Raetic Weapons Testing / Discussions

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Raetic weapons testing / discussions
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By Afania 2017-10-30 01:24:25
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Since someone asked on Reddit and I can't seem to find the answers anywhere, I ended up testing them myself and I would like to share the test results here hoping to answer some of the questions people may have.

Everything is still kinda wip atm.

Q1: How does mp drain to DA really works.
A: Based on current result, it drains 5% of current max mp and 1 mp spent add 1% DA.

Q2: Does it proc offhand.
A: Yes

Q3: How does it stack with other sources of multi attack.
A:Based on result from Chiaia it can only proc on 1st swing.

Q4:How does HQ version work.
A: Based on results from Snaps, it procs on every single attack round for the first attack in the round. If you're offhanding it, it procs on the first strike for your offhand. The extra Store TP = MP Consumed/2 (half the double attack rate.)

Q5: Is it worth it to sacrifice buff slots for refresh.
Looking at every refresh buffs:
RDM refresh 3: 15
+8 brd ballad x3: 30 (I think)
Crooked +7 no.11 evokers: 14
Entrust Indi-refresh: 6?? (I think)
Aspir samba: varies

Total refresh: 65+
Effectively 65%+ DA every 3 sec using 3 song slots, 1 roll slot and 1 entrust bubble slots.

Drain da MP for 50 STP plz!!!

Q6: Can Raetic bangles proc on magic damage?
A: Yes.


Will update the info on this page as I go, or if anyone else willing to test them.

Any opinions are welcomed.
-----------------------
Test #1:
Job: RDM in escha (so I can get as much refresh as possible)

Completely naked, 0 multi attack in gears/spell and zero haste too.

Full mp pool: 1246 Mp pool after 1 swing: 1184 62 mp drained.

Only swing at the enemy at 1246 mp, then I turn and wait until mp full again to do next swing so every swing drains 62 mp.

Result after 100 swings: DA proc: 60, no proc: 40.

This result is extremely close to amount of mp drained so proc rate is very likely to match mp drained. If you lose 60 mp then you get 60% proc rate etc. Unless someone else has different result.

Test #2:
Mainhand lv1 excalipoor offhand raetic so I can tell which swing came from offhand with dmg differences. Once again 0 multi attack in gears and spell. DA does proc on offhand swings.

Test #3
COR/RDM, 539 full mp, 513 after 1 swing. 26 MP drained.
DA proc: 26, no proc: 80. Proc rate 24.5% after 106 swings.

Test #4
Raetic Bangle: 1310 max MP, got hit 125 times, proc 12 times.

More to come, hopefully.
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 Asura.Sechs
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By Asura.Sechs 2017-10-30 03:56:28
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Thanks for the test. Don't forget Aspir Samba. It's weak, but it helps and procs on every hit, multiattacks as well.
I think at least?

Also there's stuff like Tizona for BLU.
I guess this makes Raetic weapon a bit more appealing for Tizona MH BLUs compared to others?
Also sounds good for short fights where you can't put AM3 up on start. By the end of teh fight your MP will be to zero but the mob will be dead so... there's that.

Not sure I see it viable for longer fights where you have to sacrifice too many buffs to get that refresh. Altough I suppose you could factor a pre-pop BRD giving you 3x Ballads...
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By Afania 2017-10-30 04:00:11
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Asura.Sechs said: »
Thanks for the test. Don't forget Aspir Samba. It's weak, but it helps and procs on every hit, multiattacks as well.
I think at least?

Also there's stuff like Tizona for BLU.
I guess this makes Raetic weapon a bit more appealing for Tizona MH BLUs compared to others?
Also sounds good for short fights where you can't put AM3 up on start. By the end of teh fight your MP will be to zero but the mob will be dead so... there's that.

Not sure I see it viable for longer fights where you have to sacrifice too many buffs to get that refresh. Altough I suppose you could factor a pre-pop BRD giving you 3x Ballads...

Oh yes, I was thinking about samba on my way home but I forgot them. Thanks for reminder!

As for the ballad....HM+ haste 2 caps haste so if you don't need acc then it's ballad v.s attack songs, or 1 ballad 2 attack songs?
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By Asura.Sechs 2017-10-30 04:11:24
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There's also Stat songs. Granted they're very weak but they still add additional damage when you're acc/att capped.

On some fights you might want to use buff slots for carols too. Albumen comes to mind for instance. Altough... I guess that's a very situational niche, not different from stuff like Scherzo, guess it's no use to be factoring nichey fights like those.
"normally" you don't really require song slots for Carols or Scherzo.


There's also Embrava btw. Caps at 6mp/tic iir.
Last but not least there's SMN's Diabolos Favor, but that's not really practical I would say.


Edit:
Btw I really wonder if "en-" stuff like Sambas, Enspells etc can proc during Raetic's DA procs. I suppose they can, but then again it would be cool to check to make sure.
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By Asura.Psylo 2017-10-31 05:36:39
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I have made some test on raetic bangles (NQ) so :
- Mp is absorbed even if you have stoneskin up
- i need more test to know the % of recover but seem equal to mp absorbed.
- if you have a group of tiny monster like 10/12 on you, you mp is totally wipe in less than one minute (not good for kitting a large group so ...)

The only good point on this gear is the HUGE meva on it and if you don't to hold a group.
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By Antisense 2017-10-31 09:11:19
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For Q3 we can use observations from lv75 virtue weapons as a starting point (3 attacks/round is possible when DA > 0%). Once it is confirmed whether 3 attacks/round is possible (not dual-wielding) then you can narrow down the possibilities.
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By Sylph.Reain 2017-10-31 09:21:12
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Asura.Psylo said: »
I have made some test on raetic bangles (NQ) so :
- Mp is absorbed even if you have stoneskin up
- i need more test to know the % of recover but seem equal to mp absorbed.
- if you have a group of tiny monster like 10/12 on you, you mp is totally wipe in less than one minute (not good for kitting a large group so ...)

The only good point on this gear is the HUGE meva on it and if you don't to hold a group.

Has pretty high AGI for hands slot also for the jobs that can wear it.
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By Leviathan.Brotherhood 2017-10-31 09:24:57
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For dagger alone I think you also have Energy steal/drain so if the damage is decent, and Mp is really needed can use that for Mp.
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By clearlyamule 2017-10-31 10:41:07
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Asura.Psylo said: »
I have made some test on raetic bangles (NQ) so :
- Mp is absorbed even if you have stoneskin up
- i need more test to know the % of recover but seem equal to mp absorbed.
- if you have a group of tiny monster like 10/12 on you, you mp is totally wipe in less than one minute (not good for kitting a large group so ...)

The only good point on this gear is the HUGE meva on it and if you don't to hold a group.
Should be decent swap in when you know a tank buster move is coming
 Asura.Chiaia
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By Asura.Chiaia 2017-10-31 10:50:34
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Did some light testing on BLU using the parse addon.
I was able to get 4 hit when only wearing TA gear and 5 hit when wearing Quad attack gear with NQ Blade on BLU.
Based on the % I would say it can only proc on the 1st swing. I'll try some more testing when I can log in some extra forms of refresh then just my ghetto alt brd.

+8 brd ballad x3: 30 (I think)
Entrust Indi-refresh: 6?? (I think)
correct for both
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By Afania 2017-10-31 22:12:59
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@ Psylo and Chiaia:

Thanks for the testimonial, updated them to 1st post so info are easier to find.
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By Fenrir.Skarwind 2017-10-31 22:34:04
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Thanks I posted a few times in the DRK thread. But no answers.

I figured Scythe might be real fun to use.
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By Afania 2017-10-31 22:49:02
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Well drk has Anguta for more DMG, STP and tp bonus and war bst doesn't have mp so.....

SCYTHE BLM YEAHhhh.
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By Fenrir.Skarwind 2017-10-31 22:49:53
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Afania said: »
Well drk has Anguta for more DMG, STP and tp bonus and war bst doesn't have mp so.....

SCYTHE BLM YEAHhhh.
Im not serious enough about DRK to make Anguta :(
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By Afania 2017-11-02 00:51:11
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Updated Test #3 to 1st post with much smaller mp pool. I can pretty much confirm 1 mp drain = 1% DA now.
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By Fenrir.Snaps 2017-11-02 09:58:12
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WAR gets around 500 mp in escha with capped vorseals, merits, raetic algol, and flamma head/feet. Even without the hq that's 25 additional da. I imagine it's the best zerg weapon unless there's something we don't know yet. HQ seems very good for any job that can use it.
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By Ramuh.Austar 2017-11-02 11:50:32
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since it appears to work like the old jailer weapons, ~25% bonus on raetic would be nice, but it makes me wonder if the additional hit from raetic gets DA damage boost?
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By Fenrir.Snaps 2017-11-02 11:54:25
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It does seem jailer weapon like. I'm also wondering if the store tp on the hq only applies to the extra hit and if it can proceed on wd
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By Fenrir.Snaps 2017-11-06 23:12:32
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Did some testing just now with Raetic Algol

- The additional hit is separate from Double Attack/Triple Attack (meaning you can hit 3x if you have 100% DA and 0 TA)
- It doesn't proc on WS

I don't have the HQ yet so I can't test how the Store TP works, but I'm guessing it's similar to the DA but that it caps at 50 and only applies to the additional hit. Provided your mana is getting restored somehow (Fenrir buffs, refilled between escha pops, etc.) it seems to be WAR's best weapon. My WAR has 711 MP in Escha. Even the NQ dunks Ragnarok/Zulfiqar/Montante +1. Probably BiS for DRK too, and it might even be competitive with Lionheart.
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 Asura.Warusha
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By Asura.Warusha 2017-11-06 23:17:37
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Someone go farm Infinity Cores plx.
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By Afania 2017-11-06 23:39:50
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Fenrir.Snaps said: »
Did some testing just now with Raetic Algol

- The additional hit is separate from Double Attack/Triple Attack (meaning you can hit 3x if you have 100% DA and 0 TA)
- It doesn't proc on WS

I don't have the HQ yet so I can't test how the Store TP works, but I'm guessing it's similar to the DA but that it caps at 50 and only applies to the additional hit. Provided your mana is getting restored somehow (Fenrir buffs, refilled between escha pops, etc.) it seems to be WAR's best weapon. My WAR has 711 MP in Escha. Even the NQ dunks Ragnarok/Zulfiqar/Montante +1. Probably BiS for DRK too, and it might even be competitive with Lionheart.


How do you get the conclusion that NQ is competitive to lionheart? Not saying it's right or wrong, but I'm not aware of spreadsheet/sim exist for it and the only way to find out is manual calculation and Id like to see math behind it.
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By Fenrir.Snaps 2017-11-07 00:03:12
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My RUN has > 500 MP in Escha. That's a 75% chance of an extra strike. If you have the HQ it's probably 50 STP on that hit too. If you have Samurai Roll up you'll get a decent chunk of TP return from that. Two of those should be more than 500 TP although Lionheart RUN can get enough to make WS -> DA -> WS fairly common. I would expect Lionheart to perform better but it's a decent option and might be handy in cases (Teles, sandworm, etc.) where you don't want the Light skillchain property. If I can obtain one I will parse it on Neak and see what the results are.
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By Fenrir.Snaps 2017-11-07 11:28:53
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Did more testing. Seems there's some erroneous information in the OP.

MP Total - 371
MP after each attack round - 371, 353, 317, 299, 281, 263, 245, 227

The delta is 18 MP for each round, which is floor(371 * .05). So the effect does not taper off.

Getting a supply of Rune Algols has been challenging. They are not on the AH very frequently and trying to get them from the Strange Apparatus yielded poor results. We tried Dangruf Wadi and only got 1 out of maybe 80 trades. I was going by the info on JP wiki but it seems the new weapons can also drop in different zones. I spoke with someone who has put a few on the AH and he said he couldn't remember which zone he got them from, but said he knows he tried Ordelle's Caves and The Eldieme Necropolis at least. I'll try Ordelle's next.
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By Afania 2017-11-07 11:45:56
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I changed the wording of OP so there are no confusion about it.
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By clearlyamule 2017-11-07 11:49:56
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Each apparatus has the same drop pool except clusters I think but you don't get those with doctor status
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By Odin.Geriond 2017-11-07 12:19:13
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Just spreadsheeted Raetic Scythe/+1 vs Anguta vs Caladbolg for my gearsets. For Raetic, I am assuming Entropy is used every 5th WS to keep MP up, with Cross Reaper as the main WS.

Non-zerg situation (attack uncapped, accuracy capped, chaos/sam roll):

Raetic Scythe: 3160
Raetic Scythe +1: 3569
Anguta: 3018
Caladbolg (Torcleaver, AM3): 3951

Zerg situation (attack capped, accuracy capped, fighter/sam roll, warcry, crystal blessing):

Raetic Scythe: 6866
Raetic Scythe +1: 7477
Anguta: 7129
Caladbolg (Resolution with AM3 pre-prepped): 8426
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 Fenrir.Snaps
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By Fenrir.Snaps 2017-11-07 12:29:19
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clearlyamule said: »
Each apparatus has the same drop pool except clusters I think but you don't get those with doctor status

Not true. Each apparatus has different rates for different weapons. Wadi is hth (we got 14 of them I think)

http://wiki.ffo.jp/html/3216.html
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By clearlyamule 2017-11-07 19:46:46
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Fenrir.Snaps said: »
clearlyamule said: »
Each apparatus has the same drop pool except clusters I think but you don't get those with doctor status

Not true. Each apparatus has different rates for different weapons. Wadi is hth (we got 14 of them I think)

http://wiki.ffo.jp/html/3216.html
Damn jps hogging all the good info. I blame bg wiki for this one as apparently even old wiki knew better lol
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By Odin.Geriond 2017-11-07 22:17:10
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Speaking of the Strange Apparatuses, did anyone figure out the math behind getting Administrator?
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