Aegis Speculation

Best.Post.Ever lol

Wasn't though was it.

As an Aegis owner, here is the rough numbers.

100+ Level mobs block rate is more in the 50-55% range. The lower the level, it ups to somewhere in the 70% range. This is with the level 90 shield and someone on BG tested that overall was in the low 60% range of blocking.

Damage reduction with phalanx is upwards of 90%. For example, when I get hit for 120 unblocked, the blocked is in the single digits.

Magic damage in voidwatch is pretty amazing though, if you swap into your MDT set (which overall totals to 87.4% reduction) you'll take double digit magic damage where the DD around you are taking 1k+.

worlace is no pld worlace is a WAR....

More recent info rather than relying on years old data on a 75 Shield.

Link

Cap for block rate based off two test varies 68-75%, 75% physical reduction on blocks, and tailing a measly 12% behind Ochain at high block rates (capped/reprisal).



You don't need either shield, but yes Ochain will see much more use if you have it.

If you don't have a large party participating (I usually go with 8 or so), or lacking stunners then yeah, weakness > aga is a killer, not so much with Aegis. If you have an alliance, and multiple tanks then sure, you won't need Aegis, nor would you need Ochain.


?

imo both shields are good. great even. if you can afford/have the time to make them both.


for the first bolded text i like to say ochain works quite well on it.

i have personally beaten Celaeno enough times to be rather burnt out on fighting her. maybe its because we use low man situation and takes about twenty min to kill. but as far as the fight goes, its 4-manable(whm,blm,smn & me on ochain). we never used multiple tanks on it. its far from impossible to beat.

while on the other hand we havent found a working stat for Voidwrought. even had our aegis out there and things werent pretty.


i can say for myself and our aegis, that any form of magic that any of those t4 vwnms can cast isnt threatening. under that rare circumstance that one of their lowhp% tp moves gets though or around stun, and we are weakened (hahava) or encumbered (celaeno),then it would be a differnt story. even then, mdt set and aegis taking the bulk of the damage. stunners are a key to success. and like you said, they are just as important as a good tank or healer.

wanna say again that for voidwrought, our stunners still need to learn to differentiate the most threatening tp move from the ones we can eat so we can pull out a victory.
and if the situation calls for aegis to be macroed in, then you should do it. with the amount of procs that should be happening, you can just pop a dusty wing and hit use cdc. losing tp is not that big of an issue. esp if your dds know their role and aren't trying to tear the mob apart and/or you are using smn as your main dmg source.

well at least thats what we do.

Some of ya'll make it seem like you absolutely neeed to have an Aegis or Ochain to fight Voidwatch NMs. 99% blockrate is nice and all. It's what you may call Godly. But, and there's always that but. 95% MDT? Get out of here. I'll take the 25% less shield proc. If you can get them both you would be set. But if you had one of the two you would benefit more from having an Aegis, hands down, than an Ochain. That's just my own crackpot opinion though.

And that's all the reason I need. Ochain does look better withb the Creed set though.

I think having both Aegis and Ochain on a single character is overkill.
Besides, wouldn't it be more efficient to have them on two characters?

I guess but I'm far too lazy to ever work on a second character. I don't even like working on the one I have and it shows.

lol
I just find it kinda inefficient to have both shields on a single character when it might be better to give them to different people.

Cat Aegis is happy

Oh yeah, if it were and LS thing and you had a pld w/ Aegis and a pld w/o I'd say focus making the one w/o's Ochain and not the Aegis PLD a toy.

its up to the user. id imagine that aegis isnt hard to make, just takes a lot of gil or farming. which could be done with as little as two people. ochain isnt any harder. or hard for that matter. dealing with competition and abyssite changes being the only setbacks. neither quest requires a ls to get it done, just speeds it up.

Exactly. Noone's gonna look at anyone that owns either and say you're an idiot for having that. That's for sure. It's not Claustrum afterall.

Aegis>Brochain

I'm not sure what that thread was supposed to show me. Multiple testimonies confirming that Aegis is going to be in the 50-60% range on anything difficult, while Ochain maintains a nearly capped block rate.

And not that it matters, because you don't cap block rate on anything difficult, but the difference between 68-75% and 100% is not 12%.

I said 12% difference in total damage mitigated at capped block-rate or when reprisal caps block rate.

Hits*Damage per hit*Block rate*Damage absorbed.

70% Block with Aegis 90, and 75% damage mitigated. 1000 hits*.7 = 700 Blocks. If all hits would do a flat 100 unblocked, then 700*100*.75(block reduction) = 52,500 Mitigated damage.

95% block on Ochain and around 63% reduction. 1000*.95 = 950 blocks.
950*100*.63 = 59,850 mitigated damage.

(59,850-52,500)/59,850))*100 = 12.28% lead by Ochain in total damage mitigated.

That aside no, Aegis won't come close to matching Ochain's utility in VW in most situations. I'm just disagreeing that Aegis will never save you from a life or death scenario if using party size/jobs present as a variable.

Those numbers are great and all but they're also only physical attacks. DMG mitigated total will clearly be aegis cause the magic dmg reduction. I'm not gonna do the math for ya cause you've done most of it and pretty spot on. The pysical attacks don't do all that much. And with Aegis you can eat a lot more missed stuns or let more go to save stun resistance. I still stand by Aegis > Ochain. But again it's gonna be an argument that goes back and forth cause both shields are phenominal.

It was physical comparison, everybody knows Ochain offers nothing defensively vs. magic. It depends entirely on how often it casts and how damaging its spells are. More often than not it won't close the gap between the shields.

what the

I'm absolutely dumbfounded that we continue to use incompetent stunners as a benefit.

Aegis is fantastic, and every serious paladin should strive to have one, but stunning.is.not.hard.

Also, the damage taken comparison(while hardly relevant to my point) doesn't seem to account for the difference in equipment each shield necessitates. Back, neck, ears, head, and feet all take a hit when you need to supplement a lesser blocking rate.

While perfectly open to debate in general, 1/3 of notable VW targets don't leave any room for argument. Aegis isn't in leagues with Ochain against Voidwrought. Not sure what you two aren't understanding.

Um in my 6+ years owning Aegis I can count the times I've been killed by melee attacks on 1 hand.... Including solo tanking t4 voidwatch.... and id say 60% of them were 75 cap vs tiamat, when it could randomly 2 shot on a bad unblocked DA during MS (pre reprisal)

Don't suck at gear swaps, save reprisal for weakness, and congrats you win the game.

The only -usefulness- I can see in owning both shields (other than completions sake) is the additional TP boost from blocking, but lets be serious, its -very- difficult to make CDC really a top dps'er in voidwatch thanks to how godly evasive the mobs are.

Ochain is always going to be the "safer" shield for a base model pld, who doesn't have the years of experience in taking high level crap, cuz lets be honest, 80% of ochain owners never saw a hnm at 75, let alone fought one. The same % is probably true for ochain owners and not having gear swaps outside of a hybrid tank/dd set (sup full af3 and hp rings) and a ws set.

However, ochain in the hands of someone who knows how to play pld and already has aegis will not increase the survivability to the extent of someone who's barely geared on pld, getting ochain. That being said both are awesome shields, both capable of getting the job done, but lets be honest, arguing over which is the better shield is like arguing what would you rather be seen driving in, a ferrari or a lambo.

Aegis > Ochain

rofl