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Merc Culture Discussion
By fonewear 2019-04-06 09:31:44
If mercing is not appropriate behavior under the terms of this game, they can ban me. It's not a secret and SE could even make a post like "hey we consider selling top tier boss drops bad form and against the spirit of the game"
Until then, *** outta herr
do you need someone to officialy tell you ***smells?
mercing obviously hurts the game. the buyer is no more interested to grind content and is more likely to quit sooner once he got his shot of instant gratification. those that refuse to pay mercs and want to do content the way its intended have more difficulty to find party members.
no good situation for a game like FFXI with a already small population.
Mercing is arguably the easiest way to make gil on Asura. Tons of noobs and newer/lazy players. And tons of gil looking to be spent. It just makes sense.
I would think time is way more valuable than grinding out random stones for hours to get your glowy weapon.
But to each their own.
Also you are forgetting a large population of Asura would never be able to get an aeonic weapon. Cause they lack the jobs required. Don't have a linkshell that can do the content. Or are just *** stupid. Maybe all three !
The only thing mercing really destroys is the reason to create and end game LS.
You can skip all the drama the "you must be here at 9 PM or you will be shot" nonsense. You give the merc some gil get what you want and move on.
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 Leviathan.Andret
Server: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1000
By Leviathan.Andret 2019-04-06 09:42:16
Merc ads:
"When you realize you have spent 2 hours shouting in town so you can party with 5 idiots"
By lhova 2019-04-06 14:48:49
I’ll add my 2 cents. I don’t have an issue with mercing and I’ve been able to merc some Ambu VD which helped me get some items I needed. I guess my concern is that people on asura rarely want to do anything without mercing.
A group use to shout a monthly Vagary free run to get people clears but I don’t see that anymore. Now all I see is merc Vagary, EF CP points for sale and even mercing plasm when people would beg you and give you free plasm just so they could have the 3 peeps to enter.
One of the main reasons I came to Asura was that people genuinely helped, now it just seems like everyone wants to shout to prove how smart they are and soon I can see a day when people will merc strategy information for cleats.
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 Asura.Eiryl
By Asura.Eiryl 2019-04-06 14:50:13
It's hard to believe that assura got worse. But there it is, Accurate.
By fonewear 2019-04-06 14:52:18
I saw a guy wanting 2M for a Delve clear...Delve...was either incredibly stupid or the best troll of all time.
By mhomho 2019-04-06 15:22:37
God I remember when they were 30 and tsuru was good.
Carbuncle.Yottaxa
Server: Carbuncle
Game: FFXI
Posts: 11
By Carbuncle.Yottaxa 2019-04-06 21:43:34
My two cents:
To some extent isn’t this the logical outworking of adding mechanics like trusts? They were added because the game has turned into a solo-quest style of play. These were added to keep subscriptions but without fostering players to actually interact and team up. When you max out what you can do solo, who wants to struggle to get into a v1 E or N when you can just pay for a 20 second fight with double or triple the rewards? Returning players with real jobs in real life don't have the time to grind 2100 jp and the need for a decent starter high accuracy gear almost forces the hand in a solo quest game, or whats left of it.
By kishr 2019-04-07 05:25:59
This discussion should be already over with.
If you don't care someone mercs, then w/e, shouldn't care anyways,
But others that want to shame them, forget about their idealogy, and just realize they need to take a walk out and breath fresh air for once.
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 Quetzalcoatl.Chanceikin
Server: Quetzalcoatl
Game: FFXI
Posts: 138
By Quetzalcoatl.Chanceikin 2019-04-07 07:42:17
I’ll add my 2 cents. I don’t have an issue with mercing and I’ve been able to merc some Ambu VD which helped me get some items I needed. I guess my concern is that people on asura rarely want to do anything without mercing.
A group use to shout a monthly Vagary free run to get people clears but I don’t see that anymore. Now all I see is merc Vagary, EF CP points for sale and even mercing plasm when people would beg you and give you free plasm just so they could have the 3 peeps to enter.
One of the main reasons I came to Asura was that people genuinely helped, now it just seems like everyone wants to shout to prove how smart they are and soon I can see a day when people will merc strategy information for cleats.
You went to Asura for help? Thats like going to taco bell to eat healthy. I left in 2012ish and people would charge you Gil for a raise.
Server: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6052
By Leviathan.Comeatmebro 2019-04-07 11:37:13
That had absolutely no relevance to the topic, and served no purpose besides you trying to convince yourself that buying asian hookers makes you cool.
By fonewear 2019-04-07 12:49:08
Maybe by page nine we can finally decide if merc culture is a good or bad thing...keep posting !
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Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 22
By Asura.Grievance 2019-04-07 14:00:29
Leviathan.Comeatmebro said: »That had absolutely no relevance to the topic, and served no purpose besides you trying to convince yourself that buying asian hookers makes you cool. So Asian hookers don't make you cool?
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By Shichishito 2019-04-07 14:42:22
Carbuncle.Yottaxa said: »Returning players with real jobs in real life don't have the time to grind 2100 jp and the need for a decent starter high accuracy gear almost forces the hand in a solo quest game, or whats left of it.
that "i have a job/i have family/little time" argument is moot. you finaly have a life, good for you, be happy about it.
now go find a new hobby that fits your schedule!
Ragnarok.Lockfort
Server: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 251
By Ragnarok.Lockfort 2019-04-07 14:53:06
You heard him folks, some random on the internet said it, so its true. Shows over, everyone with a real job and real life don't belong here.
lol
 Cerberus.Kylos
Server: Cerberus
Game: FFXI
Posts: 4304
By Cerberus.Kylos 2019-04-07 14:57:27
Again this is another Asura problem. Like on Cerb, we do have a few merc groups, but they're not in your face yelling their services every single day. Players know who to turn to if they want it, but are not being charged ridiculous prices for frivolous content.
I concur with another poster when they say mercing on smaller servers is slightly "taboo", as we prefer (or need) to band together to get things done. We don't look down on anyone who mercs, but the way we play the game is likely different to those on the giant server who want an easy ride (going afk after paying someone off).
Server: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3753
By Leviathan.Celebrindal 2019-04-07 14:58:24
Carbuncle.Yottaxa said: »Returning players with real jobs in real life don't have the time to grind 2100 jp and the need for a decent starter high accuracy gear almost forces the hand in a solo quest game, or whats left of it.
Its almost like they changed the mobs you're paying for merc services to kill because there just couldn't be any way that we were killing them without Su3 gear, AF+3, Relic+3, dyna-d necks and weapons, R15 RMEAs, and already having all the herc/adhemar/valorous already with killer augments...I mean, they musta, right? Otherwise, how were groups without SMNs getting aeonics 3 and a half years ago?
By fonewear 2019-04-07 15:08:27
We are making progress keep posting we will settle this merc discussion once and for all !
By mhomho 2019-04-07 15:59:45
Leviathan.Celebrindal said: »Carbuncle.Yottaxa said: »Returning players with real jobs in real life don't have the time to grind 2100 jp and the need for a decent starter high accuracy gear almost forces the hand in a solo quest game, or whats left of it.
Its almost like they changed the mobs you're paying for merc services to kill because there just couldn't be any way that we were killing them without Su3 gear, AF+3, Relic+3, dyna-d necks and weapons, R15 RMEAs, and already having all the herc/adhemar/valorous already with killer augments...I mean, they musta, right? Otherwise, how were groups without SMNs getting aeonics 3 and a half years ago?
TECHNICALLY
They did change things: like how Geo bubbles function.
They also changed how AGI and evasion is calculated.
It's not that there aren't strategies that worked, but some of them are out dated. Some by means of updates, and others by loss of players (the concept of missing the boat effectively condemning you because you weren't around for release). The things you listed are there to help make the progression easier. It's like the person that collects all the items before going to fight the final boss. It might not feel as satisfying to some to just one shot Emerald Weapon a'la Knights of the Round, but to each their own.
By Shichishito 2019-04-07 16:09:08
Ragnarok.Lockfort said: »You heard him folks, some random on the internet said it, so its true. Shows over, everyone with a real job and real life don't belong here.
if you want to spend the little free time you are left with on FFXI fine but don't cheat your way to the finish line and ruin the game for everyone else in the process.
By mhomho 2019-04-07 16:20:02
ruin the game for everyone else in the process.
Except it doesn't. If it ruins it for you, then you have some much larger psycho-sociological problems to deal with. It's no better than the zoomers addicted to social media that wonder why they're depressed and anxious.
By fonewear 2019-04-08 10:52:37
Maybe we can hire a mercenary for better FFXIAH threads.
One's that don't revolve around Asura good/ Asura sucks.
Merc good/bad says some guy I don't know on the internet.
I'm elite I'm elite. Come fight me bro !
By mhomho 2019-04-08 10:59:36
>>Leviathan.Comeatmebro
FTFY
By eliroo 2019-04-08 11:02:11
Quetzalcoatl.Chanceikin said: »I’ll add my 2 cents. I don’t have an issue with mercing and I’ve been able to merc some Ambu VD which helped me get some items I needed. I guess my concern is that people on asura rarely want to do anything without mercing.
A group use to shout a monthly Vagary free run to get people clears but I don’t see that anymore. Now all I see is merc Vagary, EF CP points for sale and even mercing plasm when people would beg you and give you free plasm just so they could have the 3 peeps to enter.
One of the main reasons I came to Asura was that people genuinely helped, now it just seems like everyone wants to shout to prove how smart they are and soon I can see a day when people will merc strategy information for cleats.
You went to Asura for help? Thats like going to taco bell to eat healthy. I left in 2012ish and people would charge you Gil for a raise.
I'd like to point out that Taco bell has one of the healthiest menus when compared to other fast food places.
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Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 414
By Asura.Reichleiu 2019-04-08 11:36:49
Quetzalcoatl.Chanceikin said: »I’ll add my 2 cents. I don’t have an issue with mercing and I’ve been able to merc some Ambu VD which helped me get some items I needed. I guess my concern is that people on asura rarely want to do anything without mercing.
A group use to shout a monthly Vagary free run to get people clears but I don’t see that anymore. Now all I see is merc Vagary, EF CP points for sale and even mercing plasm when people would beg you and give you free plasm just so they could have the 3 peeps to enter.
One of the main reasons I came to Asura was that people genuinely helped, now it just seems like everyone wants to shout to prove how smart they are and soon I can see a day when people will merc strategy information for cleats.
You went to Asura for help? Thats like going to taco bell to eat healthy. I left in 2012ish and people would charge you Gil for a raise.
I'd like to point out that Taco bell has one of the healthiest menus when compared to other fast food places.
They also have the cleanest restrooms.. believe it or not
By soralin 2019-04-08 12:32:26
Maybe we can hire a mercenary for better FFXIAH threads.
One's that don't revolve around Asura good/ Asura sucks.
Merc good/bad says some guy I don't know on the internet.
I'm elite I'm elite. Come fight me bro ! To begin, I don't dislike it, I don't think its inherently 'bad' or 'wrong' for the culture to exist.
I'm just interested in discussing the 'why' from a purely objective standpoint.
Lets get back on topic then please :)
By soralin 2019-04-08 12:35:21
I’ll add my 2 cents. I don’t have an issue with mercing and I’ve been able to merc some Ambu VD which helped me get some items I needed. I guess my concern is that people on asura rarely want to do anything without mercing.
A group use to shout a monthly Vagary free run to get people clears but I don’t see that anymore. Now all I see is merc Vagary, EF CP points for sale and even mercing plasm when people would beg you and give you free plasm just so they could have the 3 peeps to enter.
One of the main reasons I came to Asura was that people genuinely helped, now it just seems like everyone wants to shout to prove how smart they are and soon I can see a day when people will merc strategy information for cleats.
Theres a couple streamers, myself included, looking to try and foster this ideology better.
Ive been debating starting a non-merc, helping people out LS with the goal of assisting new players get their clears easily, and acting as a mentor LS of sorts.
However, running that LS and my stream at the same time sounds quite involved, so I haven't committed to that... yet. It's kind of on the table though.
Asura.Shiraj
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1030
By Asura.Shiraj 2019-04-08 12:39:19
Helping people doesn't work anymore dude. You help them once you will be hounded none stop. It's why i've stopped helping people. People will depend on you, expect you to carry them.
Some people are grateful for any help though, it's not just everyone.
Also for helping newer players clear content I find it almost impossible anymore. I mention a strat that's not smn burn i get shat on and pushed aside. It's just how it is on Asura man. I've given up on helping most people cos of it. No one wants to experiment, try new things and have fun. Just rush for rema and get their shinies thinking it's gonna help them.
By soralin 2019-04-08 12:41:13
Helping people doesn't work anymore dude. You help them once you will be hounded none stop. It's why i've stopped helping people. People will depend on you, expect you to carry them.
Some people are grateful for any help though, it's not just everyone.
Also for helping newer players clear content I find it almost impossible anymore. I mention a strat that's not smn burn i get shat on and pushed aside. It's just how it is on Asura man. I've given up on helping most people cos of it. No one wants to experiment, try new things and have fun. Just rush for rema and get their shinies thinking it's gonna help them.
Well.
I think trying out different strats is fun :)
So maybe we can be friends and try it out together.
Not trolling, serious offer. If there's peeps out there on Asura wanting to actually have fun in the game, you are always welcome to send me a tell in game if you need help or have questions.
Server: Excalibur
Game: FFXIV
Posts: 3176
By Nadleeh Sakurai 2019-04-08 12:42:56
So, to preface, Im interested in a serious discussion regarding the general culture around Mercing and its prevalence now on some servers, especially Asura of course.
To begin, I don't dislike it, I don't think its inherently 'bad' or 'wrong' for the culture to exist.
I'm just interested in discussing the 'why' from a purely objective standpoint. Mostly I just think its a neat phenomena that has occurred and it's just a cool thing that has happened. Culture shifting that is, and I'd like to hear peoples thoughts on it.
To begin, the main facts as I see it.
1. Mercing never used to be this prevalent during the 75 era. You got occasional shouts, but for the most part the only items that ever really got merc'd were Dynamis drops (I recall Rdm hat and Thf gloves being popular merc items from large shells) and stuff like D Ring of course.
2. At some point, through a contextual shift, merc'ing has surged over the years to become the majority of shouts, especially on Asura. Some kind of factors probably combined together to breed this cultural phenomena, and I'm curious about peoples thoughts on it.
So, to begin, here are what I consider the primary influences that created the right mix to breed such a culture.
First off, Teleporting is a million times easier. Warp ring, HP/Book/Etc warps make it incredibly easy to get from Point A to Point B. Before in the 75 era, this was substantially more difficult, and it was unlikely you could run to a specific zone in time to lot a drop before the timer was up.
Second, community upkeep of Wiki info, particularly the strats on Discussion pages, have become almost entirely empty. This is pretty critical, as newer players heavily rely on this info to quickly and easily figure out party comps to put together to take down fights. Remember, not everyone has R15 REMA jobs!
Before I recall days where end game NMs would have entire pages of groups all posting their various party/alliance comps to take down NMs. This just isn't really a thing now for most fights.
Furthermore, many wiki pages for new NMs meta-refer to mechanics in a way that seasoned players may instantly understand, but new players will have to go look up elsewhere. IE "Uses the usual NM Moves of <species>" might be a common thing to see, without any further clarification on what that actually entails. Its expected of the reader to then go to the species page and look up each move on the list.
Whereas for seasoned vets, they will remember which of those moves is the crippling one that needs to be managed. So both these points combined adds a barrier of entry to newer/returning players that didn't exist in the past.
I think this is interesting too, because I'd say now more than ever the gearing barrier of entry is smaller than ever before. Gear has become so incredibly easy to obtain and the gap between "Best in slot" and "Second best in slot" has never been smaller either, especially with the introduction of Ambu weapons.
I'm curious to hear your thoughts on this topic! I think it's really neat how much culture can exist in something as abstract as an MMO, and its a topic I love to hear people's take on!
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