[Dev] SCH - Regarding Cure V And Regen

Lower Cure VI mp cost by 75.
Raise Cure VI potency cap so it reams at around 1,800~2,000 HP.

Give SCH and RDM Cure V (RDM before SCH), make all "Cure" spells beyond level IV non-AOE unless using WHM as a main.

Perks (for WHM) -
MP Cost of 152 (17 more than Cure 5)
WHM Keeps its Godly Cure potency (Being able to cure everyone up with a single spell while maintaining a secondary 1,000+ secondary spell).

Losses (for WHM) -
Well I can't think of any outside of not being NEEDED. Like every other job in the game c_c.

Perks (for SCH+RDM) -
You get your GD Cure V.
You can cure for more than 700ish HP.
You gain access to more efficient curing.
You become a little less emo in the corner.

Losses (SCH+RDM) -
You get to be used for cure whoring like the good ol' days.
(SCH) You don't get AOE Cure V. So Sad.

Perks (for SE) -
Satisfy your customers for a few months, before WHM goes crying about a broke system.
Take less time reconfiguring 2 spells rather than a few weeks reconfiguring a potency and skill system.

Losses (for SE) -
Still not satisfy anybody.
Eventually give Cure V to PLD.

I see. My question lied more in whether there was a specific resist message for Modus, because I know after they fixed it on AV I tried it and it still said the same thing but I know for sure it wasn't landing at all. But I'll infer that there is and thanks. Seems weird they'd ignore it, though.

It's 7mp/tic (Refresh II with legs, because it doesn't have to remain on) vs. 8mp/tic (Sublimation).

You can't count gear that has to remain on because in effect, they're no different than having Refresh gear. Just accept that they're both different and neither is necessarily better(yes, situationally) all the time.

Having a full charge before you start an event is sexy, but you don't always want to be relying on sublimation in the midst of a fight for obvious reasons - red HP causes it to deactivate. Then there are times where you rely on Sublimation to keep you awake or where your MP is high and you want to save up a storage of MP for later use.

I'll agree that Refresh II shouldn't overwrite any SCH main sublimation effect, but I see no problem in it overwriting a /SCH sublimation effect.

story of my life

downside of sublimation is that you cannot full time it with the 30second aftercast, personally i have no complaints of having to use sublimation but i would take refresh 2 over sublimation during a fight in a heartbeat.

That isn't even an issue, WHM shouldn't be using Cure VI outside unless you are in that bad of situations (which I would suggest you stop wtf your doing and make an actual plan if your WHM is having to use Cure VI).

Damn right we won't. If SCH got Cure V I would switch my main right away. A WHM should not be using Cure VI outside of abyssea, so if these two jobs got Cure V then WHM would be nothing but a silly mage that can use hexa strike. Not like we are needed to buff everyone with Protect V or Shell V. Not like we are needed to raise people. Not like we are needed to barspell anymore. Boost spells? really? RDM & SCH cry that you have no individuality when in fact they stepped on WHM just as much. If SCH got Cure V I would never be on WHM again because SCH would be 10 times more awesome and the outfits are just as cute as WHM.

RDM & SCH wants a Healer's Cure spell, but doesn't want to be treated like a healer? That is a laugh.

SE really likes to make us happy, they sent out a fix in only 3 months of complaining and over 100 pages of people unable to play before they made their "fix".

The fix for Cure III and IV is very reasonable, they are meager compared to Cure V and would help greatly for a Support Healer (what SCH and RDM's are).

WHM would still get cureskin, and Cure VI isn't "useless" outside Abyssea. It provides a hefty cureskin, many Voidwatch mobs don't require you to be "watching your MP" yet dish out a large amount of damage for no particular reason. Giving SCH Cure V wouldn't make WHM useless. Also take into account WHM still gets butterfly, which is probably one of the *** coolest things ever. They need to be able to butterfly outside of party, then we'd be good.

tl;dr: Give SCH Cure V because they get Blizzard V.

All of this, cureskin combined with perpetual -30~40% mp cost on full amounts cured through the af3+2 legs, and a plethora of already essential support spells such as vastly hastened -nas, bar-ra spells, Sacrosanctity (I know it's meh, but it's a really nice cut on damage for Citadel Buster-esque situations), divine caress to cut down on -na spells required/extend doom's countdown, hasty and well timed cures without the use of job abilities, Auspice (again, meh, but dealwithit.gif), and the sole-focus of curing (no needing to spread yourself out through multiple tasks such as providing costly, yet potent and unique, buffs, enfeebling, nuking, preparing through extensive use of job abilities etc.).

The list goes on.

Point being, whm certainly has its niche, and would still be highly recommended for most fights, if not still mandatory. The only difference I see being made is that SCH would become slightly relevant.

But we can't have that.

Not in my FFXI.

You're not getting my point I don't really think they need Cure 5 I think they need to diversify the book of spells for these support healers. They've given the unique spells of these jobs to every other class and now there is no real reason to play them over the other jobs. You can say SCH is a support healer but it doesn't have many useful spells that WHM doesn't. They can AoE -na and debuffs but other than that it's become lack luster. Storm spells, Klimaform, helix, and most of the useful stratagems are all available to subjobs which in my opinion takes away from the diversity of the job.

While they may be making helix gimp on suport jobs it is still limited in its usefulness by not being able to stack with multiple scholars and being hobbled from gimps long since past. We've seen the average party size required for events in this game shrink drastically over the past year which limits the invites for some jobs mainly because they have no differentiation from others. I would really like to see some new exclusive spells not really cure5. I've stated in a past thread somewhere that I'd rather see a cure helix which is somewhat like a regen boost but not nearly as potent as I would like to see.

My main complaint which i suppose I didn't make clear enough in my previous post was that they need to stop combining the spells of various jobs and find unique ways to make people want to play these jobs like RDM SCH PUP DRG and DRK. It goes both ways tho were you really happy to see scholar get Pro5/Shell5 when WHM had to merit it? I would much rather see them make unique things for jobs instead of reusing spells and abilities.


This is my point. The reason you say you'd switch is because these jobs have become too alike. There is no reason that one has to be better than the other if they add something usefully unique to each job then it wouldn't really be an issue. If scholars main thing was curing over time, which I don't think an 11hp/tick more regen4 is, that wouldn't take away from a white mages curing in a pinch. They need to mix things up a little.

But for some reason on the opposite side of the fence it was ok to give sch tierV's while BLM's are what they are?

How does giving RDM or SCH cure 5 make them relevant? I don't see it.

Anyone replacing a WHM with a RDM or SCH if they got Cure V is an idiot. If you can't find a WHM, why not, but who doesn't have a access to one these days? WHM offers way too much, things a RDM and SCH just don't have.

Such as....? Cureskin and good barspells...? Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying sch would be the be-all-end-all mage, but with the regen potency/duration+ on light arts coming soon, they will still be very useful.

That, and I'm still pissed (Q.Q i know) over them giving jobs protect 5 and shell 5 when we had to merit it.

Makes no sense.

And then they didn't even change it so instead of giving WHM protectra 5 and shellra 5 scrolls, and changed the merits so those merits affect all protect and shell spells to the same degree, and making it so other mages couldn't overwrite our more powerful buffs (and barspells, still pissed about that) they chose to do nothing.

I think they might change it in a few months in the upcoming update, but the part of myself that is still pissed off has a hard time believing that they give a ***.

I know I rant and it blinds me from the good in jobs, but I don't think I'm the only one that's angry. I know SCH is getting hit hard with loosing their uniqueness but the same thing happened to WHM not too long ago with SCH and RDM and PLD (just recently). I don't mind PLD getting it so much, but if PLD gets it the other two rightfully should I guess so it makes no sense why they kept it as a merit for this long.

Regen holds little relavence when we are talking things that matter 50 a tic will not cover a mob that hits 500 a shot.

His point is that whm offers way too much and that if you think giving more jobs the ability to cure effectivly when whm are unavailable (and in most cases unwilling to even attend as whm while all their other jobs rot) is silly. Whm offers a bunch of nitch spells and abilities that make it the main cure job it is, Cureskin, best barspells, that new JA, esuna, sacrifice, traits and merits, and the efficiency on their cures...oh and access to better gear options for said role.

EDIT: in response to Kali post above, sch lost their uniqueness as soon as mp became worthless(this also affected rdm hard), as that was the defining characteristic behind the job in efficiency through mp. Now as it stands sch has some unique spells that frankly suck and will soon be subable too. it is left as a single target nuke job, sort of aking to blm/whm w/o any ga spells and douse. The job needs refinment i think that is the least everyone should be able to agree on, cure 5 is just the only simple solution to its shortcomings as a healer, regen is NOT a fix for it in the least.

I think Rdm should get Cure V, but not Sch.

Then there is no reason to not give it to them then.

No point in starting a new thread so I'll post it here:
Regen V heals for 64HP/tick w/o SCH +2 hat and heals for 69HP/tick w/ SCH +2 hat.

is that with or without arts on? also what is the duration?

That was with arts on and it lasts 2 minutes.
Without arts, it's 40HP/tick w/o hat, 45HP/tick w/ hat and lasts for 1 minute.
It also costs 90MP with Light Arts on and 100MP w/o.

so that's 40 ticks of 69 HP recovered which totals to about 2700+ HP recovered in 2 minutes I think.

now when you add all that with perpetuance along with savant's bracers +2 that's 4 minutes and 30 seconds of 69 HP recovered over time with about 100 ticks?

That's pretty cool.

Does this stack with accession just to be sure

That isn't too bad. just need to see what it does with 2hr mounted on top of it.

Now just hope the cure changes can make up for the lack of cure 5

hahaha i love all you QQing scholars

Firstly you have scholars braging how they can keep up with blm and dependant on the fight/situation, surpass blm. Now that they have done that, i guess its time to do the same to whm to right?

or how about being able to melee DD aswell, so they can do everything and an alliance consists of 18 sch's?

just give up on getting cure 5 already, only job that should be allowed or given it, is whm. they are the main healers, always have and always will be.

Oh and Rdm was my first job and i dont think they should be given cure 5 either, they still have there use's, but it is however very niche.

Yep, stacks with accession.

Also, to be quite frank, SCH doesn't need Cure V. I've been main healing the tank party alone in Voidwatch on Kaggen, Pil, etc and I've survived without Cure V, granted it wouldn't hurt, but then again, it's not really required. Just stack up on Fast cast, Cure potency, a bit of -enmity, and keep Aurorastorm up w/ obi and cape and you're fine.

If i respond to you would you consider it an act of kindness? If I know it's a troll it's only through kindness that I would feed it yes?

The game has advanced from 75-99 in very little time and there is certainly an amount of tweaking that needs to be done to the game. With the introduction of the forums it has given some players hope that their feedback will actually go under some sort of consideration. They've gone to a lot of trouble implementing test servers to just ignore the feedback of the community, though i wouldn't put it past them.

That said I think your input on this subject is at best a juvenile attempt to provoke an argument. If i were to even take you seriously your argument is so mundane that I could find it on any number of threads by similarly immature SCHs and BLMs who seem to mistake damage output with the size of their genitalia.

Q:Can Sch keep up and sometimes outparse BLM?
A:Yes

Q:Should Sch get Cure 5?
A:
Q:Should scholar get more melee skill so they can be on par with warriors and other Melee DD?
A: Earlier I would have said no but, after reading that regurgitation of a thing you call a post why not. It appears some people think they're not nukers or healers so why not a Melee.

Don't mind me but I find Melee sch kind of fun, off-hand blau & main Molva Maul <3

I like being sch/dnc since there's sambas, steps, stun & ect.

IF sch gets a boost with melee skill should we Hexa? (though technically the only other job that could is pld since they have higher Club skill then whm) but I highly doubt SE would do that though.

As for Subject I really don't care that Sch is not getting Cure V, its meant for whm anyway....now if whm could get Banish IV, V & Banishga III-IV that would be a different story...and make this veer off topic lol

I agree that the game has some balancing issues that needs to be addressed, but...

I'm sick of hearing how "Aegis/Ochain is the only tank for hard stuff."

If you NEED an Aegis/Ochain PLD for hard stuff then your linkshell sucks. There are plenty of ways to get around having a relic/empy PLD, kill the mob more efficiently, and still get procs (assuming that "hard stuff" is referring to VWNM).

/flameon

You mean solo.

really i love when peops come directly to troll the sch forums lol
What does this thread topic have to do with sch nukes?? so dont bring blm into this or rdm.

i dont think any sch thinks they can 100% of an event supersede a whm, as far healing respectively. The fun part about the job is that u are able to do both LA/DA pretty well.

should a sch replace a whm absolutely not(this has been addressed in other treads btw)? but if the whm gets killed because ur dd's decided to be idiots and run to the whm and get the whm killed it can handle the job nicely till the main whm unweakens. ive done it tons of times. and you can ask any, EXPERIENCED SCH, WELL GEARED SCH, and im sure they will tell u theyve done it too..

I dont think any sch is asking for cure5 anymore, why ? because we got access to more potency gear, that stacks with korin obi and twilight cape. And now with regen5 potency adjustment and cure4 adjustment should be easier

While you're absolutely correct, you could also raise the argument that if your designated tanks don't have either at this point they suck. They're tremendous advantages, and not the least bit difficult to attain.