Aegis Speculation

Its dramatically more than 50% MDT. 50% MDT, ~50 MDB if your barspell matches the element, and ~23% complete magical annulment with the aforementioned requirement granted. As I mentioned several times now, most of the adamant proponents of Aegis seem to think that an Ochain is going to take even remotely dangerous amounts of damage from magic. You're still looking at sub-500 amounts on the most damaging attacks when you've got two people moderately prepared.

I can't say I'm surprised my point isn't being regarded through all the trolling and morons suggesting that I can't participate in this discussion without my own PLD to put on the chopping block.

lol what

It's dangerous to go out alone, take this!

Don't forget this too!

It's funny how most PLD's here w/ aegis says it's better. The ones without says it's not. Of course the ones with ochain, lol we are clearly better than aegis...
:P

I don't have either, however working on aegis atm.
Started ochain, but I felt like it was not something I would want to spend my time doing. Just didn't feel as big of an accomplishment for myself.

Aegis all the way for me im 30/75 souls and rly dont care for ochain anytime soon maybe my lazyness had kicked in.

lol? aegis is so much harder/timeconsuming/expensive compared to ochain and it's not even a better shield :/

i can understand if you have ochain and you just want aegis as a career pld, but to stop doing ochain (when you're already halfway done) for aegis? idonteven.

Aegis > Ochain :) nuff said~

There's no way not even SE would make Aegis gimped next to lolOchain only use i see for ochain is training mobs to farm chests in abyssea lol, it's good just not AS good as Aegis.

the thing is...there is no "*better*" of the two shields. They are both situational like every other piece of gear in the game and both have different uses. You could say they are "*better*" for their situations but neither shield is better for just bieng better.

TL;DR/DU

Aegis is a MDT set shield and Ochain is a PDT set shield and are the best for their respective situations.

also: passive aggressively working on an Ochain...and i might mess around and get an Aegis after 99 cap...and then ill have to actually gear a full time set for both ._.'

and to rerail!: i think they are only going to add a small percentage of MDT/bash to Aegis95~99 and vice-versa to Ochain95~99...just to *** with us :(

Yeah, and no way they'd make Spharai gimp next to Vereth, or Kikoku gimp next to Kannagi. Oh wait. That said, Aegis isn't even close to gimp.


facepalm.jpg

Nice! owait getting dispeled isn't a status ailment :/ /farewell shell D:

Ignore the morons.

When I wrap up at school today I'll work out some spell/TP simulations and do a few tests on Undine to confirm/dispute my total magic reduction numbers.

Does anyone have any good static set block numbers for Aegis on high level mobs? I'd really prefer good testing and not just random parse numbers while gear is being flipped constantly.

Are you referring to block rates and/or damage reduction upon block? For either of those, look for parses by Neosutra. Unfortunately parses are the only way to get that kind of data, but parses for this kind of test can be controlled to a very reasonable degree.

I wouldn't look into it to much and just wait on the lvl 95 testing.

I'm not saying don't use a parser. I'm saying that parsing while doing end game events where you're swaping gear constantly are borderline useless for testing purposes. As long as you aren't swaping gear you can easily tell the parsed difference in a block vs a non-block. But when you are changing gear and being spammed with cures with cureskin it kills the numbers. So neither eyeballed tests nor parsed tests on actual events where gear is being changed and you have various buffs on are going to be useful data wise.

I mean block rates. I've seen Neosutra's Aegis testing but I don't recall what it was on. Is there any high level NM data on there with a decent sample size? I don't have a link to it currently.

Of course I'd like to see some tests with varying levels of shield skill gear on a 95 Aegis vs high level mobs as well but lacking the corresponding 90 data could let certain factors of how it works be left in the dark.

I plan on doing a test this weekend to give the high end block rate on Aegis.

I'm trying to figure a way to parse the logs for when reprisal is active and when palisade is active to see what each actually does.

Is there a way to reparse *.txt chat logs? I could copy the text in between activation and it wearing off and just reparse those.

The only for certain way I know of is to just do two tests and turn the parse off while reprisal is down for the reprisal test.

If that function is added to the parser then you could reparse it. I'm uncertain if you can manually edit parser logs and reparse.

Aegis's block rate does cap off pretty low compared to Ochain ofcourse, and the difference is extenuated as lvl gap increases (your enemy gets higher and higher lvl than you).

The counterpoint to that is that the block rate difference is marginalized via /nin and reprisal/Palisade, and more importantly that -everything- endgame casts.

I've always said, a good Pld should have both shields, so I'm not sure why people continue to ask which is better. ***is situational. I guarantee you every single pld that has both will tell you they'd pick Aegis over Ochain if they only had to pick one shield however. Aegis is brokenly strong in end game at the moment.

Hey Yinsha.


I sang the song.

It may be gone by now.

But I sang it.

I have both and on VW or anything else that matters Aegis allows me to avoid being one shotted. ochain allowed me to make some nice solo vids on content that was 5-8 years old. Aegis keeps my character needed for endgame.

I seriously regret investing 3 weeks of my life to get Ochain, because where/when it is needed, /nin is far superior and completely negates the need of ochain alltogether. Only thing ochain was good for was "oh ***/ sentinel" moments where I was invincible to physical attacks for a while. Now, palisade/reprisal with aegis reduces much more physical dmg.

Ochain worthless outside of "I can solo fafnir !"

Feel free to toss your Ochain and screen shot it for us if its completely worthless.

It negates status ailments inflicted via TP moves with up to a 100% rate, and allows you to idle in your TP set, increasing overall damage, helping you maintain enmity, and killing things faster, whereas Aegis does not, not to mention acts a nice way to refresh MP. Aegis even under Reprisal won't always have a good block rate. Palisade looks pretty potent to me, so during that I'd imagine it pulls ahead of Ochain physically (20% of the time). There's always a time one will beat the other, a good PLD can decide when this is.

Dark, I want you to have my babies.

-Aegis, like any shield, CAN block TP moves. The added status ailments aren't going to kill you providing you have support. Several Special attacks are magical damage and are almost instant. Unless you're running a bot, there's no way to equip Aegis in time to avoid being put close to death or one shotted. I'd rather take consistent low-medium dmg and force my whm to stay awake than look like an indestructible champ only to fall flat on my *** ***hits the fan.

-Cycling Reprisal and Palisade with Aegis has closed the gap (with Ochain blood tanking)
-Idling in your tp set - Increasing overall dmg - maintaining enmity; Can idle in your tp set with Aegis just fine as /nin, when /war and for the 40-60 seconds reprisal and palisade are down you can hit sentinel and switch to pdt set. should have no enmity loss issues. When reprisal/palisade back up, go into tp mode.

-always a time when one will beat the other: agreed. But if its requires having a 10-18 man alliance there, you're more than likely going to be full timing Aegis. Ochain is nice for low-man content - mobs that can't chainspell, instant-cast horribly damaging magic spells and moves.

I said Ochain is more consistent than Aegis at doing this. Not that Aegis can't do it. If you think you're going to be nulling a significant amount of TP moves with Aegis on anything a handful of levels higher than you (outside of Palisade/Reprisal) then you're going to be shocked.


There's very few things outside of instant cast meteor that's going to "one shot" you. In the situations it can, I would opt Aegis over Ochain, like I said this is a situation one shield trumps the other. You're confused if you think this is the norm.


I mentioned I noticed some impressive returns with Palisade, I'll get around to crunching a % eventually. That's only 20% of the time (1/5). Reprisal won't cap your block rate if it's floored so it's not always a given, again, a situation Ochain would have an advantage.



Aside from not being able to think of a situation I use /NIN nowadays, if you have to opt to /NIN to accommodate Aegis over Ochain, you're already losing the offensive increase from /WAR. So again, outside of stuff like Palisade, or when Reprisal caps your blockrate Ochain does offer gains offensively.

Both are good shields, Ochain wins physically when Aegis' blockrate is low, Aegis wins otherwise and arguably as /NIN (for whatever reason you sub NIN.)

MDT sets don't exist. There was a ninja nerf and SE deleted them all.

All hail Aegis!

A lot of Aegis users really feel the need to justify all the time spent making it.

Is it like buyers remorse or something?

I'm not understanding people saying that Ochain is soooooooooooo much better than Aegis.. Ya on physical only, physical TP only mobs its probably better, block wise. But isn't being like magic immune kinda fun? lol