June 2020 Version Update

It's not a comparison, it's a they're both problem but this one has priority; aka where the spotlight is "needed first".

Unlimited gil : Unlimited items - "it's the same picture"

At the base level, they accomplish the same goal, just from different sources.

It's very obvious when there are 18 spark bots botting sparks. It's much less obvious when 18 spark bots are killing and selling delve and vagary mats. Simply because you can't see them doing it. (spotlight)

As much bothersome its to farm spark/accolades now, still i prefer investing on my 1$ mules rather than dealing with AH.

The other day i was prospecting what i could farm to sell for good cash. Eschite stones poped in my radar as a multibox i could farm a couple of them pretty fast. And they sell very fast while the supply was near empty.

Then the next day suddenly 12 STACKs pops in the AH. And i just entirely give up this farming.

Till the AH dust settle, i either prefer short but garenteed cash or just dont farm at all as i actually dont need cash, i just feel bad spending. And feel bad selling my ambu rewards.

Oh I'm not saying that its not an issue. Just a very different one. Gil will always be the value system used to assign such value. We won't walk around exchanging Montiot Silverpieces, not everyone has a use for it.

Sparks/Accolades actively change the value of gil, because the bots' goal is to make you purchase more gil. By devaluing it, you have to buy more to gil with cash in order to buy the same in-game item. Yes, the cash value of gil drops- but clearly they make just fine real money with a lowered cash value of gil if you need to spend more in game.

By adding items that are purchased with gil to the economy vs adding gil, you devalue the ITEM. Too much money printed and you end up with a Weimar Republic where prices inflate even just walking from your home to the market. This hurts anyone trying to buy anything, because the system used for exchange has changed value. But adding say an inappropriate number of delve mats to the economy only devalues the delve mats and possibly things crafted with them (the last bit over time, if at all). RMEA currency, Dyna-D shards/voids all don't change at all. Because your GIL is still worth the same.

The affects of the two different abuses are very different. Both need addressed- but one is systematic in its results- the other is very limited.

rip to all returning players seeing this update. me included. I never rmt'd but I use to pull 6-8mil a day with 0 effort(albeit inefficiently) dualboxing to fund my main account. Good times.

What happened now?

nothing new, I was referring literally to the june 2020 update.

I mean, it was causing mass inflation.

Mass inflation was making the prices of everything you buy increase, which means all that gil you were making was worth far less anyway.

It really didn't though. You may or may not notice but gil is currently as cheap as it was during the medal dupes.

Sparks didn't change at all, for the bots, we just have to pay more in subs to get the same gain. Actual players act like deer in headlights so yeah, prices shifted but in reality not much changed.

Square got their cake and ate it too; It looked like they hurt the bots, they actually hurt the players who won't quit, and they increased sub count/revenue. win win freakin win.

Where you finding Gil for under .30; you let me know lol.

So many different issues though with the game. Removing gil from the system isn't all of it. The places where you spend gil is just to stagnant. If it wasn't for bots/RMT it would probably be even worse to be honest. There has been no new crafts, ody was the last place to spend gil for players. Theres probably still people augmenting, but it's not like the worst. Deeds removed the need for SOME gil to be spent on AF/Relic+2.

So much to account for.

Did some people get that low? Never saw it on one specific site below 50 and theres a dozen selling for 60-65 right now

I only measure it based on the (I assume most popular) site being back to where it was

Yeah, I knew people in the mid-high twenties for sure. It is going down, but I think there is just less need for gil right now as you can squeeze buy making enough in game. Most people already have everything. Probably just making weapons to make weapons and stuff. Purely my opinion, I have no hard evidence though. The people that have to keep buying this stuff are the ones getting banned, and coming back or adding accounts to their list. We never learn.

There has been a massive amount of deflation in the economy since the sparks nerf, the prices of everything have near halved and it was directly because of this change. It costs half what it did to make a Mythic, Relic or whatever than before.

It's not even just the mechanics of how much gil is in the economy though, it's also in that buyers are far less willing to throw gil around since it takes more effort to get it.

It's like in real life, if you're living off a trust fund with thousands of £ every week coming into your bank account you're more likely to pay $100 for a bottle of water with a funny sticker on it...cause who cares you'll get another lump of cash next week. if you're not, then you're not gonna do that.

This isn't true at all.

I think it is true if you've been playing the last few years and buying stuff a long the way. Every week is a profit for me between seg farms and dyna. Even if I didn't Dyna these days just seg farms would be profit.

Edit: Oh yea then some people still do Ambu and sell every month.

Not true for me but definitely been taking my sweet time for everything. No point in rushing anymore although that seems to be the MO these days. Gil is still used for practically everything though.

That's not everyone's thought process though. That's the difference between people buying mercs, and paying for clears and and the people willing to wait. Some people have different priorities. I wasn't playing last month, sold off all my Gil. Came back in the first day of the update, I made almost 200m my first week back. Between drops from trove, and segment farming and whatever else I sold. I definitely do not blow my gil though because I have it.

You can actually check me in game, my characters are atrocious. I have 3 song bards, I have like 1-2 AF+3. Instead of pushing to have the best gear, I push myself to see what I can get done with the least amount of spending. So far I have made it to V10 T3 with 3 songs BRD, and Regal neck COR and some trial and errors. All it took was waiting for opportunities to arise to get some specific items I wanted.


I don't disagree, it is used for everything, but which parts are costing you millions per week? Most people should have their main Ody gears by now so scratch that. Non-banned players have AF+3/Relic +3 on their main jobs. They probably also have at LEAST 1 RMEA, be it Aeonic or not; even then Aeonic is the cheapest by far. Which leaves, what exactly? Home point cost got you down? Augments; that's really it, minus what I said. Which is making more RMEA's or opening more jobs just to have more options. I am gonna throw out some completely simple arbitrary numbers of easy gil routines.

Doing everything would be about 12hrs a week. Assuming it takes max given time.

• Ambuscade - ~5m (1-2hrs, once a week)

• Odyssey - ~2m (45min/day, 7 runs)

• Delve - ~2-3m (45min/day, 7 runs)

• Sparks - ~2.5m (1/week, no extra time added)

• Unity - ~1m (1/week, any extra farmed accolades)

Those are all things that sell very daily. They require little work per day, and you can even stack more during free time. Odyssey doesn't even have to be daily. Ambuscade obviously is only good until you run out of materials, and even if you use the mats you saved the gil.
So what is costing more than 12m a week? I'm not arguing you shouldn't spend if you have the gil, just stating that you don't have too. It's all for fun, and in the end it's meaningless.

Having multiple accounts clearly offers some advantages. I have more RNG chances. I also spend 8 times as much another person too; that argument is kind of irrelevant imo.

Well you said it, everyone and their grandma is 6 boxing. A lot of RMEA and now different job compositions are generally necessary for odyssey nms and ambu rotation. Just depends how much time you spend getting Gil.

Yeah, it all just comes down to the grind, and time. Some will, and some won't. Same thing as the paying 100$ for water. Some people save, some people don't. Just chill, play at steady pace, and watch for opportunities. If you have to have something day one, then you have to be willing to pay day one prices. I payed 10m for my Chango clear. Why? For that price why not. I can make the 10m back, and the pops alone are probably 10m. I seriously am a cheap ***.

literally a part time job at this point. I would also assume you do Omen for astrals at 1.2m/30 mins too per day, and lets assume it takes you 0 mins to cap sparks, also got scripted to do all the Unity/sparks trading for you. You would be asking someone who CAN multibox to put in 4 hrs + a day to just make 12-13m/week..... thats 28 hrs of work to make what you could buy for about $7~. Hey if you enjoy it at that price, more power to you.

This is why people buy gil, lots of people can only play 4 hours a WEEK not a day. They would probably never even finish one REMA if they played like this. That is who is buying the gil, and rightfully so at this point.

Deflation which ffxi has suffered due to this and other SE fixes has hurt more the normal playerbase than the rmt. Inflation is a healthy part of a growing ecocnomy, its not bad and having the easy for average play time gil sources was really nice. It ment IF you only had your 4 hrs a week to really play. You could still do a lot more.

I will give a few examples of why during inflation an average joe had it easier. Food crafting cost are relatively fixed as most mats can be got from a vendor, or just buying from the moogle. Same said with nin tools, meds, etc. This now costs a lot more. Upgrades such as af+3 is mostly all based on the vendor prices of the matts. This is now VERY expensive in comparison and a real hurddle for a new player finacially (I know you can get a free set at +2 but it takes a ton of time and most people play multiple jobs). Mars orbs use to be an okay gil source a new player could turn 500k into 3m in matter of minutes to keep em going. Now 1 orb wont even buy ONE af upgrade mat. Take it one step furthur, if they hadnt nuked the sparks/acc then the 1m~ it cost for ody gear would be way less of an impact for a new player too and that is really top notch gear.

You are right, new players have it the worst. I was specifically saying players that already have most stuff done though. I still don't find it to absurd for an average player to want to put in 1-2 hours a week, to make 5m. If you can't/don't want to put that time in then it's obviously just not something you can do. 45 minutes a day does not seem unreasonable though.

I maybe wasn't clear on times though.

My examples only had odyssey, and delve being ones that needed to be done more than once. Unity might take a bit of time too. Most people get the sparks while playing so that doesn't really add to play time. It comes out to be about 7hrs total in a week for everything. That is a lot yeah, but who here spent more than that back in the day hunting HNMs? This game WAS about the grind. It's not meant to be like XIV/WoW.

Also note, I used the maximum times allotted. Most players it wouldn't take nearly that amount of time to accomplish. A couple friends can clear delve in less than 30 now a days with out any thought.

Instead of AFKing for sparks, most have to actually play the game now to get gil. For the average joe, capping sparks each week is more important than ever, because some really need the pocket money for upgrades, and you feel you're missing out if you don't.

And no, not every player "has everything". There are so many still working on reforging AF & Relic, never mind luxury pieces like HQ abjurations and +2 JSE necks. The game has many gil sinks for those who don't have it all, even more so if you are returning. Odyssey gear may be cheaper now, but you're still spending millions for a set of those (and costs more on a small server).

What I'm more annoyed about is that the nerf didn't do enough to combat RMT activity. The bot armies in Ronfaure & Gustberg, on top of the constant yells to sell JP/Mlvl in Dho Gates, keep them as active as ever and more in your face. Some use this service of 20m to get a master 20, because it's a fair deal and they eliminate the grind. I never wanted the new master levels to be just another grind for this reason, because people always find ways to shortcut it. Killing the points in an alliance did very little to combat this practice.

I wont argue anything about returning players. It's not wrong. People who came in late have disadvantages, but this is something common to every game. I am merely pointing towards the aspect that you DONT have to have every item, and every BiS White Border/Blue Border/Gold Border to be satisfied with accomplishing things in game. That's not a need. A returning player doesn't need a Neck +2/SU5. They see guides that tell them they do. Coming in to a game 19 years late, and wanting to catch up to people is like saying you want your birthday to come faster than everyone else. You just can't do it. The game is just as unfair to un-wealthy players as life is to un-wealthy people. Those already on top have advantages.

You can still make gil fairly easy. You just can't expect to catch up to the people who have been doing it for years.


With out changing a huge amount of things, there is nothing they can really do to combat it sadly. It's a lost cause. As long as people will pay, they will be there.

When you guys says seg farm, its the cash generated by killing fodders in odyssey?

Has it become profitable after last updates? I remember back then people were just worried about scales, and leaving alone the exit part.

Btw, this escalated quickly

You get million(s) at the end based on the kills you got

I'm in bed sick, and bored. :rolls eyes:
Just trying to keep myself occupied. :D

ya. you touch the final conflux and you get 25% of the segments you farmed added as a bonus on top. you also get the gil from mob kills. my team averages 800-900k each per farm. it's pretty good for 30 mins of work.

Totally agreed. Large amounts of gil are only really required for some big ticket items, RMEA/Su5 weapons (and their augments) being the big ones. Maybe some UNM armor augments (which more casual players can work on by farming their own Lustreless stuff), +2 necks (but +1 is much more affordable and is certainly fine for more casual players), maybe a few Su3 or Abjuration (cursed items) armors (but the NQs are very affordable).

Odyssey armor? You'll get enough gil from just farming segments to afford the gear (and then once you've purchased it, that's just free daily money).

AF/Relic armor crafting materials? Again, should be able to afford that easily just by doing the connected events. Omen farming is profitable enough to pay for your AF stuff, Dyna will pay for your relic crafting items (if you don't just go do Delve/Vagary).

Ambuscade provides good weapons for just the cost of your time doing the event, and gil/items for making RMEAs. High Tiers are "free" gear other than the time cost of getting merits (but can just... do em when you fill up naturally).

If you need white boxes on all your gear and a double digit number of RMEAs, yeah you're gonna pay more. But you're probably earning way more too. Any average player doing ANYTHING in-game is getting enough spending money through sparks and normal gameplay to FAR more than handle your minor expenditures like... what, food and minor consumables?

More likely, a player can really gear a couple jobs VERY well without a gigantic budget. Including making a RMEA or two with some time of doing Ambu or Omen or something to fund that. They just might not be able to gear 10 jobs that well.

FFXI is one of the few mmorpgs that has a very complicated economy and where near everything is interconnected, I don't think any developer would make a game like this ever again. It's too much of a headache to keep the economy balanced and too attractive for RMT.

Gold/gil is far less important on other games and is just for side projects like mounts or housing, you can play most games and be near penniless just fine.

On FFXI it's everything, making a single REMA is hundreds of millions alone and that's a lot of work to make that gil.

Also, it's heavily based on supply and demand. So you can make a lot of gil easily doing something, then if others find out in too large of numbers you will quickly goto making a lot less or being unable to sell your stuff.

Even something like Ody farming gil, if too many start doing it...guess what they will do? Reduce the amount.

That is just the nature of the beast. Imagine how the people who made relics back in like 2006 feel about things now. :D