The Odyssey - || Strategy And Discussion ||

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The Odyssey - || Strategy and Discussion ||
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 Lakshmi.Buukki
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2020-07-09 11:59:28
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We are going to have to get creative with soloing. Jobs like NIN MNK DRK might be better for NMs depending on what their TP moves can be. Camahueto is just single target attacks, so holding 2-3 on NIN should be fine. MNK or DRK should have enough HP to get through it as well. But some of the other NMs like the Antica or Worm might be a pain with their magic casting and constantly wiping shadows etc. Might need to get on RDM, or pair up this time around.

What I wonder is, will MM have an enhanced effect from B than whatever was carried over from A.
 Asura.Saevel
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By Asura.Saevel 2020-07-09 12:12:53
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Is there any reason to even bother with NM's other then worthless trust levels that only exist inside Odyssea?
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By Shichishito 2020-07-09 12:24:35
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i think they drop a couple of singles and a box, maybe even a chance at a large box?
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By Pantafernando 2020-07-09 12:39:16
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Yes, extra drops and a “nice” 1 jp at the end if you hit the exit after killing one.

Though, its interesting how short on information Bg has about odyssey NM what is explained with how most people farming dont bother with Nm, but everyone aiming MM do care with those NM.

For example, it doesnt explain if there is any benefit in using izzat to pop NM. you can compare poping Nm with mats with opening chests with keys, both are shortcuts to izzat farming, but there is a risk associated to opening chests with keys. So, suposelly poping NM with izzat should have a similar benefit (like no aura, or no add?)

This is unclear on BG. Im not saying what i said is true.
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2020-07-09 13:33:54
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Asura.Saevel said: »
Is there any reason to even bother with NM's other then worthless trust levels that only exist inside Odyssea?


In short, the answer right now is no. They serve no purpose other than additional ways to level your Moogle Mastery and progressive zone progress. If you are multiboxing or using real players, MM serves no purpose for you because MM has no benefit to actual players. The NMs don't drop anything outside of scales and boxes, which are probably more effort than simply key farming or killing mimics as a group. Successive NM kills also lowers the cost of Unity Materials needed to spawn the NM. That probably doesn't mean much right now either.

I imagine at some point it would be wise to add something else to these NMs, which will annoy some people when those NM kills or MM actually means something, as they will have to backtrack to progress.

Shichishito said: »
maybe even a chance at a large box?

I have over 120 NM kills from Odyssey and have never once seen a Large Box drop, nor has it ever been reported

Pantafernando said: »
For example, it doesnt explain if there is any benefit in using izzat to pop NM. you can compare poping Nm with mats with opening chests with keys, both are shortcuts to izzat farming, but there is a risk associated to opening chests with keys. So, suposelly poping NM with izzat should have a similar benefit (like no aura, or no add?)

This is unclear on BG. Im not saying what i said is true.

I havent observed any benefit to using Izzat to pop from Ethereal Junctions vs using UNM mats. I wasted a few Izzat popping some NMs in the past instead of using a unity mat and could not see any difference. I think the purpose was to provide two ways to pop NMs, similar how there are two ways to open chests. Izzat is the universal currency you can use to get stuff done in Odyssey, but you can skip past Izzat need by just bringing your own keys and materials, and spend the izzat popping extra chests. It's really just about giving players multiple options to get stuff done in odyssey, since keys and UNM mats cost time/money, but farming izzat can freely be done from within the zone
 Asura.Saevel
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By Asura.Saevel 2020-07-09 13:39:40
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Shichishito said: »
i think they drop a couple of singles and a box, maybe even a chance at a large box?

I get that from a single chest and a couple of keys that takes a few seconds, can be done solo and has very little risk associated with it.

Trying to see if any reason to not just THF key everything for the materials for upgrades.

Lakshmi.Buukki said: »
I imagine at some point it would be wise to add something else to these NMs, which will annoy some people when those NM kills or MM actually means something, as they will have to backtrack to progress.

Well I'd like there to be a reason to do something in this event other then key boxes. I played around with the first version for about a week before I just ran around keying stuff.
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2020-07-09 13:42:45
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Asura.Saevel said: »
Shichishito said: »
i think they drop a couple of singles and a box, maybe even a chance at a large box?

I get that from a single chest and a couple of keys that takes a few seconds, can be done solo and has very little risk associated with it.

Trying to see if any reason to not just THF key everything for the materials for upgrades.

There is a risk associated with THF key farming, a Mimic that can kill you and end your run if you don't handle it properly. Most people just do the THF method because MM or NM kills has not proven to do anything just yet.

This is actually how I do my Odyseey runs: I start out getting a few NM kills, but then on bored days where I don't feel like fighting, I key spam. You need to effectively do both to level MM anyways, but if someone is not interested in MM, Key Farming > NM Farming.

Asura.Saevel said: »
Well I'd like there to be a reason to do something in this event other then key boxes. I played around with the first version for about a week before I just ran around keying stuff.


SE should have added nice direct drops to these NMs, it would have made sense and incentivized people doing it. Right now, I have not seen any reason besides MM and UNM mat cost lowering.
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By Pantafernando 2020-07-09 13:48:00
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Just theorycrafting but if you can make a party and just cruel joke everything in zone, you can finish with 2.1M per char when you hit the exit.

Though, it should be impossible to actually kill that many mobs, but extra cash never hurt, and this is a clean cash.
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By Asura.Saevel 2020-07-09 13:55:42
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Lakshmi.Buukki said: »
There is a risk associated with THF key farming, a Mimic that can kill you and end your run if you don't handle it properly.

There is risk walking outside your front door.

The key here is how much risk and vs how much reward. Key farming has minimal risk with the exact same reward as killing NM's. Key farming is also much much faster, stupid fast. Awhile back I posted my daily run results / averages.

Now while there are techniques to mitigate mimic wipes I found just having a second WHM account logged in to be sufficient to prevent run ending wipes. In fact after the first few runs where I worked out the kinks, I never had another wipe again for a couple of months until I acquired everything I wanted and stopped running altogether.

Lakshmi.Buukki said: »
You need to effectively do both to level MM anyways


My point is that MM levels are worthless and any effect spent on them equally worthless. I mean if they effected trusts outside of Odyssea then there could be a reason but as of now it's a waste of time.
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By Shichishito 2020-07-09 13:56:48
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by trading unity mats to pop NMs you can choose what NM pops, the izzat one is random from the list of NMs and some are more dangerous than others.

if you are confident you can take on what ever pops and there are no chests nearby its another source for upgrade materials.
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By SimonSes 2020-07-09 13:58:47
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Pantafernando said: »
Just theorycrafting but if you can make a party and just cruel joke everything in zone, you can finish with 2.1M per char when you hit the exit.

Though, it should be impossible to actually kill that many mobs, but extra cash never hurt, and this is a clean cash.

My friend who has more experience with Cruel Joking Odyssey said that even in A, dark based mobs were resisting it. It also has no half resist state and I think macc is capped at 95%, so there is always 5% chance to miss some mob too (I guess you could kill those few normal way tho).
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By SimonSes 2020-07-09 14:03:57
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Asura.Saevel said: »
My point is that MM levels are worthless and any effect spent on them equally worthless. I mean if they effected trusts outside of Odyssea then there could be a reason but as of now it's a waste of time.

Its always a waste of time until its suddenly needed. Its possible that with enough MM, some trusts can be almost as useful as players and not everyone has access to 6/6 group. There is also possibility that MM can have bonuses for players in higher floors. Good luck catching up with 40+ MM levels then.
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By Pantafernando 2020-07-09 14:06:46
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Also, Sheol B seems to have more compact maps and 1 less floor. So, 6 floors with 3 chests each means that you just need to open 18 chests.

Probably you can get done quite fast. The remaining time you either warp out, kill fodders for extra cash or there is just NM to do.

I guess if you have 2 real thfs you could even split, leaving even more time to do shitz
 Asura.Eiryl
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By Asura.Eiryl 2020-07-09 14:08:45
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SimonSes said: »
Asura.Saevel said: »
My point is that MM levels are worthless and any effect spent on them equally worthless. I mean if they effected trusts outside of Odyssea then there could be a reason but as of now it's a waste of time.

Its always a waste of time until its suddenly needed. Its possible that with enough MM, some trusts can be almost as useful as players and not everyone has access to 6/6 group. There is also possibility that MM can have bonuses for players in higher floors. Good luck catching up with 40+ MM levels then.

...or they just bail on it and all the work you did ranking MM was for nothing

These grand plans for some neo-shinryu ilvl 199 that you have to unlock MM100 to be allowed to enter when they hit sheol F but then decide they don't have enough resources to bother... kinda like unlocking the highest ilvl infailsion only to have it reset
 
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By Pantafernando 2020-07-09 14:12:49
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Btw, are the NMs ilv affected by floor?

Like popping Nm in higher floors will have stronger NMs?
 
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 Lakshmi.Buukki
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2020-07-09 14:18:25
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SimonSes said: »
Asura.Saevel said: »
My point is that MM levels are worthless and any effect spent on them equally worthless. I mean if they effected trusts outside of Odyssea then there could be a reason but as of now it's a waste of time.

Its always a waste of time until its suddenly needed. Its possible that with enough MM, some trusts can be almost as useful as players and not everyone has access to 6/6 group. There is also possibility that MM can have bonuses for players in higher floors. Good luck catching up with 40+ MM levels then.

You also wont be able to cap MM in just one zone. You have to do A to get 14-15 (which will take a very long time), and B is whatever is on top of that. So can't just spam B and hit 30 or whatever, if the cap goes that high.
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2020-07-09 14:31:21
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Pantafernando said: »
Btw, are the NMs ilv affected by floor?

Like popping Nm in higher floors will have stronger NMs?

Yes, and I have a feeling the drop rate on boxes (or even large boxes) is greater the higher up you pop NMs from. It could be that NMs on higher floors do drop more boxes, making fighting them not worthless at all. And they do give you transponders, so clearly they want you to save time traveling directly there. I would not be surprised if fighting nostos/NMs up higher gave better drops than grinding the lower floors. Just nobody has tried it yet
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 Carbuncle.Nynja
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By Carbuncle.Nynja 2020-07-09 14:40:24
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Asura.Saevel said: »
My point is that MM levels are worthless and any effect spent on them equally worthless. I mean if they effected trusts outside of Odyssea then there could be a reason but as of now it's a waste of time.

 Asura.Saevel
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By Asura.Saevel 2020-07-09 14:44:00
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Lakshmi.Buukki said: »
SimonSes said: »
Asura.Saevel said: »
My point is that MM levels are worthless and any effect spent on them equally worthless. I mean if they effected trusts outside of Odyssea then there could be a reason but as of now it's a waste of time.

Its always a waste of time until its suddenly needed. Its possible that with enough MM, some trusts can be almost as useful as players and not everyone has access to 6/6 group. There is also possibility that MM can have bonuses for players in higher floors. Good luck catching up with 40+ MM levels then.

You also wont be able to cap MM in just one zone. You have to do A to get 14-15 (which will take a very long time), and B is whatever is on top of that. So can't just spam B and hit 30 or whatever, if the cap goes that high.

Leveling MM is just killing NM's in a group. If there was ever a "reason" for MM levels, it would be child's play to round up some friends and just murder NM's. Chests give practically nothing to MM levels, killing monsters gives a little, killing NM's gives more with a very large bonus for the first time a particular one is killed.

I mean you guys are here talking about "solo" killing NM's with trusts. Imagine how it would be with a real Yag WHM, real Tank to super tank mobs, real DD to splatter everything, real BRD and COR along with a real Idris GEO. Opposition would just melt and everyone gets the same amount of MM "points" so more = better. Where as scale farming is the exact opposite, less people to split it with means more personal haul.

They designed this event in such a way as to encourage solo and multi-box play. Thus me wishing they would add a real reason to do it in groups.
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By Pantafernando 2020-07-09 14:45:02
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There is a different concept though.

While from start there was some expectation about wha would be the ??? Final prize, so far, the omly expectation with MM is trust enpowerment.

So, the bet that it will become sometthing better in the future, TODAY, seems to have same chance to just stay like this.
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By Asura.Saevel 2020-07-09 14:58:10
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If they do anything more in the future it won't revolve around MM levels. At most it'll require having "cleared" each previous Sheol to get access to some sort of super fight that drops stuff we want. I mean I guess MM would matter if someone wanted to solo that ... but seeing Sheol B is already more dangerous then Sheol A, I don't see soloing with Trusts happening on the mega boss of the final zone.

Now farming that megaboss for "Shiny Breatplate of Godliness +1" would likely be worth doing in a group, provided it's not another Lilith scenario.
 
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 Lakshmi.Buukki
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2020-07-09 15:08:50
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Pantafernando said: »
While from start there was some expectation about wha would be the ??? Final prize, so far, the omly expectation with MM is trust enpowerment.

You think this, but then you look at Mog Gardens and Coalitions and they found a way to crowbar it into some very good rewards, and there was no end goal with these when they came out. They just go any direction they want, you never know how it is going to turn out. Random questlines they toss out there and find a way to connect the two.

Anyways, I haven't said one method is better than another method, and bringing up a group concept into it is irrelevant because (1) not everyone has access to multibox (2) not everyone has access to groups that can go every single day. (3) whether you key farm now or next month matters not. It took 3 months to get the next zone and I was done my key farming and all of my upgrades in a month, it was really nothing left to do. If someone wants to grind out NMs solo (because of #2) so they are not wasting their KI daily, they can level MM in the meantime. Obviously if you are there for scales and hides primarily, you would go THF and there is no question about that.

Now they brought up MM again in this latest digest and extended it's effects to the new zone. It would be easy for them to tie that trait together somehow to something else, or they could abandon it entirely. But if the MM trait can go up to something like 50 or whatever and it makes Tenzen hit like a R15 SAM, I'm all for it.
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By Pantafernando 2020-07-09 15:09:58
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And another theorycrafting would be how further will go Sheol.

Considering A and B had each 3 different type of beastman race, SE can extended odyssey till Sheol F, so that all 18 beastman race are included.
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By SimonSes 2020-07-09 15:17:12
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You actually need everything to cap MM XV. There are thresholds for each activity that you need to reach. At least thats my understanding from what I have seen in thread. You can also make 14 NMs top during one run and afaik you need to kill each NM 16 times for MM XV, so you need like 20 runs minimum just for NMs? Then you need like 2000 fodders, 16 aurums etc. I might be a little off in aome of those numbers. Correct me if Im wrong.
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2020-07-09 15:19:28
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As far as I'm aware, Geri is the only person to confirm MM15, and it requires 16 Aurum boxes from his post.

He doesn't have 16+ of each NM, so it looks like the upgrade from MM in A for NMs is gotten by killing each once, then again 6x. There could be another tier at 10+/15+ etc, but nobody has done that yet. For comparison's sake, I have MM14 with 1 Aurum Strongbox, nowhere near the Nostos he has, but similar NM count. So it could be Nostos + Aurum, but its likely the Aurum alone that triggered it.
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By Asura.Saevel 2020-07-09 15:45:45
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Lakshmi.Buukki said: »
As far as I'm aware, Geri is the only person to confirm MM15, and it requires 16 Aurum boxes from his post.

He doesn't have 16+ of each NM, so it looks like the upgrade from MM in A for NMs is gotten by killing each once, then again 6x. There could be another tier at 10+/15+ etc, but nobody has done that yet. For comparison's sake, I have MM14 with 1 Aurum Strongbox, nowhere near the Nostos he has, but similar NM count. So it could be Nostos + Aurum, but its likely the Aurum alone that triggered it.

It's a point system, each of these actions gives you invisible "points" that are added together, likely with some sort of cap on each category. The biggest so far seems to be NM's with the first time kill being worth more then the rest. Each tier of MM requires you collect a certain amount of these invisible "points" with higher tiers requiring even more.

This isn't the first time nor the last that SE will implement this sort of system.
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By Asura.Geriond 2020-07-09 15:59:12
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It's not a point system. If it were, people would not be consistently reporting the same MM level ups at exactly the same NM counts at 6 kills regardless of how low or high their other stats are.

Each MM level has a list of invisible minimum requirements.
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