Sigurd's Descendants: The Art Of Dragon Slaying.

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2019-11-15
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Sigurd's Descendants: The Art of Dragon Slaying.
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 Bahamut.Eternallight
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By Bahamut.Eternallight 2019-10-10 16:55:58
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Would you be a dear and include the Shining One and Impulse for me? lol
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By Crossbones 2019-10-10 16:57:46
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Problem with drakes is attack penalty. Maybe you were at pdif before you used the WS but then aren't during WS d/t penalty. Kinda the same issue with reso, it's all great on fat bats in outer raz with buffs but on harder content it's gonna fall off. And yeah my empy WS were not hitting crazy hard either although I was missing a potential 30 WSD in gear.
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By Ozaii 2019-10-10 17:10:29
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For impulse sets. I would mostly use the same set as camlanns torment or sonic thrust and just swap out the necks to make sure you have a jse neck and one of the many belts with str on them. Like the metal singer belt.
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By Ozaii 2019-10-10 17:12:08
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ItemSet 358660 similar tothis but swap out the necks and belts.
 Shiva.Flowen
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By Shiva.Flowen 2019-10-10 17:14:32
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Fenrir.Skarwind said: »
I was surprised at Drakes not sucking so bad anymore. Especially nice since its used for double lights.

I know! Made me happy. I was two shotting the apex bats with cam > drakes
 Bahamut.Shozokui
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By Bahamut.Shozokui 2019-10-10 17:17:25
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Bahamut.Eternallight said: »
Would you be a dear and include the Shining One and Impulse for me? lol

I can't accurately include it at this time. My spreadsheet is missing a rule for the Critical Hit Rate bonus so the numbers are too skewed. When I implement that rule, I'll included it in my wrap-up.
 Bahamut.Eternallight
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By Bahamut.Eternallight 2019-10-10 17:21:14
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:D thank you!

I am a terrible non RMEA drg lol
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By Ozaii 2019-10-10 17:54:01
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we all were at some point, Just gotta work on the gears and eventually you will be the one doing the 99k impulse drives.
 Bahamut.Eternallight
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By Bahamut.Eternallight 2019-10-10 18:05:48
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I am just glad Drg is fairly easy to gear as well as not exceedingly gil heavy.
 Asura.Veikur
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By Asura.Veikur 2019-10-10 18:07:29
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It's the advantage of not being a bandwagon job.

Watch prices for Monk related ***sky rocket.
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 Bahamut.Eternallight
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By Bahamut.Eternallight 2019-10-10 18:12:24
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Wasnt a bandwagon job. Now it might be.

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 Asura.Veikur
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By Asura.Veikur 2019-10-10 18:12:30
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Also, the method I'm using to test offhit WSD is to DW a weak dagger in main hand and a rather strong dagger in the offhand and using Wasp Sting. Somewhere where both hits are needed to kill, but attack is capped.

The wyvern bonus is annoying to test because of ingrained DA skewing results.

Wasp Sting has A 100% DEX mod. 1 hand capped pDif on DRG is 3.55 if anyone else wants to do some testing. I wont be home for a few hours yet.
 Fenrir.Skarwind
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By Fenrir.Skarwind 2019-10-10 18:33:06
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Asura.Veikur said: »
Also, the method I'm using to test offhit WSD is to DW a weak dagger in main hand and a rather strong dagger in the offhand and using Wasp Sting. Somewhere where both hits are needed to kill, but attack is capped.

The wyvern bonus is annoying to test because of ingrained DA skewing results.

Wasp Sting has A 100% DEX mod. 1 hand capped pDif on DRG is 3.55 if anyone else wants to do some testing. I wont be home for a few hours yet.

Kinda sucks DRG cant equip Karambits. Would make testing so much easier.(since da is throwing things off)
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By Crossbones 2019-10-10 20:33:54
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Just did 3 Omen runs. Had 3 DRG in the same PT, one used TSO and other two used R1 Trish. PT buffs were sam/drk, marchx2 minx2. Had idris frailty on NMs.

TSO won pretty handily in almost all situations. Much higher wsavg although the sample sizes were less than 10. Impulse gear was def not BiS although SD gear on the other two was more or less. Side note: Missing really hurts TSO.

Would be interesting to see how an R15 would compare although like I said the fights were short and sample size was quite small.
 Bahamut.Shozokui
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By Bahamut.Shozokui 2019-10-10 20:54:59
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Crossbones said: »
Just did 3 Omen runs. Had 3 DRG in the same PT, one used TSO and other two used R1 Trish. PT buffs were sam/drk, marchx2 minx2. Had idris frailty on NMs.

TSO won pretty handily in almost all situations. Much higher wsavg although the sample sizes were less than 10. Impulse gear was def not BiS although SD gear on the other two was more or less. Side note: Missing really hurts TSO.

Would be interesting to see how an R15 would compare although like I said the fights were short and sample size was quite small.

So all the Omen bosses have ludicrously low HP. That type of fight heavily favors fewer/larger weaponskills vs frequency. Especially if you have 3+ DD on the boss... Your sample size is too small to make any worthwhile conclusion.
 Fenrir.Skarwind
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By Fenrir.Skarwind 2019-10-10 21:03:05
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Bahamut.Shozokui said: »
Crossbones said: »
Just did 3 Omen runs. Had 3 DRG in the same PT, one used TSO and other two used R1 Trish. PT buffs were sam/drk, marchx2 minx2. Had idris frailty on NMs.

TSO won pretty handily in almost all situations. Much higher wsavg although the sample sizes were less than 10. Impulse gear was def not BiS although SD gear on the other two was more or less. Side note: Missing really hurts TSO.

Would be interesting to see how an R15 would compare although like I said the fights were short and sample size was quite small.

So all the Omen bosses have ludicrously low HP. That type of fight heavily favors fewer/larger weaponskills vs frequency. Especially if you have 3+ DD on the boss... Your sample size is too small to make any worthwhile conclusion.


Were some of the Fu?
 Bahamut.Shozokui
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By Bahamut.Shozokui 2019-10-10 21:09:49
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Fenrir.Skarwind said: »
Were some of the Fu?

Any mob in Omen will have this problem. Even Ou can be killed by a single person from 60 -> 0 ignoring all mechanics now.

Gin, Kin, Fu, Kyou, Ou are all < 30s fights with 2 geared DD and support. Craver dies in like 4 weaponskills.
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By Crossbones 2019-10-10 21:42:33
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We did Gin, Kyou, and Kin. All three mid bosses were weak to pierce too lol. Yeah like I said before the sample size is really small but it still gives us info on what to use in a short fight. I have no doubt that in longer fights or anything that utilizes multi step it's gonna be a whole different story.
 Asura.Veikur
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By Asura.Veikur 2019-10-10 22:38:46
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Gonna do more for sample size sake, but the damage range I'm getting is impossible to get if at least the traitthey didn't apply to all hits.
 Ragnarok.Martel
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By Ragnarok.Martel 2019-10-10 22:46:03
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So. I suspect there's not been much interest in Spirit Bond compared to the WSD stuff. But I was curious.

Went out and tested a bunch. This was all made far more confusing by the fact that battlemod currently suppresses the log notifications about the DRG taking dmg via Spirit Bond. So I had no idea there even was a log message for... most of my testing time. Needs an update.

Anyway. Spirit Bond takes the wyvern's post pet DT dmg taken, and splits it 50/50 with the DRG. This happens before Steady wing is applied though, so you can take dmg while your wyvern is getting hit for 0.

Further, the player's DT does not affect this dmg taken at all. It can be mitigated with stoneskin, so cureskin can help. Phalanx might work as well, but I haven't tried it.

Overall, I'm a bit concerned about the actual usefulness of this. It seems like a pretty good way to die to an aoe that you would have survived normally. Now, funneling some of the dmg to the DRG, who can be cured by mages, where the wyvern can't makes a sort of sense. But taking basically double dmg from AoE's seems really dangerous. If palyer DT worked on the DRG dmg taken then it's be a lot more appealing

My favorite example here...

In this example, my wyvern had 76 PDT. 40 base, 25 from collar+2 and 11 from ptero legs+3.

10,000*.24=2400 /2=1200.

Now as you can see, then numbers there are slightly off. I took 1210 not 1200. It seems like the wyvern base 40% is actually a tiny bit less that 40%, or some kinda weird rounding is going on. This can also be seen without Spirit Bond up, just from the wyvern taking 2k needles.

I have some data from before I realized there was a log message for the drg's spirit bond dmg, so I'll go ahead and post that in case anyone wants to try to figure out the wyvern's exact /256 DT.

And I'm not even going to try to make this pretty
Code
*Note that the dragoon field here is the actual direct dmg from the needles move, not the spirit bond dmg. Since I didn't realize that had it's own log message at first.
Needles	targets	Dragoon	Wyvern	Bond?	Martel PDT	WPDT
2000	2	1000	601	No	0	40
4000	2	2000	1203	No	0	40
2000	2	1000	301	yes	0	40
4000	2	2000	602	yes	0	40
2000	2	511	172	yes	50	65
4000	2	1023	344	yes	50	65
2000	2	500	172	yes	60	65
4000	2	1000	344	yes	60	65
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 Asura.Veikur
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By Asura.Veikur 2019-10-10 22:55:10
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That's more or less what I was expecting from it. Gross.
 Bahamut.Shozokui
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By Bahamut.Shozokui 2019-10-10 22:57:16
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Spirit Bond is actually a very dangerous utility rather than being useful. I tried it on Lilith and got 1-shot by a conal when wyvern took 0 damage and my normal damage intake was much lower.

I'm not sure where this utility fits in any type of play. My wyvern lives through just about everything while I'm wearing wyvern DT set and utilizing a max HP steady wing set. It only ever gets bopped by Charm, Death, Zantetsuken, and Iroha.

I was thinking it could possibly be ok for scenarios where you will run out of steady wing / spirit link, or fights where you need to spirit link at the beginning (Geas Fete HELMS). But it scares me, if the fight is throwing enough damage for your wyvern to die through huge pet DT, you're getting hammered too, so taking a bunch of extra damage will probably just get you one-shot.
 Asura.Veikur
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By Asura.Veikur 2019-10-10 23:14:59
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Bronze Dagger - 3(11) DMG
Levante - 95(113) DMG
DEX - 290
pDif - 3.55

Wasp Sting
fTP - 1.0 fTP
WSC - 100% DEX

Target
Desert Spider, Western Altepa Desert


If anyone wants to do 1074801701971 samples, go for it. This is pretty conclusive as far as I'm concerned.
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 Ragnarok.Martel
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By Ragnarok.Martel 2019-10-10 23:20:53
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Did you ever confirm what you were saying about it stacking additively with gear WSD?

And thank you for the testing btw.
 Asura.Veikur
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By Asura.Veikur 2019-10-10 23:23:32
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Ragnarok.Martel said: »
Did you ever confirm what you were saying about it stacking additively with gear WSD?

And thank you for the testing btw.
I'm gonna double check that right now, actually. I didn't have much WSD gear on, so I might've messed up rounding for the expected damage ranges or something.
 Asura.Veikur
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By Asura.Veikur 2019-10-10 23:41:48
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Radiant Lance - 90(108) DMG
STR - 298
pDif - 4.05
WSD - 47

Leg Sweep
fTP - 1.0
WSC - 100% STR

Target
Desert Spider, Western Altepa Desert


So, never mind about that additive deal.
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 Lakshmi.Buukki
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2019-10-10 23:46:35
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spirit bond looks clunky. I’m more happy about the fact healing breath finally cures the wyvern.
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 Asura.Highwynn
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By Asura.Highwynn 2019-10-10 23:52:32
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Uh so is that showing that wsd is affecting all hits? Do offhand hits act special when it comes to wsd compared to normal subsequent hits in multipart ws? 30% boost to stardiver seems to good to be true.

Also Spirit Bond is looking dangerous. They need to uh make traits or gear that augment it by reducing that 50% to something lower. It's kind of an awkward skill.

I would have settled for Spirit Bond to call a weakened wyvern out at half max hp while penalizing the DRG with like hp-15% for 1 minute, then after that timer the wyvern's weakness wears off. Basically deus ex automata for DRG.
 Ragnarok.Martel
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By Ragnarok.Martel 2019-10-10 23:55:50
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Asura.Veikur said: »
Radiant Lance - 90(108) DMG
STR - 298
pDif - 4.05
WSD - 47

Leg Sweep
fTP - 1.0
WSC - 100% STR

Target
Desert Spider, Western Altepa Desert


So, never mind about that additive deal.
Hmm. now the question is... does it add in with REMA WSD or is it in its own term? Cause if it is in its term that multiplies with RMEA and augment terms.. that'll be really potent.

Excellent testing again. Thank you.
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 Asura.Veikur
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By Asura.Veikur 2019-10-11 00:17:34
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Ragnarok.Martel said: »
Hmm. now the question is... does it add in with REMA WSD or is it in its own term? Cause if it is in its term that multiplies with RMEA and augment terms.. that'll be really potent.

Excellent testing again. Thank you.
I don't have an R15, so I dunno if it stacks with the Augments, but it doesn't stack with the hidden boost.

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