The 6th Ministry's Secret: A Summoner's Guide (v2)

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The 6th Ministry's Secret: A Summoner's Guide (v2)
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By Pantafernando 2020-02-12 16:02:04
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When you multibox, its a good strat is having all chars about the same level in terms of stats/progress. Saves time in the future and maximize your profits.

For example, all myhic pre reqs are done same trip with main, just the alex being the extra effort. What is the lesser of the problems in my opinion.
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By SimonSes 2020-02-12 16:57:26
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Phoenix.Miraun said: »
Strangely, Hysteric Assault isn't showing up in my chat log. No filters, and don't see anything in battle mod that would be filtering it? Anyone have any ideas?
Code
<other_pets>
        <!-- He's targeting someone else's pet -->
            <damage>false</damage>   <!-- Prevents your damage from appearing -->


Not sure why, but this was set to true for me and it was also what was blocking the Hysteric Assault to appear. That's in battlemod ofc (filters.xml)
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By Draylo 2020-02-12 18:21:10
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Pantafernando said: »
When you multibox, its a good strat is having all chars about the same level in terms of stats/progress. Saves time in the future and maximize your profits.

For example, all myhic pre reqs are done same trip with main, just the alex being the extra effort. What is the lesser of the problems in my opinion.

Yeah but sometimes its annoying so I get lazy and just do it on one. It was a drag trying to do the title clears, and apparently they have to be alive when a chariot dies, so when youre charmed and slaughter the naked party its not good.
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By Crossbones 2020-02-12 18:39:21
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I'm not going to have a chance to test this for a bit so I was wondering if anyone knew precisely what type of favor siren has. Is it SB or SBII or is it it's own unique type of SB?
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By Pantafernando 2020-02-12 19:19:10
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Draylo said: »
Pantafernando said: »
When you multibox, its a good strat is having all chars about the same level in terms of stats/progress. Saves time in the future and maximize your profits.

For example, all myhic pre reqs are done same trip with main, just the alex being the extra effort. What is the lesser of the problems in my opinion.

Yeah but sometimes its annoying so I get lazy and just do it on one. It was a drag trying to do the title clears, and apparently they have to be alive when a chariot dies, so when youre charmed and slaughter the naked party its not good.

If you mean chariot for mythic trial, you can stay dead and get win. Happened with me recently, got 2 mules dead still they got the win.
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By Draylo 2020-02-12 23:18:28
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Mine didn't get the title though, don't you need it?
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By kishr 2020-02-13 00:07:37
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Asura.Botosi said: »
How necessary is Nirvana for SMN? It seems like SE just doesn't want to nerf SMN so I'm thinking of gearing it up on a mule.

Would a non-Nirvana SMN be useful at all?
If you don't care just replace nirv with a Was or Was+1 from AH for physical then magical with a grio from reisen t2 hydra.

Before I got my nirv I was beating bandwagon nirvs with my Was+1

Also, fixed post for Lua code from ' to ", so Recopy and paste if you get issue.
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By Pantafernando 2020-02-13 01:28:03
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Draylo said: »
Mine didn't get the title though, don't you need it?

Maybe they died at entrance and you fought chariot in its place? You do need to stay in exp range.
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By Asura.Sechs 2020-02-13 01:57:01
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Asura.Botosi said: »
How necessary is Nirvana for SMN?
Would a non-Nirvana SMN be useful at all?
Unpopular opinion but imho not necessary.

It's actually overestimated by a lot of people who don't fully understand how SMN works, or rather, they use Nirvana as the way to tell wether a SMN is valid or not, ignoring it doesn't work like a weapon for a DD.


My opinion more in detail:
For SMN you have several different types of Blood Pacts. Let's see how Nirvana does in most of them:


Buff BP => Not the best
Magic BP => Not the best (technically on stuff where you lack macc, R15 Nirvana could become BiS though)
Debuff BP => Pre R15 it wasn't the best but with the R15 bonus it probably is BiS again. (wouldn't call these BPs particularly relevant though)
Flaming Crush => Nirvana is quite clearly ahead of anything else, even at R0
FTP carry Physical BPs => Nirvana can be (not necessarily though) slightly ahead, but barely, this alone wouldn't justify the hundreds of milliosn of gil difference

From this you might wonder where the Nirvana's true potential is.
Well, it's in the AM3.
Once you activate AM3 the difference between Nirvana (even R0) and other options for FTP Carrying Physical BPs becomes huge.

Thing is:
1) This means "locking" your MH, reducing your freedom for other BPs and other stuff (precast, cpot etc)
2) You can't realistically make use of AM3 on every fight


Which leads us back to the conclusion that for fights where you can't put AM3 up, Nirvana makes a noticeable difference only for Flaming Crush.
So yeah, you can be a pretty reliable, useful and nice SMN even without Nirvana.
If you read through these boards you'll hear quite often of non Nirvana SMNs beating Nirvana ones in parses, and now you know why. Because Nirvana alone doesn't really mean that much in most situations, yet people "require" Nirvana when they shout for SMNs, lulz, but that's just ignorance imho.
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By Asura.Sechs 2020-02-13 01:59:36
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I forgot to add "non FTP carrying physical BPs" in the list, but those are pretty much completely irrelevant so who cares.
Think Nirvana wins there in theory but again, you're nerver gonna use them.

FTP carry ones and Flaming Crush are the relevant BPs that you're gonna use most of the time.
The rest has a secondary use and non FTP Phys BPs are almost useless in current meta.




Btw change of topic. I remember reading an explanation from Papesse about the new Magical Shield granted by Siren.
I can't find it anymore now though.
How does it work? I mean not the fact that it's calculated on Siren's stats instead of the SMN's, I just want to know how much it can absorb, if it's just magical damage or even physical etc.
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By kishr 2020-02-13 02:21:05
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Did mine on bst ages back, ask a bst or pup or smn friend to join save you trouble.
A 10min /yell will save you a headache.
I'm sure there is someone bored enough to help.
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By SimonSes 2020-02-13 04:18:17
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How are you dying in salvage XD
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By Asura.Sechs 2020-02-13 04:21:48
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SimonSes said: »
How are you dying in salvage XD
I think they're talking about the chariot that does 4,4k needles and is required (?) for Nirvana trials.
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By SimonSes 2020-02-13 04:25:03
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Asura.Sechs said: »
SimonSes said: »
How are you dying in salvage XD
I think they're talking about the chariot that does 4,4k needles and is required (?) for Nirvana trials.

I think they were talking about chariot who charms and they killing their mules with main, but that chariot shouldnt be able to even do the charm before its dead and afaik its also super easy to resist that charm with meva gear we have now.
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By Draylo 2020-02-13 04:49:31
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Didn't resist, and yes it charmed one and killed everyone that was naked but the ones dead didn't get the title. They were all standing together. Also didn't complete the ROE while it was set, due to death.
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By Draylo 2020-02-13 05:11:48
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lol do people really think Salvage is hard or just being annoying? Charm and naked mules = death, who thought it would have gone off. It isn't even the topic, we were talking about the mythic clear, and not getting a title if you die.
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By Asura.Cicion 2020-02-13 07:22:39
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Was i asleep at the wheel somewhere. I was always under the assumption a auged grio was better then nirvana for Flaming Crush.
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By Asura.Sechs 2020-02-13 07:51:32
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Depends on the augs on the Grio, depends on how much mab/BPD you have in the other slots.
Perg's calculator can help but I think in general R15 Nirvana is ahead of any other option.
Second best being a godly Grio or, I dunno, maybe a Was+1? Not sure how well Was+1 would do honestly.
All of this assuming to have Malaise and Frailty down on the target.
But if you don't I'm not even sure you should bother with FCrush and just rely on other options, I think?

AM3 is of course almost irrelevant on Flaming Crush.
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By Wotasu 2020-02-13 11:13:40
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Even R0 Nirvana outparse any other Staff for Flaming Crush, +40BP is a huge boost.
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By Asura.Pergatory 2020-02-13 11:37:15
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My calculators are actually useless for Flaming Crush, because it's a hybrid BP. But short answer, Wotasu is right. Nirvana is far and above better than anything for it.

In fact, for a SMN who has a Gridarvor and a well-augmented Grioavolr, Flaming Crush is probably the BP that will benefit the most from obtaining a Nirvana.

If you want to see the difference, try comparing a Nirvana Flaming against any other weapon on a target like Ark Angel GK in Escha Ru'Aun (who is fairly resistant to magic). The difference should be obvious. With bubbles & rolls, Nirvana can consistently hit 60-70k on him.
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By Asura.Sechs 2020-02-13 12:17:51
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That confirms what I always believed. Kinda reflects what I personally experienced parsing agsinst competent nirvana smns. I've often ended up close or even above them in non-am3 phys BP situations, but not even close when we were using fcrush.

You guys have anything to correct in what I wrote above? Think mine is a pretty unbiased opinion in this specific circumstance.
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By Crossbones 2020-02-13 12:23:09
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You don't need to make a nirvana as long as you don't care about taking advantage of your hardest hitting BP or AM3 on ftp transfer BPs.
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By Bahamut.Empyrean 2020-02-13 13:26:13
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kishr said: »
Siren Updated Code for Lua
Code
bp_physical=S{  'Welt','Roundhouse','Hysteric Assault','Punch','Rock Throw','Barracuda Dive','Claw','Axe Kick','Shock Strike','Camisado','Regal Scratch','Poison Nails',
 
                'Moonlit Charge','Crescent Fang','Rock Buster','Tail Whip','Double Punch','Megalith Throw','Double Slap','Eclipse Bite',
                'Mountain Buster','Spinning Dive','Predator Claws','Rush','Chaotic Strike','Crag Throw','Volt Strike'}
 
bp_hybrid=S{    'Burning Strike','Flaming Crush'}
 
bp_magical=S{   'Sonic Buffet','Tornado II','Clarsach Call','Inferno','Earthen Fury','Tidal Wave','Aerial Blast','Diamond Dust','Judgment Bolt','Searing Light','Howling Moon',
                'Ruinous Omen','Fire II','Stone II','Water II','Aero II','Blizzard II','Thunder II','Thunderspark','Somnolence',
                'Meteorite','Fire IV','Stone IV','Water IV','Aero IV','Blizzard IV','Thunder IV','Nether Blast','Meteor Strike',
                'Geocrush','Grand Fall','Wind Blade','Heavenly Strike','Thunderstorm','Level ? Holy','Holy Mist','Lunar Bay',
                'Night Terror','Conflagration Strike', 'Zantetsuken'}
                 
bp_debuff=S{    'Biter Elegy','Lunatic Voice','Lunar Cry','Mewing Lullaby','Nightmare','Lunar Roar','Slowga','Ultimate Terror','Sleepga','Eerie Eye','Tidal Roar',
                'Diamond Storm','Shock Squall','Pavor Nocturnus'}
                 
bp_buff=S{      "Wind's Blessing",'Chinook','Katabatic Blades','Shining Ruby','Frost Armor','Rolling Thunder','Crimson Howl','Lightning Armor','Ecliptic Growl','Hastega','Noctoshield',
                'Ecliptic Howl','Dream Shroud','Earthen Armor','Fleet Wind','Inferno Howl','Soothing Ruby','Heavenward Howl',
                'Soothing Current','Hastega II','Crystal Blessing'}
 
bp_other=S{     'Healing Ruby','Raise II','Aerial Armor','Reraise II','Whispering Wind','Glittering Ruby','Earthen Ward','Spring Water','Healing Ruby II'} 
 
AvatarList=S{   'Siren','Shiva','Ramuh','Garuda','Leviathan','Diabolos','Titan','Fenrir','Ifrit','Carbuncle','Fire Spirit','Air Spirit','Ice Spirit',
                'Thunder Spirit','Light Spirit','Dark Spirit','Earth Spirit','Water Spirit','Cait Sith','Alexander','Odin','Atomos'}
                 
spirit_element={Fire='Fire Spirit',Earth='Earth Spirit',Water='Water Spirit',Wind='Air Spirit',Ice='Ice Spirit',Lightning='Thunder Spirit',
                Light='Light Spirit',Dark='Dark Spirit'}spirit_conflict={Fire='Ice',Earth='Lightning',Water='Fire',Wind='Earth',Ice='Wind',
                Lightning='Water',Light='Dark',Dark='Light'


Heres her new Abils and SMN added to the Lua, logout and update Windower.

Edit: fixed the code because of wind's, recopy and paste.

This go in the motes mappings? or the gearswap itselt? I am on the hunt for a smn gearswap so this is new to me. Last I played smn was 75 cap
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By Cerberus.Auspice 2020-02-13 14:40:38
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For those using Kinematic's lua; I've updated Siren's BPs into the job setup portion. As for the base durations of the buffs; Wind's Blessing has base duration of 60 seconds, Katabatic Blades base is 180, and Chinook appears to be a flat 15 minutes.
Code
    spirits = S{"LightSpirit", "DarkSpirit", "FireSpirit", "EarthSpirit", "WaterSpirit", "AirSpirit", "IceSpirit", "ThunderSpirit"}
    avatars = S{"Carbuncle", "Fenrir", "Diabolos", "Ifrit", "Titan", "Leviathan", "Garuda", "Shiva", "Ramuh", "Odin", "Alexander", "Cait Sith", "Siren"}

    magicalRagePacts = S{
        'Inferno','Earthen Fury','Tidal Wave','Aerial Blast','Diamond Dust','Judgment Bolt','Searing Light','Howling Moon','Ruinous Omen',
        'Fire II','Stone II','Water II','Aero II','Blizzard II','Thunder II',
        'Fire IV','Stone IV','Water IV','Aero IV','Blizzard IV','Thunder IV',
        'Thunderspark','Meteorite','Nether Blast',
        'Holy Mist','Lunar Bay','Night Terror','Level ? Holy',
		'Sonic Buffet','Tornado II','Clarsach Call'}

	hybridPacts = S{
		'Burning Strike','Flaming Crush',
	}	
		
    enticersRagePacts = S{
        'Impact','Heavenly Strike','Wind Blade','Geocrush','Thunderstorm','Meteor Strike','Grand Fall'
    }
    enticersWardPacts = S{
        'Healing Ruby II','Whispering Wind','Healing Ruby','Spring Water'
    }		

    pacts = {}
    pacts.cure = {['Carbuncle']='Healing Ruby'}
    pacts.curaga = {['Carbuncle']='Healing Ruby II', ['Garuda']='Whispering Wind', ['Leviathan']='Spring Water'}
    pacts.buffoffense = {['Carbuncle']='Glittering Ruby', ['Ifrit']='Crimson Howl', ['Garuda']='Hastega', ['Ramuh']='Rolling Thunder',
        ['Fenrir']='Ecliptic Growl', ['Siren']='Katabatic Blades'}
    pacts.buffdefense = {['Carbuncle']='Shining Ruby', ['Shiva']='Frost Armor', ['Garuda']='Aerial Armor', ['Titan']='Earthen Ward',
        ['Ramuh']='Lightning Armor', ['Fenrir']='Ecliptic Howl', ['Diabolos']='Noctoshield', ['Cait Sith']='Reraise II', ['Siren']="Wind's Blessing"}
    pacts.buffspecial = {['Ifrit']='Inferno Howl', ['Garuda']='Fleet Wind', ['Titan']='Earthen Armor', ['Diabolos']='Dream Shroud',
        ['Carbuncle']='Soothing Ruby', ['Fenrir']='Heavenward Howl', ['Cait Sith']='Raise II', ['Siren']='Chinook'}
    pacts.debuff1 = {['Shiva']='Diamond Storm', ['Ramuh']='Shock Squall', ['Leviathan']='Tidal Roar', ['Fenrir']='Lunar Cry',
        ['Diabolos']='Pavor Nocturnus', ['Cait Sith']='Eerie Eye', ['Siren']='Lunatic Voice'}
    pacts.debuff2 = {['Shiva']='Sleepga', ['Leviathan']='Slowga', ['Fenrir']='Lunar Roar', ['Diabolos']='Somnolence', ['Siren']='Bitter Elegy'}
    pacts.sleep = {['Shiva']='Sleepga', ['Diabolos']='Nightmare', ['Cait Sith']='Mewing Lullaby'}
    pacts.nuke2 = {['Ifrit']='Fire II', ['Shiva']='Blizzard II', ['Garuda']='Aero II', ['Titan']='Stone II',
        ['Ramuh']='Thunder II', ['Leviathan']='Water II', ['Siren']='Sonic Buffet'}
    pacts.nuke4 = {['Ifrit']='Fire IV', ['Shiva']='Blizzard IV', ['Garuda']='Aero IV', ['Titan']='Stone IV',
        ['Ramuh']='Thunder IV', ['Leviathan']='Water IV', ['Fenrir']='Impact', ['Siren']='Tornado II'}
    pacts.bp70 = {['Ifrit']='Flaming Crush', ['Shiva']='Rush', ['Garuda']='Predator Claws', ['Titan']='Mountain Buster',
        ['Ramuh']='Chaotic Strike', ['Leviathan']='Spinning Dive', ['Carbuncle']='Meteorite', ['Fenrir']='Eclipse Bite',
        ['Diabolos']='Nether Blast',['Cait Sith']='Regal Scratch', ['Siren']='Hysteric Assault'}
    pacts.bp75 = {['Ifrit']='Meteor Strike', ['Shiva']='Heavenly Strike', ['Garuda']='Wind Blade', ['Titan']='Geocrush',
        ['Ramuh']='Thunderstorm', ['Leviathan']='Grand Fall', ['Carbuncle']='Holy Mist', ['Fenrir']='Lunar Bay',
        ['Diabolos']='Night Terror', ['Cait Sith']='Level ? Holy'}
    pacts.astralflow = {['Ifrit']='Inferno', ['Shiva']='Diamond Dust', ['Garuda']='Aerial Blast', ['Titan']='Earthen Fury',
        ['Ramuh']='Judgment Bolt', ['Leviathan']='Tidal Wave', ['Carbuncle']='Searing Light', ['Fenrir']='Howling Moon',
        ['Diabolos']='Ruinous Omen', ['Cait Sith']="Altana's Favor", ['Siren']='Clarsach Call'}


EDIT: Fixed boneheaded typo
 
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By Cerberus.Auspice 2020-02-13 15:17:51
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It sure will! I was just about to run out and test the lua; good catch!
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By Asura.Pergatory 2020-02-13 15:46:45
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Asura.Sechs said: »
You guys have anything to correct in what I wrote above?
Nope I think it's pretty spot-on. Except maybe this bit:
Asura.Sechs said: »
All of this assuming to have Malaise and Frailty down on the target.
But if you don't I'm not even sure you should bother with FCrush and just rely on other options, I think?
I'm not sure if this is only true with Nirvana, but Flaming can often be the strongest option even without a GEO or COR present. That's true on about half of the Reisenjima T1s, for example, and practically all of the Zi'Tah & Ru'Aun mobs.

As for this one:
Asura.Sechs said: »
Second best being a godly Grio or, I dunno, maybe a Was+1? Not sure how well Was+1 would do honestly.
I'm not really sure either. I haven't seen any testing, but I kind of suspect Was+1 would beat Grio due to the sheer power of BP Damage on Flaming Crush. It lacks magic accuracy, though. Physical accuracy & attack are much easier to compensate for with food than magic accuracy. So I'd wager if Grio can beat Was, it's probably more true against the harder content than easier content.

This would be a massive pain to test because there are so many factors that give Flaming Crush wide variance.

P.S. I couldn't log on yesterday, but I should be able to update my Lua tonight with all the Siren stuff. I also intend to add a new midcast set for Wind's Blessing so you can increase the potency on it if you prefer that over duration.
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By Asura.Elizabet 2020-02-13 16:28:52
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A good stop gap to Nirvana (for Flaming Crush) can also be made with Kereunos. Which can get:

Blood Pact Damage +1~10
+
Pet: Double Attack and Critical Hit Rate +1~6%
+
Pet: Attack and Pet: Ranged Attack +1~25
or
Pet: Magic Accuracy +1~25
or
Pet: Magic Attack Bonus +1~25


On top of:
Avatar: Magic Accuracy+20 "Magic Atk. Bonus"+100

Makes for a pretty darn good hybrid BP staff imho. And maxing a Keraunos is a hell of a lot easier than landing a god like grio.

Also, pretty sure a max'd Keraunos is better or at least on par with Was +1.
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By Vankathka 2020-02-13 17:18:06
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Keraunos is a waste of time, even a averagely augmented Grioavolr would be superior to that, higher base MAB and MACC to start off with.

Edit- I fail to see how you would feel that would be the second best choice, DA/Crit has no meaning to FCrush, and you get only -one- of those options, if you could stack attack and MAB then maybe but as it is, I wouldn't bother with it.
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By Asura.Pergatory 2020-02-13 17:19:10
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Good point on Keraunos, I agree it could well be the second best option after Nirvana. I always forget about that thing when this comes up. One of these days I'll remember.
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