Jobs That Need Nerf

I hope they nerf BST so people realize how OP sch sc+ manaburn setup are.

Not if you're nuking the wrong element like some jap's and take 20min to kill T2 with 8 people.

I'm starting to think he doesn't even play the game.

DD's are so squishy, including SAM.

1) We don't want to back to everyone /nin. Nin is the Shadow user, I think to make Ninja a viable tank again then pretty much all AOE (Definaltly ANY kinda of -ga Magic) should be eaten by 4 Shadows with Yonin up facing the mob. ~~(SE might see that as to much however because Nin is creeping up as a very powerful DD on the Innin side with the latest gear releases and change in the game mechanic's. The job's speed, combined with all the Triple att, additional crit+ and crit dmg+ gear, Utsu: San and PLD's being able to hold hate meaning no more mob's spinning around in circle's - staying away from conal TP moves etc and getting the maximum out of Innin, Haste2 (a massive 1 spell speed buff) its fairly high acc and generous +att & +acc in JP gifts means the job is creeping back from absoute bottom. Has risen far up from the bottom.

2) DD's are so Squishy and one-shot-ko. I know there are -DT & -PDT sets but really, some NM's are spammy because of all the TP feed they are getting so I think they need a solution. Perhaps There needs to be a real difference in HP between the various job's, and i'm not talking about HP-Bonus. SE needs to look at each job with the aim at increasing DD's HP substantially to near that of pet's.

In any case, SE needs to decide how they want their final game to look like. I really can't see them wanting Beastmaster's to rule the game once content is complete. I'd let people ride the wagon, because I can feel a sweeping wind passing over the game soon. A wind that will have ppl who still follow the game wannting to return to see what all the fuss is about.

Well in fairness you can use five before starting to wait. After you use the first ready move the timer starts counting down and due to ja delay its usually after the fifth ready move that you have to start waiting the full ten seconds.

at least this one requirs some coordination and a tank actually! Obviously also buffs and is only viable in 50% of the current content where magic dmg doesnt suck. there is plenty of content where the magic burst setup with SCH doesnt work at all due to magic immunity or the mob haveing some insane high m.acc mdt/mdb traits.
Besides on really high end stuff you need at least 2 geos to even get remotly good results on nukes and if the tank goes down there isnt a pet holding stuff off from you.

so yeah not comparable to BST setups that circumvent 90% of all the gimmicks.

Sounds like ff14

war, drk, drg, pup, geo, whm, dnc, thf, brd, cor, blm, rdm, and run all these jobs need a nerf. SE only need to buff trust with a permanent double hp/mp/stats and give brd trusts extra songs and +3 on songs. cor trust need +pot ring, geo trust need idris, all mage trust need to have gearswap with AF+Relic+Empy sets, DD trusts have them all doubled dmg and finally Tank trusts must have REM with gear swap. That will fix the game and make everyone happy.

Current relevant content: Vargary/escha/SR magic work for all of them and is most likely the best/easiest.

Also T3 have been done with manaburn setup + trust tank!

SR used only a melee setup (never mana burn), because arciela and teodor can be a ***.
some escha T2 resist magic to hell and dont even take much magic dmg.
90% hardmode mission battles are not MB friendly on T+
Vagary Fomor room is doable like that, but chances are your mages are gonna get slaughtered with one mistake.

List goes on.

That's probably where I got it from because I know that a BST can start a fight and get five to six high damage moves off really fast before their damage starts to decline. With a COR + GEO that means most things are dead by then or shortly thereafter. I didn't realize that 10 seconds was the floor, thought it was more like 15~20. 10 Seconds on a 20~25K Razor Fang is pretty stupid though.

And for those wondering where I got that 20~25K razor fangs from, my own eyeballs doing Escha and above content. I've already listed the numbers.

11 Beast Roll with the Ring + Drachen or Companions depending on how much acc is needed.

Geo-Fraility + Indo-Torpor + Dia II from a GEO who doesn't suck. Absolutely no reason not to have 800+ skill and Dunna.

Blackbeard has 1246 attack at iLevel 119 along with a 60% attack bonus.

http://www.bluegartr.com/threads/114636-Monster-Avatar-Pet-damage?p=6266182&viewfull=1#post6266182

Now lets add that Beast Roll which gives another 56%

Blackbeard now has north of 2300 attack, without any other +pet gear. A decent BST is going to have +Pet Attack/Accuracy which pumps this number up considerably after all the percentages are added.

Then with those defense downs reducing the NMs defense, you get some really silly ratios. Regular players are limited to 2.25 absolute cap, which isn't realized because instead of Geo-Fraility / Torpor we get Vex + Attunement so we can survive and not be rendered stupid by the NM's status ailments. Not a problem with pets, Black Beard has 4800 HP and practically all it's damage is tied to that BST's ready JA who is safely out of range, they can enjoy their 4.0 cap. Also Black Beard is getting that nice 50%+ pet DT, while mere players are limited to 50% tops. Black Beard's offensive stats aren't being horribly gimped by wearing -DT gear like a players would be. Not to mention that as true 119 creatures they would also have 119 resistances, while players only get psuedo resistances from gear while still being level 99. Oh and lets throw in fencer effects along with the BST emp gear, every Ready usage is at 1000 or more TP. It's functionally the same as getting 1000TP every 10s without needed to hit the monster, and thus not feeding it TP.

Like I said before, all pro no con. There is zero downside to using an army of BST's to kill things. There is no limitation. The pets are stronger then players, have more HP then players, are infinitely replaceable, and overall they are just that much better in real use scenarios. Those who are abusing this design flaw are trying to wanting to keep it around for as long as possible. It's just too easy to abuse to get gear and once SE changes it we'll be back to either using melee's or having to setup a SC + MB. SC + MB has it's own issues, but that's more a function of mRatio not having a known cap along with +MB Damage stacking. At least SC + MB requires coordination and teamwork to do.

Seriously, for all those cry baby out there. Answer this question, Why the *** you care how others want to approach the game?. You have 100% control in what jobs to invite, if you don't like easy strategy with bst then go setup something else. Are you just like to cry because there are more people able to get the gears and you don't get the gigantic epeen feel because of it?.

I'm playing FFXIV now and it's not really like that. It's obvious the game was designed with content tiers in mind so the effect isn't nearly as dramatic as FFXI. Also the fighting is much more focused around tactics and teamwork then just "make my stats bigger then his stats so I win more dice rolls" that is FFXI.

Honestly I believe FFXI had too many different cooks for it's own good. Each iteration of lead developer had their own vision about how content should be designed and played, and at each stage a radical change in FFXI resulted in this current extreme unbalance. We still have ***for HP, because the original developers didn't want number bloating but the monsters also had limited damage output. Then Abyssea happened where the monsters were given big numbers and big status effects, but the players were given the ability to counter that and make their own stats high. Then post abyssea where the monsters kept their big advantage but the players were stripped of it and were expected to "make it up" with buffing jobs and temp item usage. That was voidwatch era. Then SOA happened and again monsters were given even bigger numbers, namely HP (Tojil Had 1.2 million HP originally) and attack / defense. After struggling for ages to counter this with level 99 stats, SE realized their design screw up and just threw a ton of stats on gears to "make it up". Then everything was somewhat balanced until SE decided they wanted things "harder" and made NM's over level 119 but without giving us a way to match it. And this entire time we've been puttering around with a little over level 99 HP, basically every job besides PLD and RUN has become a "glass cannon".

So now we're back to fighting monsters with overpowered stats while we're under-powered and relying on support jobs to "make up the difference", only the disparity is so large that it's just not worth trying and instead we abuse another mechanic.

Because right now nobody is wanting to do anything with a non-BST setup.

I deactivated my account a month ago, and already everything was becoming "more BST".

Player 1 "Hey guys lets do X"
Player 2 "Sure sounds great, I'll change to BST"
Player 3 "yeah I'll come too"
Player 1 "Actually I was hoping to do it differently"
Player 2 "Umm .... about that ....."
Player 3 "why bother"
Player 4 "lets just do it as BSTs, come on guys"
Player 1 "but I don't have BST geared and want to use my WAR or something for a difference"
Player 2 "har har sucks to be you. get with the times already"
Player 3 "not worth it doing it any other way"

And that is what every event turned into. A few linkshells are avoiding the whole "BST onry" rage, but only because they bring so many people. Low man / small group folks are almost all going to BST spammage with a COR + GEO because of how much easier it is. So I deactivated my account and moved back to DDO and some FFXIV. I kept in contact with folks I know and it's only gotten worse, if you don't have BST, COR or GOE then don't bother doing anything and often the COR is someone's mule.

The entire idea of game balance is so that one strategy or job doesn't become so overwhelmingly better then everything else that it becomes the "one and only" method, which is what's happened.

The butthurt is real.

I assumed you are in Asura, There are still player 4-1000 out there you know. Maybe try to put the effort in shout to get a none bst group?, I'm pretty sure there are 5 others out of the population would like to join a non-bst setup for a change.

Why do you care anymore then? You don't like it so you stopped playing. That's fine, that's what you ought to do. Why are you still complaining about it? Obviously the game isn't for you anymore, but it works for the people who ARE still playing. You already quit, just move on.

Savael I'm not reading all that. I'm just saying all beastmaster don't have access to idris geos. I never hit 25 k in my life or hit 20 k ever. I have no idris geo friend nor access to geo friend. Best i got is a cor friend. We can't do 20-25 if we don't have a idris geo friend. If we do we can easily clear all contents going dd route as well.

One day my 6 man group 4 beast master a white Mage and a thief was farming Escha tier 1. We killed it easily but in 4 min. Another group came one was a blue Mage another was a dancer I believe. Killed it in less then 2 mins. I really do not observe what you observe.

First u thought bst has 5 ready charges then you said you deactivated ur acct a month ago and still somehow able to see 20-25k razor fangs today. Ur credibility has gone down the drain.

Because the game as a whole he still likes, just not the direction it's facing, and wishes to see the game restored, but until that time comes, he has departed?

I mean, I don't think I'm working rocket science here, but hey if I am, my mother will be proud.

SE just need to pull the game offline and give everyone an editor and they can each create their own version of the perfect game.

New avatar, same old drama, ms.

That's my original game name. So switching back to that. You think this is my drama only? This is pro beastmaster versus anti beastmaster. Thanks for your awesome comment sir.

Seems the BST topic is hot. Since this same topic took over the dev thread and that one has had numerous reports I ask you guys stay on topic and keep it civil. If this becomes some sort of yelling match I will lock this.

I can't @ the dude with the koala pic. I just can't! Goddess Altana have mercy! /crying #screaming #shaking #25kdmgpulledfromhisahole.

If you want to talk about a TRUELY OP job, it's Geomancer. But noone wants to see it nerfed because it allows for all the degenerate strategies everyone seems to think are so OP. Geomancy enables all this broken crap. But no one wants to see Geomancy nerfed.

SE should make the current or final endgame NMs have damage caps for Pet dmg/ Phys Dmg/ Magic Dmg/ Ranged Dmg, or something like this. That way all jobs are necessary and everybody wins.(Except for DRG, GDI why SE T^T)