparing Eschite to Sakapta lol.
Another bad faith argument bordering on personal attack. Mercing a Kalunga clear and buying 5/5 sakpata is like 15m total, and skips you to top. I'm not concerned about selling 15m to a starter player, if anything they'd buy more if they merc every step in order without realizing half of them are pointless. The real spending is on RMEA and HQ crafted gear, stuff the top end players feel a need to have on every one of their X characters and Y jobs, but is utterly irrelevant to a starter player.
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By Mattelot 2021-11-25 10:14:51
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Odin.Foxmulder said: »
Mattelot said: »
Personal attacks/ad hominem is a poor form of conceding. Once those start, the person has instantly lost.

But implying also
Mattelot said: »
someone who calls a moron or bad faith poster doubling down an idiot is a child


Inventing things people say is just as sad.
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By SimonSes 2021-11-25 11:01:52
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Shiva.Thorny said: »
This might be hard to understand, but someone who doesn't have 15 years of FFXI under their belt and just bought the game because of 14 or whatever, is just trying to play the game.

If they come from XIV they will expect that every higher ilvl for DD jobs is a massive boost in DPS. They will be very confused doing half damage then, because they will have 132ilvl set with stat spread toward survivability and very situational DPS stats like PDL, while in their 127ilvl set with less survivability their were doing much more damage.

I think it's way better to show them from the start to not expect ilvl labels above 119 on gear in FFXI and that you need to think by yourself or use guides, because that's how FFXI is and trying to find some work around and cutter the game for those people is total waste of low development power we have. They will end up in bad place anyway if they won't learn to use gear situationally and without looking at ilvl, just less bas full timing Sakpata over Eschite, but still terrible. If anything FFXI is so good, because it's that much different and it might not have linkshell communities like in 75 era, but still have strong forum community that help each other and it's great like that imo and we should encourage new people to join it.
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By Mattelot 2021-11-25 11:22:34
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SimonSes said: »
If they come from XIV

I'm sorry but I'm just picturing someone like that with the XIV mentality, going into content on a whm spamming dia saying "healer DPS makes the run go faster!" Maybe not but that made me smile.
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By RadialArcana 2021-11-25 11:36:14
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If you put a fresh capped player in the top Ilevel gear on XIV they can perform as well as anyone else, the game has standard easily capped dps and survivability checks that are uniform. The game is made to appeal to casual players that want to put little effort into gearing.

XIV DPS check: Do you have the correct Ilevel gear on.

If you put a fresh capped player in full Ody gear they cannot perform as well as anyone else, there is mass complexity to performing well on XI.

XI DPS check: do you have good TP gear, do you have good ws set, good augments on that gear, do you have skills capped, do you have merits, do you have job points, do you have vorseals, do you have food, was the party correctly built to have support classes, do you have a REMA. on and on

The thing I see the most often btw, isn't players in Zitah gear at all but Ru'aun or Reisenjima DI gear with no augments on them.
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 Odin.Foxmulder
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By Odin.Foxmulder 2021-11-25 11:43:58
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More and more often, I see people in Odyssey gear with no augments on them. IDK where you are seeing people with Zitah or Ru'Aun pieces. Maybe someone running around with some Adhemar?
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 Asura.Topace
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By Asura.Topace 2021-11-25 12:12:12
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People don’t aug escha gear? It literally cost like 200k to max lol
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By Asura.Saevel 2021-11-25 12:26:24
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RadialArcana said: »
If you put a fresh capped player in the top Ilevel gear on XIV they can perform as well as anyone else, the game has standard easily capped dps and survivability checks that are uniform. The game is made to appeal to casual players that want to put little effort into gearing.

That is where I'm doing to say hard no. This is what happens when a FFXI player looks at FFXIV with the same mentality that had from FFXI and ends up missing it entirely. In FFXI damn near 90% of the "skill" in game is about building gear sets and writing lua's / equipsets / ect.. to change as needed. Limitations on the engine makes possible battle mechanics somewhat limited and typically mastered within a week of content release.

FFXIV on the other hand has homogenized gear such that all stats are relative to content level. Players do not need to bother figuring out "what" to wear or "optimizing" gear for different attacks, instead they need to optimize ability rotations and battle mechanics. This process takes a very long time with the highest difficulty fights taking months to master after repeated failures.

YouTube Video Placeholder


Yeah try to keep your DPS rotations up while constantly moving around in teams based on what ability the boss decides to use for that phase.


Neither game is "better" then the other, they are both radically different from each other focusing on different aspects of MMORPGs. Since I prefer to explore builds and character mechanics, I tend to play FFXI and DDO the most and only occasionally go on a FFXIV jaunt for a few months at a time.
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 Asura.Saevel
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By Asura.Saevel 2021-11-25 12:28:56
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Asura.Sechs said: »
Are there things in game that scale potency/power based on your current average ilevel?

Base damage on magic WS's will use your weapons iLevel.


Quote:
Base Magical WS Damage = ((152 + floor((WeaponLevel-99)*2.45) + WSC) * fTP + dSTAT + Magic Damage (Statistic)

At level 99 the base damage is 152, at 119 it's 201, at 129 it would be 225 and so forth.
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By Odin.Creaucent 2021-11-25 12:39:46
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RadialArcana said: »
If you put a fresh capped player in the top Ilevel gear on XIV they can perform as well as anyone else, the game has standard easily capped dps and survivability checks that are uniform. The game is made to appeal to casual players that want to put little effort into gearing.

XIV DPS check: Do you have the correct Ilevel gear on.

If you put a fresh capped player in full Ody gear they cannot perform as well as anyone else, there is mass complexity to performing well on XI.

XI DPS check: do you have good TP gear, do you have good ws set, good augments on that gear, do you have skills capped, do you have merits, do you have job points, do you have vorseals, do you have food, was the party correctly built to have support classes, do you have a REMA. on and on

The thing I see the most often btw, isn't players in Zitah gear at all but Ru'aun or Reisenjima DI gear with no augments on them.

Tell that to the 6k dps PLD, should have been doing 12k, that tried out for my static it was a hard no. My group currently has a lower dps DNC which isn't hurting us too much as the rest of us parse high. There is a lot more to XIV than you think at higher level play.

Edit: actually do you know about stat thresholds in XIV? You can be swapping gear and having points in that sub stat that are doing completely nothing as it lands you in a dead zone of that stat. What do you do then? What if your raid piece has a dead stat that your job doesn't use? Are going to keep using it or are you going to drop 10 ilvls to use a better itemised piece. One of your job abilities gives your next attack 100% crit and direct hit chance do you gear for both still or do you start using gear to increase one and determination?

If its so easy you should have no problem figuring that out?
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By Asura.Briko 2021-11-25 13:05:55
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Odin.Creaucent said: »
Tell that to the 6k dps PLD, should have been doing 12k, that tried out for my static it was a hard no. My group currently has a lower dps DNC which isn't hurting us too much as the rest of us parse high. There is a lot more to XIV than you think at higher level play.

Edit: actually do you know about stat thresholds in XIV? You can be swapping gear and having points in that sub stat that are doing completely nothing as it lands you in a dead zone of that stat. What do you do then? What if your raid piece has a dead stat that your job doesn't use? Are going to keep using it or are you going to drop 10 ilvls to use a better itemised piece. One of your job abilities gives your next attack 100% crit and direct hit chance do you gear for both still or do you start using gear to increase one and determination?

If its so easy you should have no problem figuring that out?
XIV gear progression is not as deep as you are trying to make it out to be. "Thresholds" are just tiers. If you're unable to make it to a higher tier, then its best to stop right at the cutoff and allocate stats elsewhere.
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By Odin.Creaucent 2021-11-25 13:22:30
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Asura.Briko said: »
Odin.Creaucent said: »
Tell that to the 6k dps PLD, should have been doing 12k, that tried out for my static it was a hard no. My group currently has a lower dps DNC which isn't hurting us too much as the rest of us parse high. There is a lot more to XIV than you think at higher level play.

Edit: actually do you know about stat thresholds in XIV? You can be swapping gear and having points in that sub stat that are doing completely nothing as it lands you in a dead zone of that stat. What do you do then? What if your raid piece has a dead stat that your job doesn't use? Are going to keep using it or are you going to drop 10 ilvls to use a better itemised piece. One of your job abilities gives your next attack 100% crit and direct hit chance do you gear for both still or do you start using gear to increase one and determination?

If its so easy you should have no problem figuring that out?
XIV gear progression is not as deep as you are trying to make it out to be. "Thresholds" are just tiers. If you're unable to make it to a higher tier, then its best to stop right at the cutoff and allocate stats elsewhere.

The point is its not as simple as putting on max ilvl gear and then you can do top dps numbers.
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By Pandemonium.Zeto 2021-11-25 13:26:32
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Asura.Briko said: »
Odin.Creaucent said: »
Tell that to the 6k dps PLD, should have been doing 12k, that tried out for my static it was a hard no. My group currently has a lower dps DNC which isn't hurting us too much as the rest of us parse high. There is a lot more to XIV than you think at higher level play.

Edit: actually do you know about stat thresholds in XIV? You can be swapping gear and having points in that sub stat that are doing completely nothing as it lands you in a dead zone of that stat. What do you do then? What if your raid piece has a dead stat that your job doesn't use? Are going to keep using it or are you going to drop 10 ilvls to use a better itemised piece. One of your job abilities gives your next attack 100% crit and direct hit chance do you gear for both still or do you start using gear to increase one and determination?

If its so easy you should have no problem figuring that out?
XIV gear progression is not as deep as you are trying to make it out to be. "Thresholds" are just tiers. If you're unable to make it to a higher tier, then its best to stop right at the cutoff and allocate stats elsewhere.

Also you'd never drop ilvl for substats your main stat is weighed too heavily. And far more than substats in XIV is actually playing your job correctly. Having your substats "off" will be a couple %. Stuff like keeping yourself aligned with buff windows without overcapping resources can be 15-20% or more since everything stacks multiplicatively.

Gearing in XIV is largely brain dead(compared to XI).

Actually playing the game... far less brain dead... It's a completely different focus.
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By Asura.Briko 2021-11-25 13:30:23
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Pandemonium.Zeto said: »
Also you'd never drop ilvl for substats your main stat is weighed too heavily. And far more than substats in XIV is actually playing your job correctly. Having your substats "off" will be a couple %. Stuff like keeping yourself aligned with buff windows without overcapping resources can be 15-20% or more since everything stacks multiplicatively.

Gearing in XIV is largely brain dead(compared to XI).

Actually playing the game... far less brain dead... It's a completely different focus.

One could argue that a pre-determined rotation of skills with zero deviation and the only level of depth within a combat system is managing uptime is pretty brain dead.
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By Phoenix.Capuchin 2021-11-25 13:58:15
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Odin.Foxmulder said: »
More and more often, I see people in Odyssey gear with no augments on them. IDK where you are seeing people with Zitah or Ru'Aun pieces. Maybe someone running around with some Adhemar?

People in Odyssey gear without augments isn't unreasonable at all, it's still relatively new content with a substantial grind to get the segments and NM clears (multiple sets of clears) to the point where you can augment, and then you need to target appropriate NM for the particular piece. If somebody doesn't have a consistent static that goes regularly, not having augments yet doesn't mean they just don't get it.

And keep in mind that the gear is still fantastic even without augments; R0 Odyssey armor is often still BiS over anything other than an augmented version of the same piece. So, very reasonable choice to go with unaugmented gear as a smart gearing decision.

Compare that to like... the player with an obvious mishmash of a couple pieces of Herculean gear with no augments or some random trash (VIT+3 Attack+9 STP+1? Good enough!), maybe a Relic+2 piece or two, a half-augmented Ambuscade cape, maybe some Ambu armor, and some not-quite-right accessories. That person obviously doesn't really understand why they're using the gear they are using. I could see that being one of the people who see "eh, it's all level 119 so this must be close enough".

And while maybe saying Escha-Zitah gear is a bit of an exaggeration for what I see, I do see that guy in the previous paragraph quite a bit.
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 Odin.Creaucent
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By Odin.Creaucent 2021-11-25 14:05:23
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Pandemonium.Zeto said: »
Asura.Briko said: »
Odin.Creaucent said: »
Tell that to the 6k dps PLD, should have been doing 12k, that tried out for my static it was a hard no. My group currently has a lower dps DNC which isn't hurting us too much as the rest of us parse high. There is a lot more to XIV than you think at higher level play.

Edit: actually do you know about stat thresholds in XIV? You can be swapping gear and having points in that sub stat that are doing completely nothing as it lands you in a dead zone of that stat. What do you do then? What if your raid piece has a dead stat that your job doesn't use? Are going to keep using it or are you going to drop 10 ilvls to use a better itemised piece. One of your job abilities gives your next attack 100% crit and direct hit chance do you gear for both still or do you start using gear to increase one and determination?

If its so easy you should have no problem figuring that out?
XIV gear progression is not as deep as you are trying to make it out to be. "Thresholds" are just tiers. If you're unable to make it to a higher tier, then its best to stop right at the cutoff and allocate stats elsewhere.

Also you'd never drop ilvl for substats your main stat is weighed too heavily. And far more than substats in XIV is actually playing your job correctly. Having your substats "off" will be a couple %. Stuff like keeping yourself aligned with buff windows without overcapping resources can be 15-20% or more since everything stacks multiplicatively.

Gearing in XIV is largely brain dead(compared to XI).

Actually playing the game... far less brain dead... It's a completely different focus.

Not quite true at the "drop ilvl for substats" as the substats increases towards the end of the expansion lower ilvl pieces can beat max ilvl. Current RDM has the ilvl520 ring being a small increase over the ilvl530 raid ring as it has spell speed.
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By Leviathan.Hadriel 2021-11-25 14:17:44
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Odin.Creaucent said: »
Not quite true at the drop ilvl for substats as the substats increases towards the end of the expansion lower ilvl pieces can beat max ilvl. Current RDM has the ilvl520 ring being a small increase over the ilvl530 raid ring as it has spell speed.

There is an exception to every rule. 14 ilvl is far more clear to understand than in 11. Nitpicking a very minor clarity issue with 14 system vs the botched implementation on 11 is vastly different.
 Phoenix.Capuchin
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By Phoenix.Capuchin 2021-11-25 14:26:10
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Question about Exemplar Point bonuses...

Rings and other exp+ equipment don't affect it, Corsair's Roll does. OK, we all understand that. Has there been confirmation about whether any of the exp/CP bonus Cheer effects (from Mog Garden monster rearing) do anything?
 Bahamut.Illumin
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By Bahamut.Illumin 2021-11-25 14:59:26
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No. Moghancement: Bounty doesn't, and it explicitly says it only boosts capacity points (i.e. not experience points). Likewise, the cheers explicitly give numbers for experience and capacity points.
 Valefor.Prothescar
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By Valefor.Prothescar 2021-11-25 15:49:29
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It'll prolly end up just like JP did. As the grind gets bigger (I expect 25+ to really start dragging on pretty bad) they'll drip feed more and more items to mitigate the time spent XPing. For example, I expect they'll add a ring during the 20th anni that has an Exemplar Points bonus on it. Then maybe they'll add yet another cape, crafted or otherwise, with a 20/30% boost, etc. etc.
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 Quetzalcoatl.Jakey
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By Quetzalcoatl.Jakey 2021-11-25 16:03:20
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People seem to want ilvl Gear to do a few different things.

I don't think many want more tiered gear. I highly oppose more clear tiers of gear as that just makes it more like every other MMO. Putting together weird and interesting builds is one of my favorite parts of this game.

I do see the argument that malignance and oddy gear (especially sakpata/nyame) already effectively is a higher tier even if it doesn't have higher ilvl and that its a problem it replaces so much all at once and its so much better defensively than anything else we've had by far. The thing about defensive gear is if you end up needing it for a fight and don't have it you just die. If you use this gear on fights you don't need the defense for you might lose the parse but probably still fine as a lot of it is BiS on offensive end in most situations too.

Some want it purely labeled with ilvl past 119 with no actual changes to gear for the purpose of helping people who are really bad at gearing. This certainly could be done as they could just cap the few things effected by ilvl at 119.

The best case scenario for this is if those people who I spent segments on getting bumba clears for actually buy the nyame so they don't die to every gust of wind. It wont really do anything about the people who just full time relic or whatever because it doesn't tell you anything about how they swap their gear for different abilities.

When it comes to judging who to invite for a group I don't really look at ilvl I'd rather invite the just returned player that maybe can learn and use the gear we get them even if we have to carry a bit than the been around for years still just full times relic+3 and hordes everything else we get them.

The main downside I see for changing ilvl labeling is I just don't want to waste such limited time and resources this game has on it plus who knows how the spaghetti code will go. Also there would inevitably be those people who get rid of their not max ilvl gear or worse bug me about how I use gear below new max ilvl not realizing that its still often optimal.

I don't really see current ilvl stuff as a problem what I'm worried about is master level gear which may make whole new tiers of gear again. Seeing that they actually lower the exemplar points you get per kill as you increase master level suggests to me they will continue adding higher lvl apex camps (I think they mentioned they would anyways) and they'll need to add more incentive not to just lvl sync down.
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By SimonSes 2021-11-25 17:35:49
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Quetzalcoatl.Jakey said: »
I don't really see current ilvl stuff as a problem what I'm worried about is master level gear which may make whole new tiers of gear again. Seeing that they actually lower the exemplar points you get per kill as you increase master level suggests to me they will continue adding higher lvl apex camps (I think they mentioned they would anyways) and they'll need to add more incentive not to just lvl sync down.

They could add something like ML3 cape that requires Master level 30 and has +50%EP on it. It doesn't need to be OP gear to make you want EPing on higher Apex instead of syncing down.
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By Asura.Essylt 2021-11-26 00:37:06
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Odin.Creaucent said: »
What if your raid piece has a dead stat that your job doesn't use? Are going to keep using it or are you going to drop 10 ilvls to use a better itemised piece.
The real answer is - you wait 3 months, buy a set that's 10 ilvls higher from the market board and crush w/e you were having problems with easily.
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