The Last Dance II: The Show Must Go On

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The Last Dance II: The Show Must Go On
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 Lakshmi.Byrth
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By Lakshmi.Byrth 2018-12-27 21:46:38
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Well, sending two packets would be entirely possible and they already do it for a number of other things. Where there's a will, there's a way with programming.
 Leviathan.Katriina
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By Leviathan.Katriina 2018-12-29 04:45:48
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Was just wondering, since Relic +3 Body got Amnesia Resist +35, is it possible to provide more Amnesia Resist by a new Samba that drains resist from Enemy?
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By Leviathan.Katriina 2018-12-30 01:44:10
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It would be great, if SE modified steps values as follows:

Step Before After
Box Step 3% + 2% x(Step level) 3% + 3% x (Step level)
Feather Step **4% + 1% x (Step level) **4% + 2% x (Step level)
Quickstep 4 x (Step level + 1) 10 x (Step level + 1)
Stutter Step 3 x (Step level) 5 x (Step level)

** Using Empy Hands +1

Level 10 Values:

Step Before After
Box Step -23% Defense -33% Defense
Feather Step -14% Critical Evasion -28% Critical Evasion
Quickstep -44 Evasion -111 Evasion
Stutter Step -30 MEVA -50 MEVA


And the cherry on top would be, switching Stutter Step from MEVA to MDB or STP.

Keep on dreaming Kat, keep on dreaming.
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 Asura.Cambion
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By Asura.Cambion 2019-01-09 12:22:52
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Fenrir.Puciato said: »
A friend overseas told me there was a stream from SE today and ...told me that all jumps and waltzes will be set to individual recasts and the next job to get adjusted is RDM.

From another thread, I don't know how reliable this is, but figured I'd share.

I really hope this isn't the adjustment to Dnc, because that's pretty terrible.
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By Zeota 2019-01-09 13:33:44
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DNC main heal on anything that doesn't amnesia, I guess.

Supposedly they're tweaking presto too by bumping up the daze effect.
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By ScaevolaBahamut 2019-01-09 13:47:39
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Asura.Cambion said: »
Fenrir.Puciato said: »
A friend overseas told me there was a stream from SE today and ...told me that all jumps and waltzes will be set to individual recasts and the next job to get adjusted is RDM.

From another thread, I don't know how reliable this is, but figured I'd share.

I really hope this isn't the adjustment to Dnc, because that's pretty terrible.

they're just making adjustments based on feedback on the official forums......









...from 2011
 Asura.Sechs
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By Asura.Sechs 2019-01-09 14:04:27
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Not that I complain about it, a good change is a good change, but did we really need that?
I mean since when they split the AoE from the Single Target from the Erase one, we were already pretty much set.
Especially with stuff like Fan Dance up and specific gear, Waltzes are already pretty powerful for content where DNC main healing is viable.

Would've rather taken adjustments to Flourish 3 Cooldowns but eeeh...
The Presto change is cool at least.
Wonder if they mean the potency of the debuff, the FMs you get or both.
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By Zeota 2019-01-09 14:36:00
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Given their track record, probably more finishing moves.

Would then beg the question, "Did they forget that terp exists?"

I guess that could help non-terp users, but you would still hit a wall with CF/RF cooldowns.
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By Asura.Cambion 2019-01-09 16:34:02
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Well, if this is the change we're getting, then can we start discussing code options for how to manage it? I understand it won't be 100% until we see the exact change in game, but assuming they've just split all waltz timers, how would we (and by we, I mean you smarter people who know code) handle upgrading/downgrading waltz based on recast timers.

Our base function is as follows: (Gunna use Mote's base rather than my own variation as it's more beneficial to the public)
Code
if missingHP ~= nil then
        if player.main_job == 'DNC' then
            if missingHP < 40 and spell.target.name == player.name then
                -- Not worth curing yourself for so little.
                -- Don't block when curing others to allow for waking them up.
                add_to_chat(122,'Full HP!')
                eventArgs.cancel = true
                return
            elseif missingHP < 300 then
                newWaltz = 'Curing Waltz'
                waltzID = 190
            elseif missingHP < 700 then
                newWaltz = 'Curing Waltz II'
                waltzID = 191
            else
                newWaltz = 'Curing Waltz III'
                waltzID = 192
            end
        elseif player.sub_job == 'DNC' then
            if missingHP < 40 and spell.target.name == player.name then
                -- Not worth curing yourself for so little.
                -- Don't block when curing others to allow for waking them up.
                add_to_chat(122,'Full HP!')
                eventArgs.cancel = true
                return
            elseif missingHP < 150 then
                newWaltz = 'Curing Waltz'
                waltzID = 190
            elseif missingHP < 300 then
                newWaltz = 'Curing Waltz II'
                waltzID = 191
            else
                newWaltz = 'Curing Waltz III'
                waltzID = 192
            end
        else
            -- Not dnc main or sub; bail out
            return
        end
    end


In short, how are you thinking we'll use our macros, and how will will force an alterate waltz to occur, when a previous waltz is on cooldown.

*Not real code, just my mental visualization*
If spell = waltz3 and recast > 0 and hp missing = X then
new spell waltz 4
else hp missing = Y then
new spell waltz 2
unless
new spell waltz4/waltz2
elseif waltz4 recast > 0 then
new spell waltz5

Something along those lines?

Honestly The above barely matters to me, but I will want it, as I finally be able to delete my code that previous prevented Waltz 4 or 5 from ever happening, so I suppose that's nice? Guess I can also finally ditch Anwig Salade?
Sadder than that, now I can stop saving 50 Omen cards for the Af+3 body, because who cares about -1 on your timer, when you get 5 different spells.

Most importantly, is actually going to be the Divine Waltz code, in my opinion.
If spell Divine waltz 2 and recast > 0 then
input divine waltz 1.
Code
if abil_recasts[spell.recast_id] > 0 then
newWaltz = 'Divine Waltz II'
waltzID = ???
end


Something like that, I don't know? Worth getting ready I think if any coders who actually know how to write from scratch can help.
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By Zeota 2019-01-09 18:30:15
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Should have changed haste Samba merits to give some store TP instead of what we have now. Would make it worth using in max haste situations.
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By farok 2019-01-10 01:18:45
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So, the presto changes seem pretty good!?!? Presto + Box Step gave 6 FMS and lvl 5 Daze.
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By Zeota 2019-01-10 01:27:52
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Yeah, makes building up dazes significantly more efficient, and you can max out a debuff using presto twice. The split waltz cooldowns turned terp into an even more incredible support weapon, especially in conjunction with presto.
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By Asura.Cambion 2019-01-10 01:33:24
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1 step = 2 FM and lvl 1 on the mob.
Presto step = 6 FM and lvl 5 on the mob.
2 presto steps, will cap level 10 debuff on the mob.
Debuff still caps at 10.
 Asura.Sechs
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By Asura.Sechs 2019-01-10 01:39:13
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Granted faster capped steps is super good in general, it can be slightly annoying on targets that last a lot of time, like Wave3 megabosses. Can't think of anything else.

Once you cap all 4 steps you only get 1 FM for each landed step (and Presto stops giving additional ones) making it very annoying to keep using Flourishes.

The only "solution" I found when I was still doing Wave3 megabosses on DNC was to let some steps expire on purpose. Like the Eva and the Meva ones, you can normally afford to let them disappear.
That way I was using steps to keep up the Def- and Crit+ ones and using the other 2 (letting them expire on purpose) so that, once they weren't at level 10 anymore, I could get capped FMs again.


Granted this isn't a big issue because I can't think of any other situation where this occurs, I still think they should change the "get only 1 FM when steps are capped" limitation.
What is even the purpose of it to begin with?
 Asura.Elizabet
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By Asura.Elizabet 2019-01-10 01:43:26
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I had wished they'd remove the decay on fan dance so we could've tanked in Turms but oh well... I am quite disappointed that this is all we got.

The split recast on waltz seems very very minor, specially with how much time we usually spend in Saber Dance. What am I not getting, why am I not overflowing with happiness....
 Asura.Sechs
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By Asura.Sechs 2019-01-10 01:47:59
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To be fair Elizabet DNC isn't exactely the job that comes to mind when you were thinking about necessary adjustments.
Despite the fact that the Western community doesn't seem to hold DNC in high regardl, it was in an already excellent position.

Regardless of that we still got something cool instead of "nothing" or, even worse, a nerf.

The Waltz change is pretty useless but better to have than to have not.
The Presto change is quite awesome instead. Really, don't think any of us DNC has reasons to be sad.
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 Asura.Elizabet
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By Asura.Elizabet 2019-01-10 01:50:28
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I agree, I am more disappointed that I dared to hope.
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By Phoenix.Dabackpack 2019-01-10 02:17:36
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Yeah, it's definitely gonna take some getting used to the presto change, ultimately it's really good though.

The Waltz change is actually quite good for lowman/solo play. I was just able to solo AAGK on Difficult because I had more timers ready for the skillchains.

EDIT: Also, the Waltz change makes tanking a lot easier, since you have more hate building tools essentially.
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 Asura.Cambion
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By Asura.Cambion 2019-01-10 02:34:43
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Sorry for the mess, just thinking outloud as I work through this and experiment.

Asura.Sechs said: »
Granted faster capped steps is super good in general, it can be slightly annoying on targets that last a lot of time, like Wave3 megabosses. Can't think of anything else.

Once you cap all 4 steps you only get 1 FM for each landed step (and Presto stops giving additional ones) making it very annoying to keep using Flourishes.

I'm out testing some things, and I think this is going to be a bigger problem than we realize.
At this point, we only have 4 steps, you can only presto twice per step, and they will be capped. Presto is a 15 second recast.
That means that anything that lives longer than 1min 45sec, will we be capped on every debuff, and never be able to get more than a single FM per step after that point. Unless, as you stated, you purposely let it wear off. There's a lot of things in the game that last longer than 1:45.

Nevermind, See below.

No one will care, but we can cap all 4 of our debuffs in less than 2 minutes, so technically we're more party/alli friendly as 'supports', but no one will use us that way so it's irrelevant.

I'm not exaggerating when I say I actually think with the new Waltz timers, combined with a single presto step and reverse flourish, that I could easily main heal an entire alliance, as long as we're engaged.

No Foot Rise feels like a waste now, but I'll give it a few days to see, before I ditch those merits.

Maxixi Casaque +2 feels like a waste of Omen Cards. (The waltz is nice, but I'm not going to bother dropping 50 cards on the +3 this weekend like I planned)

Anwig Salade seems pointless for the same reason, but has zero alternate benefit like Maxixi body, so Inv+1 I guess?

With all these Waltz and basically zero cool down, combined with divine 1 and 2 also separated, I actually feel invincible. There will be few things that can kill us faster than we can heal ourselves with 7 different insta-cast heals available, you are only limited by your TP. But with an instant 6 steps and reverse flourish... you can't really run out of Tp.

The base breakdown for Waltz efficiency still works fine. I wasn't able to force a scenario where I need Waltz 3 back-to-back. Everytime I tried it just did a 3, then a 2 right after.

If you don't have a cycle-step keybind in your Gearswap, you're going to regret it.

I need to find/write a code to auto-use Divine 1, if divine 2 is on cooldown, or versa visa.

Edit: I'm illiterate. Base duration of Daze is 1:00, a second step will extend it to 1:30.

If so, this alters the ceiling we were discussing.
0:00 - Presto Step1, Daze 5
0:15 - Presto Step1, Daze 10
0:30 - Presto Step2, Daze 5
0:45 - Presto Step2, Daze 10
1:00 - Presto Step3, Daze 5
1:15 - Presto Step3, Daze 10
1:30 - Presto Step4, Daze 5
1:45 - Presto Step4, Daze 10 ***Step 1 should now wear off***
At this point, we re-start the cycle, meaning you can 100% keep up the cycle of 6FM per step, while only stepping once, with Presto, each time.
It oddly lines up perfectly, for us to be most efficient, by continually cycling all 4 steps, and maintaining all of debuffs at level 10. I repeat, if you don't have a step-cycle keybind, you're going to regret it, IMO. Also need to adjust the auto-presto script.
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By Asura.Sechs 2019-01-10 03:35:39
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Did you include the additional 20 seconds from Job Points? I think you forgot about them.

I'm not even sure how exactely they work. They for sure raise the overall duration cap from 120 seconds to 140.
But do they also raise the duration of individual steps?
If so: all of them? Just the first?

If it does indeed affect also steps and not just the cap, and if it affects all of them, the first Step will last 80 seconds instead of 60, and the second step will add 50 instead of 30.

80 -15 + 50 = 115 seconds, i.e. 1 minute and 55 seconds duration.

If it affects only the initial step it would be:
80 -15 + 30 = 95 seconds i.e. 1 minute and 35 seconds.

If it only affects the overall capp then no difference from the numbers you posted.
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By Asura.Cambion 2019-01-10 04:20:22
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Asura.Sechs said: »
Did you include the additional 20 seconds from Job Points? I think you forgot about them.
I definitely forgot them, I'll test all of this tomorrow.

With the updated recast/cooldowns Mote's old rules are no longer optimized for Dancer. I've made a post in the main Gearswap thread asking for help, so we'll see how that goes.

Long Story short, we need a downgrade from divine 2 to divine 1 and we need a downgrade from Waltz 3 to Waltz 2.
In just a small bit of soloing, there are times where I've been able to trigger the need for a Waltz3 > Waltz3 based on missing HP. Instead of the code downgrading to a Waltz 2 and allowing me to cure myself, it just tells me Waltz 3 is on cooldown. Likely a simple fix for people proficient in gearswap, but over my head.

What was not over my head on the other hand, was this one:
Code
-- If you attempt to use a step, this will automatically use Presto.
function job_pretarget(spell, action, spellMap, eventArgs)
    if spell.type == 'Step' then
        local allRecasts = windower.ffxi.get_ability_recasts()
        local prestoCooldown = allRecasts[236]
		
        if player.main_job_level >= 77 and prestoCooldown < 1 then
            cast_delay(1.1)
            send_command('input /ja "Presto" <me>')
        end
    end
	
-- If you attempt to use Climactic Flourish with less than 4 finishing moves, this will automatically use 'Current Step' and resend Climactic Flourish.	
	    local under4FMs = not buffactive['Finishing Move 4'] and not buffactive['Finishing Move 5'] and not buffactive['Finishing Move (6+)']
		local doStep = ''
		local doStep = state.MainStep.current
    if spell.english == "Climactic Flourish" and under4FMs then
            cast_delay(1.9)
            send_command('@input /ja "'..doStep..'" <t>')
    end	
end


I've been testing it for the last hour and it's been working perfectly for me. For most people (Read:Non-Terp owners) this should replace the previous codes that handled Auto-Presto usage.

This one is rather straight forward based on how I expect to be using Presto moving forward.
If I use a Step, Use Presto. Period.
I don't ever expect to use a step anymore, unless Presto is available. I might even adjust this to cancel a step, if Presto isn't off of cooldown, but I'll give it some time before I get too in depth.

This code also updates the Climactic Flourish Rules.
If you attempt to use Climactic
But have less than 4 Finishing Moves
It will automatically use your current step
***which by previous rules should automatically use presto, if available***
and then will re-send the Climactic input.

Works for me. I assume it will work for the general population, but your mileage may vary based on playstyle. Just offering it for those who are interested.

Good night!
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By Leviathan.Katriina 2019-01-10 05:24:42
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Phoenix.Dabackpack said: »
EDIT: Also, the Waltz change makes tanking a lot easier, since you have more hate building tools essentially.

Especially when you realize that you can have 6 times more blink that way instead of only once, due to timers.[if you use Dashing Subligar that is], I expect a huge spike in price on that piece too...I can safely say that, DNC is invincible now!

Asura.Sechs said: »
The only "solution" I found when I was still doing Wave3 megabosses on DNC was to let some steps expire on purpose.
Or, don't use Presto on QuickStep!

Overall, nice update, can't wait for Daze Effect Adjustments [if any].
DNC DPS will drastically increase now, after presto update [Especially for Terp users].
Personally, I would only use 1/5 or 2/5 NFR in emergency Clim activation from now on [Saber Dance will take NFR ones].
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By Asura.Sechs 2019-01-10 05:29:02
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Think I was using Presto (old version) only on Box Step to speed up the "getting to rank 10" process.

I didn't do many Wave3 megabosses runs on DNC. Most of the time I could keep at least box Step up 100% of the time, sometimes (when adds were taking a bit too long to kill) I occasionally had Box Step expire... I know I'm a bad DNC blahblah, but those fights -on our first kills- did occasionally get pretty frantic and not being able to correctly track Steps duration on targets is overly annoying.

Granted with the new Presto that wouldn't be a big issue. In like what, 15 seconds? You can get Capped Box Step again, BIG DEAL YO.
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By SimonSes 2019-01-10 08:05:14
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Leviathan.Katriina said: »
DNC DPS will drastically increase now, after presto update [Especially for Terp users].

Please explain >.>

You mean because of less time spent on doing steps or because of faster def down? Both of those will increase DNC dps, but I would rather use the word "slightly" not "drastically" lol.
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By Asura.Sechs 2019-01-10 08:18:20
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Less time doing steps, faster capped def down, that occasional additional FM for more TP on Reverse Flourish and stuff like that.

I 101% agree with Simon though the right word here seems to be "slightly", not "drastically" xD
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By SimonSes 2019-01-10 09:24:55
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Also I still dont know what would be the most optimal way to 1hr zerg on DNC (outside of Escha and in Escha).

Assuming (3000TP, buildig flourish and 9 FM ready)

Outside of Escha:
Climactic > Rudra > RF > Grand pas > Rudra > RF Rudra > Trance Rudra > RF Rudra > RF Rudra > engage, make tp > Climactic > Rudra > make TP > Rudra - 8 climactic Rudras

In Escha:
Climactic > Rudra > RF > Grand pas > Rudra > RF Rudra > Trance Rudra > RF Rudra > RF Rudra > Revit > Climactic > RF Rudra > wing Rudra > wing Rudra - 9 Climactic Rudras without TPing (could go for 10 with TPing before Revit)

Is that optimal?
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By Afania 2019-01-11 18:56:39
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SimonSes said: »
Leviathan.Katriina said: »
DNC DPS will drastically increase now, after presto update [Especially for Terp users].

Please explain >.>

You mean because of less time spent on doing steps or because of faster def down? Both of those will increase DNC dps, but I would rather use the word "slightly" not "drastically" lol.

It is "Drastically" using ffxi standard, lol. FFXI dps increase is never about something like 100% every update, but more like 3% or something. So by comparsion, at least from none terp pov, this is big change.

I farmed some stwart yesterday and I'd say the change is significant and noticable with faster kill speed on every floor. The finishing move generation is insane with Presto, Im often at capped FM easily. which opens up new options to use all that finishing moves.

Maybe for terp users it doesn't matter to them, but as a none terp it really changed how the job can be played, imo. Although I'm not sure if that devalue terp a little, since finishing move management is less of an issue now.

I also feel this change made dnc much more fun to play with more options in playstyle.
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By Asura.Dinotron 2019-01-11 21:33:13
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What Resin option do most of you use for TP ambu cape?
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By Asura.Elizabet 2019-01-11 22:39:14
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Afania said: »
I also feel this change made dnc much more fun to play with more options in playstyle.

I agree, after playing with it a little I am quite pleased after all. My initial reaction were wrong.

Although, given how free we are now with waltz. I **wish** Setan Kober path D or some new dagger or something would given something like Healing Waltz always gain the effect of Contradance... We have a lot of good DPS options for weapons. A support oriented one, bonus if it works in off hand, would be amazing.

@Dinotron I tend towards DT or MDT as we really lack in MEva and MDT in most our sets.
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By Phoenix.Dabackpack 2019-01-11 22:57:32
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Yeah, I've benefited so much from the waltz update. Main healing for several HTBs on Very Difficult which would have been impossible before.

Personally I use PDT-10% for the resin, since you only need 26% MDT to cap with Shell V anyway.
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