Delve Weapons Only
Delve weapons only
It's just a different point, not a flaw in the argument.
Leviathan.Kaparu said: »
Tell me this is wrong:
Leviathan.Kaparu said: »
A bad player in a plasm farm wielding Rigors instead of 90Vere is going to increase the group's productivity by an accountable amount. That's something. Whether you think that something is appreciable is normative an irrelevant.
the 2nd part is an opinion. all opinions are wrong.
k what do i win?
Leviathan.Kaparu said: »
No, see you're still trying to bend how appreciable it is instead acknowledging that it's empirically correct.
So basically you just want to gate people off because it's what we've always done in the past, but not for any actual reason that makes a difference to the run's success.
Ok, got it.
Valefor.Sehachan said: »
It's just a different point, not a flaw in the argument.
this is pretty much the just of the argument here. i think you guys should just agree to disagree with your different viewpoints.
this is just turning into another numbers=/=reality argument.
Valefor.Prothescar said: »
Leviathan.Kaparu said: »
No, see you're still trying to bend how appreciable it is instead acknowledging that it's empirically correct.
So basically you just want to gate people off because it's what we've always done in the past, but not for any actual reason that makes a difference to the run's productivity.
Ok, got it.
Fixed that for you.
And it does make a difference, it's just a difference that you don't appreciate.
The problem is that it's impossible to mathematically represent a random pick up member unless you calculate for every possible point, and even then you can't know which one you'll get unless you've dealt with the person before or unless you're a psychic. It's factually unsound to assume that a Delve weapon is instantly making someone worth their slot over someone else when the likelihood that they're both terrible is equal.
I'd have taken any other reason, like idk, "You must have this type of hat in order to hang out with the cool kids, no reason rly we just don't like your face otherwise".
If that extra 50 mweya plasm is enough for you to ignore a fairly large section of the playerbase then that's good for you, but most people aren't that heartless.
I'd have taken any other reason, like idk, "You must have this type of hat in order to hang out with the cool kids, no reason rly we just don't like your face otherwise".
If that extra 50 mweya plasm is enough for you to ignore a fairly large section of the playerbase then that's good for you, but most people aren't that heartless.
[+]
Valefor.Prothescar said: »
It's factually unsound to assume that a Delve weapon is instantly making someone better than someone else when the likelihood that they're both terrible is equal.
"All else being equal, giving one person something better won't make them better"
Averages dictate that, to some extent, mandating a Delve weapon will improve productivity.
Whether you or I agree that said difference in efficacy is worth exclusion is entirely irrelevant, as I never once took the position that everyone should do so- merely that it's reasonable to a degree and well within their right to do
[+]
My several dozen runs of delve dictate that this is not the case on any actual appreciable scale. I do not filter people based on their weapons, and we still manage 6-7k~ every time. And guess what? I get everyone the weapons and armor that they want and need so that they can better themselves and be more, as you want to put it, "productive", not just the select ones that have it already.
I'm sure there are some misers out there who really want that extra 1000 plasm every few hours, but in my opinion they can *** right off.
I'm sure there are some misers out there who really want that extra 1000 plasm every few hours, but in my opinion they can *** right off.
[+]
Leviathan.Kaparu said: »
"All else being equal, giving one person something better won't make them better"
You can reach a store 50 meters ahead faster with a motorbike than by feet, sure, but does it matter?
No one says there's lack of logic in your argument, but its relevance should be swayed by the context you apply it to.
No one says there's lack of logic in your argument, but its relevance should be swayed by the context you apply it to.
Except all the other contributing factors can just as easily negate anything the weapon adds.
Once again ignoring context, relevancy, and relativity.
In any case, I have things to do today. As much as I'd love to stay I have to retire for now.
In any case, I have things to do today. As much as I'd love to stay I have to retire for now.
Leviathan.Kaparu said: »
Valefor.Prothescar said: »
It's factually unsound to assume that a Delve weapon is instantly making someone better than someone else when the likelihood that they're both terrible is equal.
"All else being equal, giving one person something better won't make them better"
Averages dictate that, to some extent, mandating a Delve weapon will improve productivity.
but I don't believe that's how this game works at all, not when you throw a human player(crazy wtfbbq variables here) behind the controls at least.
just because somebody has a delve weapon, doesn't mean they are ws'ing at 100tp everytime.
or hell, they could have a delve weapon and not even have a ws set (as stated prior, delve weapons are pretty easy to get)
Therefore; Assuming a player with a delve weapon is automatically superior to one who does not, is kind of silly.
while your argument isn't technically incorrect, it's just silly....
so stahp pls.
Leviathan.Kaparu said: »
So mandating Delve weapons is alright for hard things, but not for easy things?
Delve weapons are great for both. It's just the "delve only" for farming that is wrong.
If people start with "Delve only" why don't they ask for at least salvage gears +1 only? I still see people tping with NNI gears on most of their main slots when we provide them with 3 songs +x BRDs.
Well it's end game but it has to stay fun and accessible so people would be able to improve as intended.
If people wanna bring it to an elite way, no problem but it won't be fun even for the delve's owners considering all the above.
Going to have to go against the feel-goods in this thread - if I'm going to take someone unfamiliar I might as well ensure that their bulk can be used as the most lethal weapon possible if their brain isn't functional
Fenrir.Sylow said: »
Going to have to go against the feel-goods in this thread - if I'm going to take someone unfamiliar I might as well ensure that their bulk can be used as the most lethal weapon possible if their brain isn't functional
[+]
Fairy.Ghaleon said: »
but I don't believe that's how this game works at all, not when you throw a human player(crazy wtfbbq variables here) behind the controls at least.
just because somebody has a delve weapon, doesn't mean they are ws'ing at 100tp everytime.
or hell, they could have a delve weapon and not even have a ws set (as stated prior, delve weapons are pretty easy to get)
Therefore; Assuming a player with a delve weapon is automatically superior to one who does not, is kind of silly.
while your argument isn't technically incorrect, it's just silly....
so stahp pls.
just because somebody has a delve weapon, doesn't mean they are ws'ing at 100tp everytime.
or hell, they could have a delve weapon and not even have a ws set (as stated prior, delve weapons are pretty easy to get)
Therefore; Assuming a player with a delve weapon is automatically superior to one who does not, is kind of silly.
while your argument isn't technically incorrect, it's just silly....
so stahp pls.
You cannot say that my argument is both technically correct and silly; I never even took a position in the discussion
Leviathan.Kaparu said: »
Whether you or I agree that said difference in efficacy is worth exclusion is entirely irrelevant, as I never once took the position that everyone should do so- merely that it's reasonable to a degree and well within their right to do
You people are either stubborn as all hell or completely illiterate
A good player who's hungry to get caught up is probably going to be trying harder than someone burned out on the content going for that last piece he never wanted that badly in the first place.
Then what's the argument exactly - requiring that people have at least a Delve weapon is the most direct way possible of ensuring that your average idiot will be a killing machine
Fairy.Ghaleon said: »
I honestly think he is just not able to sleep and giving us all a good troll at this point lol.
There's no way he is that ignorant or full of himself.
(though i definitely could be wrong)
edit- going to bed now, goodnight guys, I'll read this later lol.
oh wait, no i won't, this thread will probably be nuked in a couple hours lol.
There's no way he is that ignorant or full of himself.
(though i definitely could be wrong)
edit- going to bed now, goodnight guys, I'll read this later lol.
oh wait, no i won't, this thread will probably be nuked in a couple hours lol.
He's definitely messing with everyone, that or he's worse then pchan.
Delve weapons are not required in the slightest for plasm farming. There's not enough mobs in there to keep a high end group fed. People are complaining about some idiots making them a requirement and he thinks he can rile a bunch of people up for troll points. As all the trolls have been banned from the OF they've started moving over here to cause drama.
Fenrir.Sylow said: »
Then what's the argument exactly
I think we're arguing semantics with
Lakshmi.Saevel said: »
There's not enough mobs in there to keep a high end group fed.
Once again, wrong. You're pathing improperly
[+]
Fenrir.Sylow said: »
Then what's the argument exactly - requiring that people have at least a Delve weapon is the most direct way possible of ensuring that your average idiot will be a killing machine
nothing, tsuko just feels like instigating an argument about something that has literally almost no point to.
none, and i actually did read your quote earlier about you not taking a stance, but if i was to assume that correct, you are just wasting everybodys time and trolling so hard.
we do tend to assume that the person defending a certain argument or variety of, also takes the same stance.
so for that i apologize, but still lol. Stahp.
Since I made the original post 2 delve shouts have come up that didn't specify delve weapons only so I'm ow 13/30k towards the GAxe... in the same time this post is now 6 pages saying it's not fair to segment people out for not getting a delve weapon.
If you have no delve weapon OP, you can offer to sac if you have the twilight set.
My drk is now level 98 :(
My drk is now level 98 :(
[+]
Carraway Author said: »
being able to hit ctrl+1 when their TP gets to 100%
[+]
There most certainly was a point: that those who do choose to take such a stance do have a reasonable vantage point, even if others do not feel that their exclusion is worth an arguably minimal return
Lakshmi.Saevel said: »
Fairy.Ghaleon said: »
I honestly think he is just not able to sleep and giving us all a good troll at this point lol.
There's no way he is that ignorant or full of himself.
(though i definitely could be wrong)
edit- going to bed now, goodnight guys, I'll read this later lol.
oh wait, no i won't, this thread will probably be nuked in a couple hours lol.
There's no way he is that ignorant or full of himself.
(though i definitely could be wrong)
edit- going to bed now, goodnight guys, I'll read this later lol.
oh wait, no i won't, this thread will probably be nuked in a couple hours lol.
He's definitely messing with everyone, that or he's worse then pchan.
Delve weapons are not required in the slightest for plasm farming. There's not enough mobs in there to keep a high end group fed. People are complaining about some idiots making them a requirement and he thinks he can rile a bunch of people up for troll points. As all the trolls have been banned from the OF they've started moving over here to cause drama.
Meh Tsuko has been around here for longer than i can recall tbh. As for delve farming, He is actually correct that you may in fact be taking improper pathing, go read some bg threads, they might blow your mind on how much they can push their points per run lol.
Carraway Author said: »
Now, the original poster's situation was different, wherein there were more known quantities. In that case, yes, the good player should be picked over the bad player.
Which I (openly) agreed with entirely, for the record
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