Kaboom! A Guide For Black Mage

Language: JP EN DE FR
New Items
2021-06-12
users online
Forum » FFXI » Jobs » Black Mage » Kaboom! A Guide for Black Mage
Kaboom! A Guide for Black Mage
First Page 2 3 ... 32 33 34 ... 41 42 43
Offline
Posts: 7179
By Afania 2016-07-11 22:29:31
Link | Quote | Reply
 
Asura.Datass said: »
Afania said: »
Considering Neak only has roughly 400k hp with 5 people, Maju having over 1m hp with 7 sounds.... pretty insane.

Where are you getting that number for Neak?


Personal experience, I usually kill Neak in 2 SC, with each SC doing 50% of hp or at least close to 50%. If it has close to 1m hp then Id be doing 500k dmg per sc which just isn't possible.

It's eyeballing but 400k hp to 1m is massive difference to get it wrong.
 Fenrir.Snaps
Offline
Server: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
user: Mojopojo
Posts: 1139
By Fenrir.Snaps 2016-07-11 23:19:07
Link | Quote | Reply
 
Fenrir.Nightfyre said: »
Slight tangent to the current line of discussion - about how long does it take for the spike damage reduction to fully decay?

I am not completely sure, maybe 4~5 seconds.
 Fenrir.Snaps
Offline
Server: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
user: Mojopojo
Posts: 1139
By Fenrir.Snaps 2016-07-11 23:39:58
Link | Quote | Reply
 
Asura.Datass said: »
Maju with 7 ppl tonight. 1,035,000 hp according to BG wiki.
900k x1.15.
Blm opening death burst did 15% of hp bar.

.15 x 1,035,000 = 155,250. This is not even close to 100k.

This is with no soldier's drink. Gambit/Rayke up. Standard Geo bubbles with no Bolster. Blaze of Glory active. SCH is at less than 1200 JP's so his spells/helix don't do ***.

This is just what we see. Over and over and over. I think Death breaks cap.

Another way to look at it is that if the burst is only 100k, then Maju only has 667k hp with 7 ppl. That clearly isn't correct.

Instead of telling me I'm wrong, go test it.

As others have pointed out, your test is garbage. You don't have an accurate measurement of Maju's HP. If you're still in disbelief (which I am not sure you are, it seems more like invincible ignorance to me) and want an easy test, go experiment with Byakko/Sajj'aka/August. Those mobs take some increase dark damage. You can free nuke Death for 100k without exceptional buffs. If you could do more than 100k a magic burst of even just 1 Death (with good buffs) would one shot them. I have done these fights countless times though and can tell Death, like everything else, is capped at 100k per hit.
Offline
Posts: 6
By Twigberry 2016-07-12 05:48:39
Link | Quote | Reply
 
His test is garbage........you sound like a 30+ year old that started playing this game when you were a teenager and still have the mindset of one. He is trying to have a valid talk about something and figure it out and you are not even adding to the community you are just trying to bash him in your posts. Be a little more humble and fix your attitude to be helpful and this will be much easier to figure out because I too have yet to see a post that shows exactly how much Death does because if it caps at 99999, most BLMs are using the wrong gear.
 Asura.Chiaia
VIP
Offline
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
user: Demmis
Posts: 1444
By Asura.Chiaia 2016-07-12 06:12:41
Link | Quote | Reply
 
Leviathan.Brotherhood said: »
People forget Death is also a DoT and it can, if timed right Proc its DoT effect right after it hits. I see it all the time on Helix that land for 15% of an Nm's Hp even though it only hit damage wise for 7~8%. Some of the data may not test it enough to give it a real pool of data to see. A 1 time video or even a small sample size will not give you the true data you want. try it on an NM you can spam see how many times cap death takes off XX% vs times it takes off more. If you always take off the same % @ max damage then i'm sorry for this run on post. If you notice what I have, a variable "Tic" of DoT adding to the total amount you just did then you have a reason.
Death has no DoT!
Offline
Posts: 3572
By Blazed1979 2016-07-12 06:19:22
Link | Quote | Reply
 
Death has DoT on it? ***I need to read descriptions more. Had no idea ><
 Asura.Midgitis
Offline
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 40
By Asura.Midgitis 2016-07-12 06:19:48
Link | Quote | Reply
 
Lets see if we can get people to believe it does though. How many people just blindly read the forums and take everything as truth?
 Asura.Toralin
Offline
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
user: toralin
Posts: 1054
By Asura.Toralin 2016-07-12 07:22:14
Link | Quote | Reply
 
Asura.Datass said: »
then Maju only has 667k hp with 7 ppl. That clearly isn't correct.

Oh.... Please explain why this clearly isnt correct? Are you trying to sell us that BG-WIKI HP estimate is wrong. PREPOSTEROUS
Offline
Posts: 3572
By Blazed1979 2016-07-12 07:36:14
Link | Quote | Reply
 
Asura.Toralin said: »
PREPOSTEROUS
In my head as I read that
 Asura.Datass
Offline
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
user: Datass
Posts: 35
By Asura.Datass 2016-07-12 10:23:07
Link | Quote | Reply
 
Asura.Toralin said: »
Asura.Datass said: »
then Maju only has 667k hp with 7 ppl. That clearly isn't correct.

Oh.... Please explain why this clearly isnt correct? Are you trying to sell us that BG-WIKI HP estimate is wrong. PREPOSTEROUS

To be honest, after seeing what Afania said about Neak, now I want to go do my own test. At the time it seemed crazy that the wiki would toss out a number that was off by over 25% but that was the only number I could find for Maju when I searched (albeit a quick search). But Afania's estimate for Neak is less than half for an NM of the same tier so now I don't know. But that number was an eyeball number also. So I will try to keep tabs on our numbers as we do these NM's over the next week or so and see if I can get my own HP estimate.

The thing that is annoying though is that you guys are shitting all over the numbers I'm providing but aren't willing to provide any of your own. I've already stated that I'm totally fine with it if it turns out I'm wrong but I want it to be based on a test done with the spell in question on a mob that doesn't have a *** damage multiplier gimmick coded into it. It seems like a reasonable request. It just blows my mind that a community that is so gung-ho about numbers and proof is being so combative about providing actual numbers to back up their "I told you so's". Sad part here is that I'm not even trying to be right. I'm just trying to find out what is correct in the game mechanics.
 Leviathan.Comeatmebro
Offline
Server: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
user: Rairin
Posts: 6052
By Leviathan.Comeatmebro 2016-07-12 10:31:54
Link | Quote | Reply
 
Asura.Datass said: »
The thing that is annoying though is that you guys are shitting all over the numbers I'm providing but aren't willing to provide any of your own.

when you challenge an established convention, the burden of proof is on you

if your numbers are right and you post a video backing them up, i'm sure people will be eager to test it

until then, they are just assuming(as am i) that you're a moron
 Asura.Datass
Offline
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
user: Datass
Posts: 35
By Asura.Datass 2016-07-12 10:33:21
Link | Quote | Reply
 
And Snaps, I honestly don't care whether you believe it's disbelief or ignorance or anything else. It seems like all you care to do in this thread is talk about how right you are and troll me even though I've already stated that I'm just looking for some numerical verification. Im already trying to do tests and I'm fine with the result either way. Maybe I had a flawed test, but up to this point all you've provided is snark and trolling and opinion. Feel free to post a test that proves your point and I'll be happy to know the truth about the mechanics of the game. But you can shove your personal attacks and your opinions (which is what they are until you post numbers to back them up) up your ***.
 Asura.Datass
Offline
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
user: Datass
Posts: 35
By Asura.Datass 2016-07-12 10:37:41
Link | Quote | Reply
 
Leviathan.Comeatmebro said: »
Asura.Datass said: »
The thing that is annoying though is that you guys are shitting all over the numbers I'm providing but aren't willing to provide any of your own.

when you challenge an established convention, the burden of proof is on you

if your numbers are right and you post a video backing them up, i'm sure people will be eager to test it

until then, they are just assuming(as am i) that you're a moron

I'm posting the numbers we are getting during the fights. They aren't doctored. I've already said on several occasions that I'm fine if it turns out that Death is capped. I just want to know what's true. I've also stated that I'll keep taking data. I've got no reason to lie about the numbers. In the meantime I guess your contribution to it is to insult/troll. Thanks for contributing.
 Fenrir.Svens
Online
Server: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
user: Tenkey
Posts: 66
By Fenrir.Svens 2016-07-12 10:54:23
Link | Quote | Reply
 
In the time it took you to respond to everyone, you could have easily tested this out in game.

Vs. Peirithoos with BLM + SCH and trusts
MB Death - 99999, 46% of its hp
MB Death + Soldier's Drink - 99999, 46% of its hp
[+]
Offline
Posts: 7179
By Afania 2016-07-12 11:06:37
Link | Quote | Reply
 
Twigberry said: »
His test is garbage........you sound like a 30+ year old that started playing this game when you were a teenager and still have the mindset of one. He is trying to have a valid talk about something and figure it out and you are not even adding to the community you are just trying to bash him in your posts. Be a little more humble and fix your attitude to be helpful and this will be much easier to figure out because I too have yet to see a post that shows exactly how much Death does because if it caps at 99999, most BLMs are using the wrong gear.

He may sound rude but his points are way more legit than Datass. Datass basically come to the forum, claiming death breaks cap because he eyeballed 2% difference, then proceed to claim others test isn't legit, and refuse to provide a test with soldiers.

If he really want to have a "valid" talk, action speaks louder than word, do something instead of popping on the forum and arguing with eyeballed result of 2% hp.
Offline
Posts: 1186
By Boshi 2016-07-12 11:38:57
Link | Quote | Reply
 


I BLAME OBAMA
 Asura.Datass
Offline
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
user: Datass
Posts: 35
By Asura.Datass 2016-07-12 11:43:39
Link | Quote | Reply
 
Afania said: »
Twigberry said: »
His test is garbage........you sound like a 30+ year old that started playing this game when you were a teenager and still have the mindset of one. He is trying to have a valid talk about something and figure it out and you are not even adding to the community you are just trying to bash him in your posts. Be a little more humble and fix your attitude to be helpful and this will be much easier to figure out because I too have yet to see a post that shows exactly how much Death does because if it caps at 99999, most BLMs are using the wrong gear.

He may sound rude but his points are way more legit than Datass. Datass basically come to the forum, claiming death breaks cap because he eyeballed 2% difference, then proceed to claim others test isn't legit, and refuse to provide a test with soldiers.

If he really want to have a "valid" talk, action speaks louder than word, do something instead of popping on the forum and arguing with eyeballed result of 2% hp.

I didn't say the test wasn't legit, I said it didn't test the spell Death because Death was never casted during the test. It also involved a mob with special damage multiplier mechanics that differ from the mobs we were discussing. However, someone right above just posted a test that shows pretty strong evidence that it is capped at 100k. I'll try it myself for verification but in the interim I'll just assume his/her test is valid. My idea that death was breaking cap looks like it's wrong. My mistake. Thanks for being such good sports about he whole thing...
 Asura.Datass
Offline
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
user: Datass
Posts: 35
By Asura.Datass 2016-07-12 13:30:30
Link | Quote | Reply
 
Twigberry said: »
... because if it caps at 99999, most BLMs are using the wrong gear.

If we are gearing so far past a 100k barrier that can't be broken it stands to reason that instead we should be stacking more occult acumen so we can just myrkr back up to almost full on mobs that can't be aspir'd well.
 Fenrir.Snaps
Offline
Server: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
user: Mojopojo
Posts: 1139
By Fenrir.Snaps 2016-07-12 13:32:48
Link | Quote | Reply
 
Twigberry said: »
His test is garbage........you sound like a 30+ year old that started playing this game when you were a teenager and still have the mindset of one. He is trying to have a valid talk about something and figure it out and you are not even adding to the community you are just trying to bash him in your posts. Be a little more humble and fix your attitude to be helpful and this will be much easier to figure out because I too have yet to see a post that shows exactly how much Death does because if it caps at 99999, most BLMs are using the wrong gear.

You're right, I was acting a bit childishly. Your take on the discussion is a stretch though. My tone changed from factual to rude after it became clear he cared more about winning an internet argument than meaningful discussion and facts.
 Fenrir.Ramzus
Offline
Server: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
user: Venomfury
Posts: 1356
By Fenrir.Ramzus 2016-07-12 13:35:00
Link | Quote | Reply
 
Asura.Datass said: »
Twigberry said: »
... because if it caps at 99999, most BLMs are using the wrong gear.

If we are gearing so far past a 100k barrier that can't be broken it stands to reason that instead we should be stacking more occult acumen so we can just myrkr back up to almost full on mobs that can't be aspir'd well.

We aren't really, though. On easier mobs, sure, but they die fast enough that you won't ever drain them of their MP.

For harder mobs (WoC post bracelets, Reisen T4) it's actually incredibly difficult to hit 99,999 with multiple BLM even with Bolster + Gambit/Rayke. The first BLM will have no difficulty hitting the damage cap, but everyone else is boned.
Offline
Posts: 263
By Nocki 2016-07-12 13:37:39
Link | Quote | Reply
 
I have seen death do more than 99,999 damage 1 single time.
The one time this has occured was versus Onycophra (Reisen Worm T4).
It used a TP move as one of my LS mates casted death and healed it for 107,000 lol
Offline
Posts: 96
By Darksparksnot 2016-07-12 13:41:53
Link | Quote | Reply
 
Nocki said: »
I have seen death do more than 99,999 damage 1 single time.
The one time this has occured was versus Onycophra (Reisen Worm T4).
It used a TP move as one of my LS mates casted death and healed it for 107,000 lol

I also healed that one for over 130k so i refuse to believe 99k is cap on ALL mobs.
Offline
Posts: 263
By Nocki 2016-07-12 13:51:32
Link | Quote | Reply
 
Darksparksnot said: »
Nocki said: »
I have seen death do more than 99,999 damage 1 single time.
The one time this has occured was versus Onycophra (Reisen Worm T4).
It used a TP move as one of my LS mates casted death and healed it for 107,000 lol

I also healed that one for over 130k so i refuse to believe 99k is cap on ALL mobs.
The damage cap is still 100k, but all this proves is that the game is capable of registering a higher number on a single spell. It just... doesn't.

I tested this quite a while ago when death was released. I did ayapec with pld blm sch geo. I did sc > death and got the NM to 4% with haste/malaise then I bolstered and used acumen/malaise entrust haste (just to be sure I was getting significantly more damage) and it was still left at 4% where if it went over 99,999 at all it would've died.
[+]
 Asura.Datass
Offline
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
user: Datass
Posts: 35
By Asura.Datass 2016-07-12 14:04:05
Link | Quote | Reply
 
Edit: Double posted
 Asura.Datass
Offline
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
user: Datass
Posts: 35
By Asura.Datass 2016-07-12 14:08:44
Link | Quote | Reply
 
Fenrir.Ramzus said: »
Asura.Datass said: »
Twigberry said: »
... because if it caps at 99999, most BLMs are using the wrong gear.

If we are gearing so far past a 100k barrier that can't be broken it stands to reason that instead we should be stacking more occult acumen so we can just myrkr back up to almost full on mobs that can't be aspir'd well.

We aren't really, though. On easier mobs, sure, but they die fast enough that you won't ever drain them of their MP.

For harder mobs (WoC post bracelets, Reisen T4) it's actually incredibly difficult to hit 99,999 with multiple BLM even with Bolster + Gambit/Rayke. The first BLM will have no difficulty hitting the damage cap, but everyone else is boned.

This is a fair point on which I will defer to you as I have no experience with Reisen T4's as of yet.

Nocki said: »
Darksparksnot said: »
Nocki said: »
I have seen death do more than 99,999 damage 1 single time.
The one time this has occured was versus Onycophra (Reisen Worm T4).
It used a TP move as one of my LS mates casted death and healed it for 107,000 lol

I also healed that one for over 130k so i refuse to believe 99k is cap on ALL mobs.
The damage cap is still 100k, but all this proves is that the game is capable of registering a higher number on a single spell. It just... doesn't.

I tested this quite a while ago when death was released. I did ayapec with pld blm sch geo. I did sc > death and got the NM to 4% with haste/malaise then I bolstered and used acumen/malaise entrust haste (just to be sure I was getting significantly more damage) and it was still left at 4% where if it went over 99,999 at all it would've died.

Thanks for posting this. That's the type of test I was hoping someone would post as confirmation one way or the other.
 Sylph.Braden
Offline
Server: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 397
By Sylph.Braden 2016-07-12 16:51:41
Link | Quote | Reply
 
Shouldn't people be aiming for just under 99k on the lower nuke to see where the upper limit is?
[+]
 Odin.Llewelyn
Offline
Server: Odin
Game: FFXI
user: Llewelyn
Posts: 2254
By Odin.Llewelyn 2016-07-12 18:05:24
Link | Quote | Reply
 
Previous tests didn't exactly confirm a 99999 cap. They just showed that a cap exists. Those 99999s on the 'lower nuke' could've been doing over 99999 and thus the previously claimed >100k cap. Test I did should hopefully more narrowly conclude the 99999 damage cap.

Target: Lv125 Apex Eruca

First test - Melee'd an Eruca for 100607 damage; remaining HP% was 28%. ~101500 damage put it to 27%

Second test - MB Death for 99999 with a proceeding 58 damage opening skillchain; remaining HP% was 28%.

If the cap was over 100k we'd be seeing at least a 1% HP difference from the Death Burst. Since even 1500 damage above 100k would result in a 1% HP difference, it's safe to conclude that the damage cap is 99999.
[+]
Offline
Posts: 40
By Armeth 2016-07-12 20:29:39
Link | Quote | Reply
 
I'm getting ready to augment my Taranus's cape. What's better between Magic Damage+10 and INT+10 using dye? Why (other than the fact I can get INT+20 with thread)?
 Siren.Kyte
Offline
Server: Siren
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3261
By Siren.Kyte 2016-07-12 20:30:42
Link | Quote | Reply
 
INT
Offline
Posts: 40
By Armeth 2016-07-12 20:40:17
Link | Quote | Reply
 
Siren.Kyte said: »
INT
Okay. For the sake of my understanding how these things work, why is that?

Same questions for INT+10 versus Magic Accuracy+10.
First Page 2 3 ... 32 33 34 ... 41 42 43
Log in to post.