Consolidation Of Sortie NM Info

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Consolidation of Sortie NM Info
 Bismarck.Radec
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By Bismarck.Radec 2023-10-27 21:16:20
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Cerberus.Kylos said: »
Edit2: I'd also like to rule out that "NMs spawn anywhere and then follow a path". So many times I have seen the Fomor spawn in the WAR WHM THF room and it remains there for the rest of the run. It doesn't take a set path when it spawns there. It just sits in that crowd indefinitely. I've also seen this happen when it spawns in the north PT rooms. Have also seen this happen with the Bhoot, but only if it spawns in the Corse room.

I can't say I've replicated all of the behaviour you've seen, but the whm war thf and corse rooms are the ends of the path I'm suggesting for D and B. The NM stays there because the roaming is completed.

Just finished a run now, and all 4 upper NMs were found in those end-of-path rooms at 10mins left.

The drawn arrows may be unclear on that point, I'm not suggesting Obdella can stop in the north fomor room, it just joins the arrow continuing to acuex from there. Likewise, Deleterious won't stop near C but continue up to West of D.
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 Cerberus.Kylos
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By Cerberus.Kylos 2023-10-27 21:26:51
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It surprises me that SE would go to the effort of making NMs switch behaviours like this. Several times, I have seen NMs either roaming away from, or outright leaving these "destination" rooms. This roam completion thing doesn't feel right to me, although I cannot say that I have triggered all NMs early in a run and then left them alone til the end, except for the Fomor, and that's only because it spawned in that WHM WAR THF room.
 Cerberus.Natsuhiko
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By Cerberus.Natsuhiko 2023-10-27 21:37:17
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Cerberus.Kylos said: »
It surprises me that SE would go to the effort of making NMs switch behaviours like this. Several times, I have seen NMs either roaming away from, or outright leaving these "destination" rooms. This roam completion thing doesn't feel right to me, although I cannot say that I have triggered all NMs early in a run and then left them alone til the end, except for the Fomor, and that's only because it spawned in that WHM WAR THF room.

I think it's more "en-route" versus endpoint behavior myself. The places I see them staying at the most are the ends of the arrows.
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 Cerberus.Kylos
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By Cerberus.Kylos 2023-10-27 21:49:40
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Cerberus.Natsuhiko said: »
Cerberus.Kylos said: »
It surprises me that SE would go to the effort of making NMs switch behaviours like this. Several times, I have seen NMs either roaming away from, or outright leaving these "destination" rooms. This roam completion thing doesn't feel right to me, although I cannot say that I have triggered all NMs early in a run and then left them alone til the end, except for the Fomor, and that's only because it spawned in that WHM WAR THF room.

I think it's more "en-route" versus endpoint behavior myself. The places I see them staying at the most are the ends of the arrows.

Possibly, although twice I have seen the Leech in that corridor east and south of the WHM WAR THF fomor room. And it was definitely not heading north. No idea where it was going... but I remember being so annoyed the first time, because I had been looking for ages. I'd given up looking, and then bumped in to it while looking for the Fomor.

Several instances of NMs leaving their "destination" rooms, or going the opposite direction of the arrows on that map, tells me it's not as black & white as some may believe. Maybe some of the spawns act in this way, and others don't? But I can't outright prove that without hard evidence. These are just observations.
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By Seun 2023-10-28 00:32:37
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Cerberus.Kylos said: »
Several instances of NMs leaving their "destination" rooms, or going the opposite direction of the arrows on that map, tells me it's not as black & white as some may believe. Maybe some of the spawns act in this way, and others don't? But I can't outright prove that without hard evidence. These are just observations.

Seconded, though I should note that Leech and Deleterious are the common rule breakers.


The map has an arrow pathing the leech south toward A gate(/heal for chest). The line splits the corridors, but I have personally seen the leech path down both the left and right ramps.


Somewhat related from an older thread, but at least the deleterious doesn't have memory of it's 'route'. I've been in situations where the deleterious is surrounded and would be impossible to pull. If you pull anyway and kite until you shed aggro, the adds will path back to their normal patrols. The deleterious on the other hand almost seems to be given a completely new assignment. It will sometimes break away from the adds and wander off to another route or patrol.


I've used this 'trick' numerous times to avoid having to find other objectives to complete while I'm waiting for deleterious to path to a safer place to pull.


Also had a few runs where deleterious showed on widescan but was likely overlap from another map. He appears on scan in the middle of a longer room filled with fomor, but he's not there.
 Cerberus.Kylos
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By Cerberus.Kylos 2023-10-28 00:50:19
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Seun said: »
Cerberus.Kylos said: »
Several instances of NMs leaving their "destination" rooms, or going the opposite direction of the arrows on that map, tells me it's not as black & white as some may believe. Maybe some of the spawns act in this way, and others don't? But I can't outright prove that without hard evidence. These are just observations.

Seconded, though I should note that Leech and Deleterious are the common rule breakers.


The map has an arrow pathing the leech south toward A gate(/heal for chest). The line splits the corridors, but I have personally seen the leech path down both the left and right ramps.


Somewhat related from an older thread, but at least the deleterious doesn't have memory of it's 'route'. I've been in situations where the deleterious is surrounded and would be impossible to pull. If you pull anyway and kite until you shed aggro, the adds will path back to their normal patrols. The deleterious on the other hand almost seems to be given a completely new assignment. It will sometimes break away from the adds and wander off to another route or patrol.


I've used this 'trick' numerous times to avoid having to find other objectives to complete while I'm waiting for deleterious to path to a safer place to pull.


Also had a few runs where deleterious showed on widescan but was likely overlap from another map. He appears on scan in the middle of a longer room filled with fomor, but he's not there.

I have also seen this happen with the Fomor NM. It was hanging around in the "destination" room. I pulled, but got a major link, so I hit the floor, because I was still fairly new to Sortie and running away did not come to mind. My friend was there, but kept sneak/inviz up so he wouldn't aggro.

After going down, the adds went back to the room, but the NM turned the other way and began walking down the corridor instead. I got back up and did my best to recover while he held it on COR. When I was unweak we finished it off. I found it bizarre, but also very helpful, lol.
 Asura.Rekcuf
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By Asura.Rekcuf 2023-10-28 10:11:06
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i need 90k!! points and i have 2 key entries i think id need a 3rd run T.T
 Asura.Splendid
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By Asura.Splendid 2023-10-30 10:44:12
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If you’re constantly getting blue procs on Aita and he doesn’t Vivisection at 3 minutes how long do you typically have before he will absolutely do it? Does anyone know for sure?

I had a run the other day where we definitely didn’t kill him fast enough and around 6 minutes he just went on a Vivisection party. People would get up and he would do it over and over. Also how would you handle changing the entire party’s weather on SCH without sacrificing damage? I did a run where I maintained light arts the entire time to handle accession weather changes and it went well. The following run I did the same thing and it seemed like we didn’t have enough damage. Both times the other SCH and the GEO were doing Bolster. The BLM Vido’ed etc.

How do you know exactly when he’s going to TP? I’ve experienced times where we were mid skillchain and he swapped to the opposite element and we would get agons. Is it safest to do one volley then wait?
 Carbuncle.Maletaru
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By Carbuncle.Maletaru 2023-10-30 11:47:07
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I've never noticed Vivi being delayed by proccing him, typically if we got to 3 minutes without killing him, he Vivi'd us and killed us (or we had to run away/time RUN JA).

He will continue doing Vivi over and over until someone survives it, then he will wait 3 minutes (I believe this timer starts right after he uses it) so a wipe pretty much ends your chances, unless you have a really long DOT on him and can fully recover before re-engaging. Maybe others have plans to recover, we usually just move on and call it a loss.

For weather changes, when we had 2 SCH we would have 1 ride light arts the whole time for weather changes. Depending how many people are casting (is your GEO nuking?) you could just do single weathers, with the weaker SCH doing the BLM first then himself, and the other SCH immediately doing his own weather, no Accession required.

The reason you didn't have enough damage was probably because of some buff/debuff missing, were these the same players?

Knowing when he's going to TP depends a little bit on your rolls, gearsets, how many people are nuking, is the RUN engaged, etc. but I found that we could get 1 SC for sure, second SC was pretty sketchy. This was with no MNK roll, that might change things quite significantly as other groups I've seen go MANY SCs between element changes. If you stick with the same buffs, players, and strategy you should be able to get a feel for it. Choose to take as many/few risks as you'd like. TBH with our setup I usually waited for the element change to be safe, since we have plenty of time once we got it down.

This is all from memory though as I haven't been doing mage setup for a while now.
 Shiva.Alistrianna
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By Shiva.Alistrianna 2023-10-30 16:20:52
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Triboulex's Light damage counter resets after each Setting The Stage. The damage of the next Setting The Stage also increases by 1000.
If he has used Setting The Stage and you wipe, he will open with Setting The Stage on the person who re-aggro's him if they are in range of the move regardless of how much time passed.
 Ragnarok.Narce
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By Ragnarok.Narce 2023-10-30 22:51:30
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Shiva.Alistrianna said: »
Triboulex's Light damage counter resets after each Setting The Stage. The damage of the next Setting The Stage also increases by 1000.
If he has used Setting The Stage and you wipe, he will open with Setting The Stage on the person who re-aggro's him if they are in range of the move regardless of how much time passed.

Added this, thanks!
 Carbuncle.Nynja
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By Carbuncle.Nynja 2023-10-31 21:49:23
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On the topic of Botulus, I think its more than just "50% damage from behind", and holding hate for Y duration is absolutely a factor. Failed to get chest with SAM and DRK pingponging it. I made sure every WS was from behind, but no one held hate for any substantial amount of time.
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By drakefs 2023-11-01 10:31:50
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Carbuncle.Nynja said: »
On the topic of Botulus, I think its more than just "50% damage from behind", and holding hate for Y duration is absolutely a factor.

Not sure about the duration requirement. I think it may be more along the lines of not doing damage while going above x% of hate vs the "tank".

We have had our tank die while killing him and if we do not stop damage, ie. someone else starts tanking it and we continue damaging it, we miss the chest some of the time. It doesn't seem to matter if the tank dies at 80% or 40%. If we stop damage, raise the tank and let them re-aggro, we have got the chest 100% of the time.
 Ragnarok.Narce
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By Ragnarok.Narce 2023-11-03 12:12:45
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I'm starting to lean towards this as well. My LS usually has two groups running, with one using a PLD. The group with a PLD never has issues with this, while the other group used to have some problems. Initially we thought this may be due to skillchains, but even removing that as a factor it wasn't consistent. After changing to one DD holding aggro while the others use Sanguine Blade and Leaden Salute from the rear until about 40%, and making sure it's killed with a WS from the rear, there hasn't been an issue. I've updated the post with what I believe to be the most accurate information as of right now.
 Ragnarok.Narce
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By Ragnarok.Narce 2023-11-13 23:43:38
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Taint said: »
A list of weapon skill combos for bosses would be a nice addition, but require lots of input/configurations.

Ex. Gartell: WAR Impulse, DRK Fimb, BRD Savage, RDM Black Halo

It’s probably the number one question on each boss in PUGs

After shuffling around jobs and members in order to get two groups going for Sortie, I'm starting to understand just how useful this information would be. If people could post weapon skills they use for their bosses in order to make elements and/or avoid them, it would be great information to add.

A/E bosses (avoids skillchains with water element; most of these can go together to make Light):
Savage Blade, Upheaval (w/Aeonic), Black Halo, Victory Smite

C/G bosses (avoids skillchains with dark element; most of these can go together to make Light):
Savage Blade, Black Halo, Last Stand (w/Aeonic), Upheaval, Victory Smite

B/F bosses (doesn't make any skillchains unfortunately, but at least avoids making thunder and wind):
Victory Smite, Resolution, Savage Blade, Exenterator
 Asura.Dexprozius
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By Asura.Dexprozius 2023-11-14 00:45:13
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Isn't it:
---A/E, simple light skillchain with as long a multi step as possible, melts to fire and earth damage, so its safest do to the light path to avoid hitting it with Darkness (which contains water damage that would heal/enrage it)

---C/G, Spam highest damage weaponskills as fast as possible to avoid his TP drain move/debuffs threatening a 3minute wipe. You could coordinate a skillchain that is light based which avoids healing him sure... but more often than not wouldnt that lower your dps or have people over 1k risking getting wiped to 0?

---B/F, Wasn't this always Spam High damage Darkness skillchains on him to Blue !! proc him and force him to switch hands/prevent him from gaining permanent tiers of SDT + Atk boost? Maybe I'm misunderstanding this guy's mechanics....

---D/G, Spamming highest damage WS's, Avoiding skillchains specifically to avoid hitting him with the wrong element, as you'll have one of the party members watching his TP moves specifically to slap him with the counter element to proc him to maybe weaken Vivisection and delay his buildup of SDT
I could be wrong on this one, my static hasn't done him with a Melee comp yet... but he's fully resistant to Light and Dark so it also dis-incentivizes you from creating big skillchains.
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By SimonSes 2023-11-14 02:17:01
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Asura.Dexprozius said: »
but he's fully resistant to Light and Dark so it also dis-incentivizes you from creating big skillchains.

When you do Light or Darkness it will use element, which is the least resisted by target (weakest resist rank). So Light skillchain will be absorbed when Aita is in fire or thunder modes (since then fire or thunder is lowest resist rank), but if Aita is in for example earth mode, Light skillchain will do wind damage and will be very effective, so it's possible to just do Light skillchains for earth/water/ice modes and Darkness sc for fire/thunder modes on Aita.
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