Did Ff16 Flop?

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Did ff16 flop?
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 Asura.Thunderjet
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By Asura.Thunderjet 2024-01-15 00:30:17
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https://www.reddit.com/r/FinalFantasy/s/RaHUHowvkO

I think matusai should be the one to to lead ff17 he is entitled to have it, not only he worked in 11 for 20 years he was a director for crono trigger.
Not to mention he also was moved to 14 to fix the battle for arr!
I don’t understand this stupid mind set by yoshi that it has to be action, look at baldurs gate, ff needs to evolve in the turn based genre, don’t change what is already main to the franchise..
We dont want action rpg
I want to cast haste reflect double magic limit break and nuke stuff!!!!!!!
What makes dragon quest xi good its still a turn based game!!
Square needs to treat ff like dq!
Make a vagrant story 2
Make a new kingdom hearts
Dont add ***to finalfantasy
Satisfy your older fans if you want a new generation of fans, or else they will lose their 30 years of their fanbse, ff was a lifestyle to me do you guys dont remember waiting for a new console to imagine how a new ff will be like in that console?

The sales is bad for 2023-2024 standards alot of the fans are grown up too it should be much higher
https://www.vgchartz.com/game/226241/final-fantasy/
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 Asura.Thunderjet
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By Asura.Thunderjet 2024-01-15 00:49:42
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Bump i want to know everyone’s point of view. And what a new ff should be maybe my mind will change, but i doubt after playing 16
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By Ruaumoko 2024-01-15 03:19:04
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I recently finished XVI and honestly... I really liked it and I'm not big into action games.

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The story was great, characters and voice work was top tier, and the absolute spectacle of the Eikon battles was unreal. I've not experienced world-building and characters on this level in the series since XII. Oh, and it's soundtrack won an award for a reason; it's stellar.

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I also liked the numerous callbacks to previous entries in the series, really reminded me of IX in that way. Even small things like...

I did think that the combat system was solid but if you knew what you were doing and mastered the mechanics you could easily break the game with ability combos and absolutely melt bosses or clear crowds instantly.

I liked that they started you off with 4 'cheat' rings that served as training wheels, since they likely knew that some would come into the game completely unprepared for how hectic the battles can become. On the flip side I felt that magic elements from the different Eikons were completely inconsequential. I'd have liked to have seen that factoring in.

About the series going more action orientated. Yeah, it's going to put off some die-hard fans of turn-based combat but the series needs to evolve or it's going to fade. Atlus proved that turn-based systems can work with Persona 5 being the smash hit it was but I would put good money on Persona 6 being action-orientated. I think that the best combat system Square-Enix has come up with recently was that of VII Remake, how combat can flow and be hectic but you can slow it down when choosing spells and abilities.

I'd rate XVI a 9/10.
Far better than XIII and XV, neither of which I could even finish.
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 Cerberus.Natsuhiko
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By Cerberus.Natsuhiko 2024-01-15 03:23:16
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The modern SE rot goes further back than just 16:

13-1, -2, and -3 all had a different gimmick but each managed to suck in a different way.
15 was just terrible; I watched this one on youtube
Chaos bad: the game wasn't great but had a few neat ideas

This is also the same company that greenlit Forspoken and other ethic-department approved garbage. They probably don't even see me as the target demographic anymore outside of nostalgia-bait like 7R.

Honestly, I'm more surprised that DQ has largely gone unscathed; I don't trust them to make anything else decent.

Edit: I also do stuff like wait for games to be 90% off, don't pre-order, and haven't bought a console since the DS. AAA gaming in general is *** atm.
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By jubes 2024-01-15 03:50:01
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i enjoyed the story quite a bit, which is the only reason i bought it. had no shame in using the ring that lets you dodge everything and basically be unkillable either. you could say that at that point it is more movie than game and i wouldn't argue, but sometimes that's ok. i don't think this particular story would have worked well otherwise.

having said that, i would love to see a new turn based ff even if it is not a numbered title. there are plenty of good examples of modern ones out there.
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By Shiva.Haldarn 2024-01-15 03:51:30
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Played XVI through on normal mode, didn't use cheat rings. I suck at action games; found XV tedious and am terribad at Dark Souls. However, found XVI to be a piece of piss.

Graphics were stellar as aways for S-E, cutscenes were well-choreographed, dialogue was WAY off in parts (too many F-bombs). Character progression system was lame, item progression was utterly linear and dull, storyline was atrocious, characters weren't interesting, music was super-average AAA RPG, inspiring fantasy environments were strong, enemies were run-of-the-mill FF, AI scripting/moves were trivial.

Got to the end for New Game Plus, but could not face sitting through it again; there was too much cinematic and the gameplay gave you nothing to think about.

Personally, it was a flop for me (like XV). I think VII-R has done a good job of marrying the 'action' to the 'turn-based' and that should be the direction for FFXVII and beyond. Matsui would be a great choice and it would be cool if he made XVII online-heavy; a solo game with MMO elements like shared world, auction house, the odd group challenge, linkshells, modern web/app integration, persistent and updated world/storyline (one sub for all S-E games!).
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By CrAZYVIC 2024-01-15 05:21:31
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I finished FFXVI and fell in love with the gameplay. As a huge fan of the Souls series and Monster Hunter World, its gameplay was exquisite, but there's something that disappointed me.

I detest the story and its characters. Additionally, Yoshi-P used many animations, models, and textures from FFXIV to save resources, which infuriates me, considering FFXIV is a game with PS3-level graphics from 10 years ago. I expected something on the level of God of War Ragnarok, at the very least.

FFXVI is a title I completed once and will never play again in my life.

Similar to FFXIV, I adore the "gameplay", raids, extreme primals, fates, etc., but the story is horrendous, especially the way it's presented with tiny subtitles at the bottom and using archaic colonial English. No thanks.

WoW-Retail is the only MMORPG whose stories I find fascinating. Additionally, all the cutscenes are voice-acted, and the game encourages playing, defeating enemies, exploring the map, and completing quests. In comparison, FFXIV seems limited to "Report quest x30 times" -> dungeon. I repeat, I adore the gameplay of FFXIV-FFXVI, but their lore is the worst I've seen since FFXIII-2 and FFXIII-3.

Oh, I forgot to mention something about a hypothetical FFXVII. Hopefully, it is made by the same creator as XV, or the creators of FFVII Remake or they bring back the legendary Hironobu Sakaguchi to restore the quality lost in FF since XIII.

But concerning Yoshida, I don't want him in a numbered FF. He's a genius with MMORPGs, so give him the next FF-ONLINE, but please, don't put him in another offline game.
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By Felgarr 2024-01-15 05:53:30
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Asura.Thunderjet said: »
https://www.reddit.com/r/FinalFantasy/s/RaHUHowvkO

I think matusai should be the one to to lead ff17 he is entitled to have it, not only he worked in 11 for 20 years he was a director for crono trigger.
Not to mention he also was moved to 14 to fix the battle for arr!
I don’t understand this stupid mind set by yoshi that it has to be action, look at baldurs gate, ff needs to evolve in the turn based genre, don’t change what is already main to the franchise..
We dont want action rpg
I want to cast haste reflect double magic limit break and nuke stuff!!!!!!!
What makes dragon quest xi good its still a turn based game!!
Square needs to treat ff like dq!
Make a vagrant story 2
Make a new kingdom hearts
Dont add ***to finalfantasy
Satisfy your older fans if you want a new generation of fans, or else they will lose their 30 years of their fanbse, ff was a lifestyle to me do you guys dont remember waiting for a new console to imagine how a new ff will be like in that console?

The sales is bad for 2023-2024 standards alot of the fans are grown up too it should be much higher
https://www.vgchartz.com/game/226241/final-fantasy/


Vagrant Story was such a good game. Literally top-tier.
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 Phoenix.Iocus
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By Phoenix.Iocus 2024-01-15 06:34:35
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Was FF16 a flop? Idk. I stopped buying playstations for FF games because they weren't worth it. Maybe when it comes to steam it will have aged well, but I doubt it if Yoshi-P is already looking for the door on FF17. They did an amazing job of killing my interest by making it exclusive and I won't go out of my way to find out until it's convenient for me.

And yes Vagrant Story was great especially for the time and I'd love for them to figure out how to make that universe work presently. They are making another Kingdom Hearts game. Enix bought Square, DQ vs FF is a reflection of that and make sense because DQ is JP centric and FF is for westerners post FF7.

The important thing for me is they keep making Mana Series games not on phones. My sub money is finally going where I want it. Wink wink

Asura.Thunderjet said: »
The sales is bad for 2023-2024 standards alot of the fans are grown up too it should be much higher
If the game is more cinematically inclined, you know what breaks that immersion? Children. You know what a lot of grown up fans have? Children.

The game is MA 17+. It's not kid friendly at all.
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 Shiva.Myamoto
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By Shiva.Myamoto 2024-01-15 07:39:24
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I share the same sentiment as Rua's post above, thoroughly enjoyed 16 and everything it offered. I really enjoyed the gameplay... it was a lot of fun, the story I felt was very captivating and powerful. One of my favourite Final Fantasy series releases in a long long time to be honest (not including 7 remake).

If anyone has not played it, highly recommend you give it a shot before basing opinions on sales data.
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By Onimaru 2024-01-15 08:08:34
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Sometimes less is more. I also think they should go back to basics and return to turn base. Polish the turn based combat and focus on the story like they did for FFIX and FFX, which are still flagships on the franchise.

I think they did all they could do for action rpg for FFXV and it worked. They maxed out that game in both story and gameplay. And since it was such a success theyve been trying to emulate it somehow (the formula). Ppl are alrdy getting their action RPG fix from FF7's MANY remakes (lol wtf?). Simplicity is key
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 Shiva.Thorny
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By Shiva.Thorny 2024-01-15 08:36:35
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I watched my gf play through it(pretty much the entire playthrough) for the story. Story was okay, not one of SE's best. Animation was obviously very high quality. Don't feel like it was a ripoff for the cost, or a waste of time playing through, but it certainly wasn't anything amazing either.

We both thought the gameplay was mediocre at best. I didn't time them, but some of the eikon fights seemed to go past 40 minutes without actually becoming challenging.. which I considered appalling. Wandered off to knock out some chores and she'd still be in the same fight when I got back.

Can't fathom doing a second playthrough myself, or going around getting every side quest, or any of the things that I would've done in older FFs. It's too bland, it was a safe bet aimed at dragging in more general gamers and diverged too far from typical FF in my opinion.
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By RadialArcana 2024-01-15 09:24:44
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 Bismarck.Stephenjd
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By Bismarck.Stephenjd 2024-01-15 12:01:18
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Using vgchartz for sales is dumb and no we don't know how well it has done as we don't know internal predictions of sales.

This seems like a troll thread though so...
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 Asura.Eiryl
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By Asura.Eiryl 2024-01-15 12:20:42
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You know it sold poorly because they never released numbers blowing themselves after the presales.

Had it done well they'd have been autofellating themselves everywhere someone would listen.

"buT iTs beCauSe Ps5 ExCluSive"

Shouldn't have shot themselves in the *** by taking the bribe.
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 Sylph.Funkworkz
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By Sylph.Funkworkz 2024-01-15 12:25:21
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I really enjoyed it, and I am just starting my "final fantasy mode" playthrough.

The only gripe I really had was the linear weapon/armor upgrade paths. No alternatives to lean one way or another for stats, its just plain replacements every story progression point.
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 Lakshmi.Avereith
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By Lakshmi.Avereith 2024-01-15 12:58:30
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Played it through once. Wouldn't play it again tho and didn't even think of doing the ng+ or whatever
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By Taint 2024-01-15 13:58:01
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I'm only a few hours in but I think its pretty awesome. I'd prefer a more traditional RPG but the action is well done and easy to have fun with.

I am tired off the useless curse words in games and wish I could turn them off. I'm a father of 4 (oldest in 10) its a pain trying to play a game that says *** often. I have the same issue with GoW but its more pronounced in FF16.
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 Phoenix.Enochroot
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By Phoenix.Enochroot 2024-01-15 14:26:59
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Phoenix.Iocus said: »
Was FF16 a flop? Idk. I stopped buying playstations for FF games because they weren't worth it

Same, PS2 was my last Playstation. Still got it kicking around here somewhere with the clunky HDD hanging off the back.

For those pining for a return to the FF1-6 days, I'll re-up my recommendation for the original Final Fantasy Dimensions, which was a mobile game (which you paid for; wasn't gatcha) but that leaned heavily on 4 & 5. It was entertaining and I'd like to see more of it and less 13, 15, 16.
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By Draylo 2024-01-15 15:37:53
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Flopped, game is trash
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By fillerbunny9 2024-01-15 15:58:48
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Well, it was number 12 for games sold in Japan for 2023, on a list almost completely dominated by the Switch, so in the motherland it did pretty well; it was the best selling PS5 game in Japan if the numbers are to be believed. Worldwide sales it seems tougher to find numbers. As of last August is had been purchased by 3% of PS5 owners, which SE defended as not bad. Considering how they have viewed sales numbers in the past, I suspect they are choking back tears as they say this because it did not make ALL the money.
 Bismarck.Stephenjd
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By Bismarck.Stephenjd 2024-01-15 16:18:07
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A lot of old people in here stuck in their ways. It's cool (I'm one of them) and makes sense due to this being a forum for a game older than the target market for 16.

I thought 16 was fine and a fun 30+ hours. Not perfect at all but I feel all FF games have quite a lot of flaws. FF doesn't have to stick to a specific formula and it hasn't been pure turn based for decades. And if it stuck to a formula, 11 wouldn't have ever existed. I remember when 11 was hated for being a numbered game and being online only.
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By Draylo 2024-01-15 16:34:52
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The good old "you're just oid to understand why its so good." Last I checked, the older audience is the majority of the FF fanbase with the highest spending power lol. Point to the huge success of this game and I'll wait. Not to mention almost nobody is playing it now, it just fell off the map after initial launch and then DLC.
There aren't countless videos being made for it like most games, it is just a big flop.

Also, how old are you even? Most gamers these days are used to diverse gameplay styles, we aren't "stuck in our ways." I've personally played thru many different styles of gameplay, including DMC5, and enjoyed them. I just didn't enjoy their half assed attempt to copy other games in this one. You gotta love how when people voice dissenting opinions, its automatically got to be rationalized by the supporters as they are "old" or "out of touch." Nobody said it had to be turn based, FF7R has great success and isn't turned based and most of the fan base likes that system. A half assed action RPG isn't anything new by any means, not even for final fantasy.
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 Bismarck.Stephenjd
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By Bismarck.Stephenjd 2024-01-15 16:44:07
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FF7R hasn't had an update in sales numbers for ages, we don't really know if that was a success either. Similar to 16.

It's the same ***you pull with 14 funnily enough.

And I'm probably close to your age.
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By Draylo 2024-01-15 16:47:48
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The same ***? Like giving my opinion in a thread asking for opinions? Why does it bother you so much that people dislike it? The fact you think your opinion is superior, for what reason and based on what?
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By jubes 2024-01-15 16:49:14
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i'll let SE's accountants decide whether the game was flipping or flopping.

just a quick glance here shows that roughly half liked it and half didn't. sounds about right for a recent ff. sadly its been years and years since a unanimously good title, and even those get debated to death.
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 Bismarck.Stephenjd
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By Bismarck.Stephenjd 2024-01-15 16:50:39
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Draylo said: »
The same ***? Like giving my opinion in a thread asking for opinions? Why does it bother you so much that people dislike it? The fact you think your opinion is superior, for what reason and based on what?

My opinion is superior to yours specifically because I at least tried to put some effort into it rather than a drive by "Flopped, game is trash".

Those 4 words added nothing to this thread. Maybe explain why you thought it was trash? What bosses you didn't like etc?

Edit: Also the irony that you talk about being bothered by people disliking things when you've spent a lot of time being bothered by people not liking retail FFXI and liking private servers.
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 Asura.Saevel
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By Asura.Saevel 2024-01-15 17:01:29
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Didn't really like it, for Action RPG I find the Y's or Tails games to be more fun and engaging. I believe that SE focuses too much on visuals and not enough on engagement, it really felt like playing a movie.
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By Draylo 2024-01-15 17:02:28
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You apparently can't discuss different topics without dragging up anything from someones post history across various debates and topics. Even though its completely irrelevant, my issue with private servers has nothing to do with them just disliking retail, its more nuanced than that.

Its no wonder people use fake and sock accounts, people are incapable of discussing a current topic without resorting to it when they get offended. I gave my opinion through various threads on this topic, probably over 5+ threads and I was just answering OP directly. Your opinion isn't superior, and I have no obligation to you. You even came into this thread automatically declaring the OP a troll, looks like you are quite defensive in every post you make.
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 Bismarck.Stephenjd
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By Bismarck.Stephenjd 2024-01-15 17:07:37
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It was probably a bit too 'cinematic' at times and that's certainly something that can be dialled down for the next game. I can see what they were going for but yeah it was overused for storytelling. Some of the sidequests involve a bit more engagement though and some of the later sidequests are quite fun. SE have focused on visuals from 10 and arguably even since 7 so if that is something you don't care for I completely understand.
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