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New trust system - Who will you upgrade first?
By Ranoutofspace 2026-04-29 01:06:43
Maybe they want a stage 4 prime and see it would take 175 days of 20,000 gallimaufry and throw in the towel? Why can't they aim for end game progress while being casual? (This will be an enjoyable hypothetical circlejerk. /s) This ***takes too long - you don't even do Limbus, right? Why not?
Idk what a casual player wants, but from my experience as a 'casual' in other games, I see what the endgame looks like and how long/how much it takes to get there. ***in this game is slow.
Pick whatever imaginary situation you want:
a) I can't commit to more than 30 mins at once
b) My schedule is too erratic and a static doesn't work (always a 9-5 office slave talking about scheduing not being an issue, lul)
c) I don't like other people
d) Anything else you can dream of for a hypothetical victim
By Shichishito 2026-04-29 01:37:17
426 days for a stage 5 at 20k/run or 568 days at 15k/run. Now remember, you're also expected to have at least 3 geared jobs so we looking at 1278-1704 days or 3,5-4,6 years.
Casual AF.
Carbuncle.Maletaru
Server: Carbuncle
Game: FFXI
Posts: 4179
By Carbuncle.Maletaru 2026-04-29 01:38:13
Now remember, you're also expected to have at least 3 geared jobs
You're a solo player. Who TF is expecting anything from you? Your mom?
Absurdity of these claims aside, even if you are playing with other people (and not soloing, therefore the numbers make no *** sense), are there people who are really saying "you can't play with us until you have 3 jobs, each of which has a stage 5 prime"? Uh...who?
Lakshmi.Buukki
Server: Lakshmi
Game: FFXI
By Lakshmi.Buukki 2026-04-29 01:40:42
Maybe they want a stage 4 prime and see it would take 175 days of 20,000 gallimaufry and throw in the towel?
So a solo player would get frustrated that they can't solo a weapon that comes from group content and only is strong when it is powered up by other people's buffs in endgame setting? Instead of just joining other groups, forming their own, or just making a different class of weapons? This scenario doesn't make any sense.
Why can't they aim for end game progress while being casual?
You keep using the words " solo" and " casual" interchangeably and it's kind of deceptive.
Solo means alone. Casual implies non-hardcore/non-static player who progresses at his own pace. Plays when he wants, takes breaks here and there, isn't desperate for progress, just plays the game for the story and activities etc. I'm a casual player who participates in endgame, and does some activities solo. I don't have a set group, don't have a static, don't multibox, don't play more than a couple of hours a day or under 10 a week, sometimes goes days without logging in, etc. I don't grind events until my butt hurts from sitting too long. I don't care if I miss out on VanaBout Rewards or forget to use my canteen or don't use my sortie plate. I just play at my own pace. That's entirely different from "solo".
Can you name a single endgame event you can accomplish successfully solo in this game? You can casually do PUG 8/9Boss, Segments, Gaol, Dynamis-D, Omen, etc without making a commitment to a group. But you can't really do many of those on your own completely solo (at least not successfully with large progress), unless your character is really good, or the content is dated (like Omen). And for it to have gotten to that point, you must have joined some groups to make that kind of progress, which is the opposite of what you are implying (a completely solo person trying to progress). Casual <> Solo
Idk what a casual player wants, but from my experience as a 'casual' in other games, I see what the endgame looks like and how long/how much it takes to get there. ***in this game is slow.
I mean it does take longer for a casual player to make progress, but that's the same for anything. A hardcore gym bro will make more progress than a casual gym guy. A workaholic will generally make more money and progress career-wise faster than someone who works casually for a living without putting a lot of effort into it. That's just a function of more time = more results. How are you seriously arguing that a person who is not willing to put in the same time as someone else should be able to progress faster because of a limitation in their own circumstances? It's an MMO, why would you think that game model would benefit a person who chooses to play alone and less?
Pick whatever imaginary situation you want:
a) I can't commit to more than 30 mins at once
b) My schedule is too erratic and a static doesn't work (always a 9-5 office slave talking about scheduing not being an issue, lul)
c) I don't like other people
d) Anything else you can dream of for a hypothetical victim
TBH, none of these arguments make any sense, and sounds like fake outrage.
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By Shichishito 2026-04-29 01:41:46
Well if you're not grinding to be accepted into "elite" groups then there is still SE with their odyssey design that is balanced around having 3 different jobs.
Carbuncle.Maletaru
Server: Carbuncle
Game: FFXI
Posts: 4179
By Carbuncle.Maletaru 2026-04-29 01:45:34
Well if you're not grinding to be accepted into "elite" groups then there is still SE with their odyssey design that is balanced around having 3 different jobs.
Yeah, SE who famously said you need to have 3 prime weapons for all the jobs you're soloing Gaol on.
...Before prime weapons were released. To take advantage of the prime aftermath. From all your trust buffs.
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By Shichishito 2026-04-29 01:48:43
So a solo player would get frustrated that they can't solo a weapon that comes from group content and only is strong when it is powered up by other people's buffs in endgame setting? I don't have one but from what I read prime sword for instance does best on BLU when you're solo multi SCing.
By Ranoutofspace 2026-04-29 01:51:20
Maletaru doesn't realize you can have standards for yourself, and Buukki up in arms about swapping words around when my main point was the content is too slow and boring to slog through. If you solo, it sucks. If you're casual, it sucks. If you're elitist, it sucks. It all around sucks.
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Lakshmi.Buukki
Server: Lakshmi
Game: FFXI
By Lakshmi.Buukki 2026-04-29 01:56:27
my main point was the content is too slow and boring to slog through. If you solo, it sucks. If you're casual, it sucks. If you're elitist, it sucks. It all around sucks.
There is no reason to play FFXI if you ever get to this point.
By Ranoutofspace 2026-04-29 01:59:09
I enjoy hanging with the boys and getting ***done and making progress but it is boring. Might as well hop off the forums and the internet as a whole if you aren't ready to hear some complaints.
Carbuncle.Maletaru
Server: Carbuncle
Game: FFXI
Posts: 4179
By Carbuncle.Maletaru 2026-04-29 02:05:07
I don't have one but from what I read prime sword for instance does best on BLU when you're solo multi SCing.
I don't have a sword either, and I don't play solo (1 character) BLU, but i think you'd be hard pressed to make long SCs with BLU by itself. Even if you can cap magic haste, without samurai roll and with no mythic AM3, I doubt doing more than 2, possibly 3 SCs is really possible.
If you want a casual solo experience that isn't grindy...why in the absolute *** wouldn't you pick FFXI? I agree with "there are lots of games with a hetter ROI".
By design. It's an MMO, not a mobile game for tweens with a weak grasp of delayed gratification.
Asura.Sechs
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 11302
By Asura.Sechs 2026-04-29 02:36:48
Shouldn't it be moderately easy with your average 2026 gear and Hoxne Ampulla?
I haven't tried myself but was assuming it to be not that hard to pull off even without Mythic AM3.
By Shichishito 2026-04-29 02:46:48
Carbuncle.Maletaru said: »Yeah, SE who famously said you need to have 3 prime weapons for all the jobs you're soloing Gaol on.
...Before prime weapons were released. To take advantage of the prime aftermath. From all your trust buffs. Well if we go by what SE says out loud then all content is balanced around not needing PREMA.
The content is there, it's still afaik considered end game, tougher than what came after and none of the higher tiers have been cleared solo by anyone.
SE balanced odyssey around bringing 3 jobs and (I could be wrong here) I expect it to still be balanced around 3 jobs even when it becomes eventually more accessible for soloing.
Top tier equipment will also always open up the possibility to solo the next vengeance tier sooner than without top tier equipment.
Carbuncle.Maletaru said: »I don't have a sword either, and I don't play solo (1 character) BLU, but i think you'd be hard pressed to make long SCs with BLU by itself. Even if you can cap magic haste, without samurai roll and with no mythic AM3, I doubt doing more than 2, possibly 3 SCs is really possible. The old glass canon BLU sets already put you in a similarish ballpark as Tizona aftermath in terms of multi hits. In 2026 we also have sworn set and hoxne ampulla.
The sword can also be equipped by RDM and PLD, both of which have access to bonanza shield.
Carbuncle.Maletaru said: »If you want a casual solo experience that isn't grindy...why in the absolute *** wouldn't you pick FFXI? I agree with "there are lots of games with a hetter ROI". I made mythics, ergon and empys for my favorite jobs, all of them I've done mostly solo and all of them were grindy.
Asura.Sechs
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 11302
By Asura.Sechs 2026-04-29 02:55:44
Carbuncle.Maletaru said: »If you want a casual solo experience that isn't grindy...why in the absolute *** wouldn't you pick FFXI? I kinda agree with this, altough this sentence mostly goes towards completely new players, and are there a considerable amount of them? Honestly I doubt.
FFXI hasn't always been this grindy. Altough I guess, at least if I'm to follow the shared opinions over communities like FFXIAH (which is absolutely relevant, but probably not a good "mirror" of the whole FFXI population out there), those periods in time weren't very liked.
And of course those "rhythms" wouldn't be manageable at all with nowadays' dev staff and the pace at which they release new stuff.
Game would be dead by now probably if it kept going with the current pace of new stuff released AND the non-grindiness that was reached during those windows of time I'm referring to.
Lakshmi.Buukki
Server: Lakshmi
Game: FFXI
By Lakshmi.Buukki 2026-04-29 03:18:26
FFXI hasn't always been this grindy.
I don't know about this revisionist history. Before, you couldn't do a thing endgame without a dedicated group, and you had to compete with the group for everything. Making a Relic was damn near impossible, you paid the leader to fund dynamis runs so he could get a relic while you lotted shitty armor for mnd+4. Hope nobody else needed that (RDM hat) or you're fked. Making a Mythic was ultra grindy early on, and Salvage sets also took a long time to make. Plus, Salvage early on was pretty hard for most players. How many players can you recall had 5/5 Usukane or Ares set within 6-9 months of Salvage release? Camping HNMs was an every-night kind of thing and you had to compete with the server; how many people in the LS got Ridills, Herald Gaiters, Drings etc? Sky was also a slog; if you missed the event you were ***-out. You acquired dumb LS points to allow you to lot stuff, and everyone was saving them up for Wlegs, Byakko's Haidate, and Osode. No individual person could work towards that gear without having to compete with dozens of other people. Even leveling past 65~ was a nightmare, especially if you were something like BLM, BST, DRG w/e. You never got invited to stuff unless you got creative with Flan or all-BST parties. Hitting 75 back then felt like you beat the game (pre-abyssea Dominion Ops Parties). FFXI may not have seemed grindy, but my memory is very clear on that era. Your progress was ultra slow in endgame.
Compared to today, you can make progress every single day just being a casual non-static player. You don't need a 7-day-a-week static to make a Stage 4/5 Prime. You don't need a static to build any REMA. You can accomplish most goals on your own just saving your resources and plugging away at it. It's a way different game now.
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Asura.Sechs
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 11302
By Asura.Sechs 2026-04-29 03:56:26
I think my words unwillingly mislead you Buukki.
Huge WOT on FFXI history I think all of the lv75 era of FFXI was way grindier and less accessible than today. Game was much different and times were different so it's hard to make a 1:1 comparison but mostly the access to endgame wasn't as "demanding" as some activities today, but access to it was mostly kept at gate by groups (HNMLS) who were basically controlling endgame activities on each server.
This has been pretty much true since game release in 2003 (US) until ~2010.
Everything took insane amount of effort (if we measure "effort" with "time"). Moving around, obtaining anything, even a single level through the loved/hated exp parties and so on.
Then came Abyssea. When it did, it broke several FFXI taboos in what probably was, in their mind, an attempt to make FFXI completely different, squeezed of all its essence to grant players 1-2 years of a different experience for a game that, in their plans, was probably goin to die eventually.
Things went different of course, but Abyssea granted: step by step, accesso to "endgame" to a lot of people, slowly destroying that gatekeeping I mentioned that was kept in place by HNMLSs.
Small groups, multiboxers, even soloers eventually rose up and the game started to accelerate in everything, with a completely difference pace and ratio of effort:reward. You could get max level afk lol, farm good gear and so on.
Some people liked it, a lot of people whined because that wasn't "real FFXI" and so on, we all remember how it went.
Then they tried to slow things a bit with the 90>95 Empy updates and following ones, with Voidwatch.
Things got furtherly slowed down by stuff like Legion (finally offering some challenge akeen to the previous days, after years of "proc" systems).
Then came Seekers of Adoulin, with its new "ilevel" system, which slowly changed all of our gearing paradigms to offer "level up" beyond level 99.
Stuff was tough at start, but slowly things got easier. Sure your average player couldn't solo or lowman Delve, but getting a spot for Plasm was easy and relatively cheap and allowed you to get powerful gear relatively easy/fast.
They added HTBF and lots of stuff.
Point is that not everything was soloable (hardly anything?) but most things were relatively easy and there was a large amount of new gear and items that allowed you to "power up" relatively fast without any huge grind.
Grind remained in the form of RMEA weapons, which finally got updated with the 300 Pluton/Riftborn/Beitetsu.
Was still quite a grind to get the 95 and 99 steps (a lot of people back then still stopped at the 90 level and were using Delve weapons)
They added Job Points too, which were insanely grindy at start (and most people were simply ignoring them) until they added Gifts and gave a different purpose to Job Points making them quite accessible. Grindy but reasonable.
A lot of stuff was in that group during those years.
Then came the 10k Beit/Plut/Rift step and most people thought it was insane, yet it slowly became easier and faster. (and if you were impatient you could "cheat" with RMT, which has always been a thing in FFXI I guess)
All the content that came after was still somewhat grindy but reasonable and you could "cheat" through most of them really. Vagary, Omen, Divergence.
Hardly anything was being stopped by "difficulty" except maybe Wave3 kills at start? Which were necessary to "reforge" your RMEA but, again, you had alternative (altough extremely unefficient) paths, or you could simply "pay" mercs.
Then came Odyssey Gaol, which eventually presented a content that due to several factors was very hard to "cheat" on (altough not impossible) and extremely grindy, but that got partially broken with the Mog Amplifier exploit which never got patched and at this point never will.
The last steps we're getting are Prime Weapons and Sortie, which is again something maybe not particularly hard but not easy either, not very realistic to Merc either, unless all you aim for are Stage4, and those are still pretty strong and realistically obtainable even by average soloers/multiboxers/lowmen.
The same is even more true for Limbus, but again the amount of grind is pretty huge, yet I'd dare to say perfectly suitable for soloers with a lot of time and will and not necessarily a lot of skill.
So tl;dr has the game always been as grindy as it is in the last year(s)? Yes, with a few notable exceptions in some windows of time where everything was very accelerated and the effort:reward was quite different from what FFXI got us old timers used to.
Those windows of time kinda spoiled a lot of us, I'm afraid.
Personally I liked those windows of time and I think they're more in line with how gaming changed in the current times, but at the same time I can't deny those rhythms wouldn't be sustainable with the amount of people working on the game these days. If they kept the "acceleration" at those levels with the current pace of content release, game would be dead already by now probably.
Shiva.Ramzi
Server: Shiva
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6
By Shiva.Ramzi 2026-04-29 05:08:20
Interesting thought experiment here on the chicken and the egg.
Why prepare your character for end game if you are just playing solo? Why grind out muffins or segs just to use trusts to power up your base level T3/T4 gears with minimum potency buffs?
I think maybe just some players like to see their character progress and they would rather do it themselves without any commitments if possible.
For myself, I'm not expecting any trust changes to suddenly make me clear any hard content worth mentioning. The problem is no matter how much stronger they are, most hard content is reliant on specific strategies that trusts can't adapt to, so you will fail 100% of the time unless they can just keep you alive long enough to execute the strat on your own.
With the implementation of the new trust upgrade system, which trust do you think will be the most useful. I noticed the base stats were 0/50, so presumably a boost of +50 to each stat?
I think boosting August's VIT, HP, AGI and MND might be my first port of call.
What's going to be your first and why?
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