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A Swing and a Myth: Guide to Liberator
Server: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3753
By Leviathan.Celebrindal 2021-11-07 08:16:39
To be blunt, I didn't know we were comparing doing a Light SC with Calad against a Dark SC on a scythe, I was merely referring to the general habit of having better 3+ step chains with a scythe than gswd, not discussing properties.
Also you completely went full boar on dissing Liberator's darkness SC potential, and ignore me saying flat out that I think Redemption is a much better option these days, no matter how much I love Liberator myself.
If you wish to question what are "good" scythe multistep darkness skillchains, then let's compare apples to apples and compare Scythe vs Gswd darkness chains, and then Scythe vs Gswd light chains. Not one against the other.
By SimonSes 2021-11-07 09:02:15
I did it, because that's not the first post from various people, who talk about Liberator specifically being good for self SCing in general and Darkness was mentioned more than Light. Im not gonna waste time searching specific posts now, unless you will tell me it never happened, but you know its not true, so I hope you wont argue about it.
If you mentioned Gsword vs Scythe tho. I think for Light SC Scourge > Resolution > Torcleaver is probably competitive to what Liberator can do and simple Torcleaver spam with Caladbolg can potentially beat Scythe skillchain too, depends how big is skillchain weakness on target.
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Server: Leviathan
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By Leviathan.Celebrindal 2021-11-07 09:10:23
I did it, because that's not the first post from various people, who talk about Liberator specifically being good for self SCing in general and Darkness was mentioned more than Light. Im not gonna waste time searching specific posts now, unless you will tell me it never happened, but you know its not true, so I hope you wont argue about it.
If you mentioned Gsword vs Scythe tho. I think for Light SC Scourge > Resolution > Torcleaver is probably competitive to what Liberator can do and simple Torcleaver spam with Caladbolg can potentially beat Scythe skillchain too, depends how big is skillchain weakness on target.
I agree that Gswd has workable Light options in the 2 and 3 step format that extremely powerful. In fact, I'm currently strongly debating building a Ragnarok just to add that mix into my options even as a Calad owner. So on that front, no doubt we're on the same page.
I do think people generalize mythics a lot by saying "oh they're good for skillchains", its true. And when you're working with the attached WS (Insurgency) having so much potential not only for solo multistep light options, but also plays well with friends on that side, no doubt when comparing what Liberator can do, the stronger option is going to be light vs darkness.
But for some, in particular in Odyssey:Gaol fights where you're going to be lacking Hasso, that AM3 on a mythic can make up for less than ideal sets and making that chaining a thing that happens vs doesn't- and that's a big difference from comparing best option to another option that still works, just not as strong.
With strong enough sets and buffs, 3 and 4 step chains with Apoc or Redemption are quite possible and very productive as well, but I do think they require more. And for many, AM3 becomes a crutch to avoid truly analyzing sets and buffs to improve them, rather than a tool added to the mix in a positive way.
Server: Asura
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By Asura.Geriond 2021-11-07 09:20:30
What's that DPS store TP build for Liberator that is so much better in DPS than Sakpata? Attack capped and uncapped if possible. Im only getting 6-8% difference in damage compering 5/5 Sakpata and store TP build. Is this a difference you are talking about? Using Flamma Head/hands, Hjarrandi body, Odyssean Legs with 8 STP augment, and Valorous feet with 8 STP augment, when a 60 STP Samurai roll is up I'm getting about 8.9% lower with 5/5 R20 Sakpata than full STP set when uncapped, 5.8% lower when capped. The differences increase to about 12.7% and 9.6% respectively if you don't have SAM roll for whatever reason or other.
Given that Liberator is already a bit behind Caladbolg in DPS, this much of a further drop when you have to play defensive is significant.
Ok this is something that really gets me confused. What are those famous long Darkness skillchain with Liberator, that you keep talking about? Especially not involving "crap WSs"? I never said anything about long Darkness SCs.
By SimonSes 2021-11-07 09:39:16
I never said anything about long Darkness SCs.
Fine, what are good darkness SCs with Liberator. Short or long w/e. Unless you just meant that you can make Darkness self SC at all with Liberator and you can't with Calad, so it automatically is better if Darkness SC is super effective? :)
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By Asura.Geriond 2021-11-07 09:41:37
Neither, because I'm talking about making Darkness with others, not self-SCing.
If a mob takes significantly higher Darkness SC damage than Light SC damage (like 25% vs 100% or 50% vs 130%), you can use Entropy or Cross Reaper (preferably the latter) instead of Insurgency when applicable to participate in better SCs with others than Caladbolg can work with, and the SC damage will make up for them being a bit weaker than Liberator Insurgency.
By SimonSes 2021-11-07 09:48:28
Yes, the latter. If a mob takes say, 25% light SC damage but 100% darkness SC damage, you can use Entropy or Cross Reaper instead of Insurgency when applicable to participate in better SCs with others than Caladbolg can work with.
Well to be fair if you take other people into the equation, then Caladbolg can make a massive Darkness, since Torcleaver is Distortion/Light. So as closing WS to make Darkness with some Graviation WS Caladbolg/Torcleaver is actually very powerful. It's only a problem when you need to self SC and want Darkness. I agree Liberator is more flexible here tho, since you can use Distortion or Gravitation. That being said, if I would use Scythe to make Darkness skillchain with someone, because I need Gravitation WS, I wouldn't use Liberator probably, unless that's only REMA Scythe I have.
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By Asura.Geriond 2021-11-07 09:52:21
This was just a comparison between Liberator and Caladbolg, not a comparison between Liberator and other scythes, though. I agree I'd probably use Anguta or Redemption if Darkness SC flexibility was important, but that wasn't the conversation.
 Asura.Bippin
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By Asura.Bippin 2021-11-07 11:28:00
Setting up lua for what Absorbs to swap in Liberator, I assume it does nothing for Absorb-Attri? Does it work for TP?
By Nariont 2021-11-07 11:38:08
Pretty sure its only for the base stat absorbs and maybe abs-acc, doesnt work on the rest
By Kyniker 2021-11-07 11:45:58
Thanks for the feedback guys, I'm gonna consider making Liberator, I'm really drawn to Redemption but the Chloris farm is just so damn awfull xD, I'm working towards the TP sets on the HighEnd DRK tread for Liberator, but I doubt I'll ever use it since all the content I do with DRK is Odyssey and Ambuscade V1VD, and without Sakpata I'll probably end as a floor tank
 Cerberus.Kylos
Server: Cerberus
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Posts: 3974
By Cerberus.Kylos 2021-11-07 12:23:42
Thanks for the feedback guys, I'm gonna consider making Liberator, I'm really drawn to Redemption but the Chloris farm is just so damn awfull xD, I'm working towards the TP sets on the HighEnd DRK tread for Liberator, but I doubt I'll ever use it since all the content I do with DRK is Odyssey and Ambuscade V1VD, and without Sakpata I'll probably end as a floor tank
You won't regret it, I'm switching between Calad and Lib depending what I'm doing. Redemption only useful in niche situations.
Asura.Bippin
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1039
By Asura.Bippin 2021-11-07 12:31:52
Pretty sure its only for the base stat absorbs and maybe abs-acc, doesnt work on the rest That would follow with what I have found on wiki
https://www.bg-wiki.com/ffxi/Category:Absorb_Spell#Equipment
Server: Leviathan
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By Leviathan.Celebrindal 2021-11-07 12:33:10
You won't regret it, I'm switching between Calad and Lib depending what I'm doing. Redemption only useful in niche situations.
Its so interesting- I could say the exact same thing about Calad/Redemption and its Lib that has grown into more niche- but a lot depends on play style, typical buff situation you face, and content. DRK really has grown up in the past 5 years into a very complex and enjoyable DD in my book.
Asura.Bippin
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1039
By Asura.Bippin 2021-11-07 12:36:43
In the world full of Savage blade spam Insurgency is nice for making lights off of it.
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Liberator has always been an amazing weapon. It is by far Dark Knight's fastest weapon for raw TP gain, its top notch in landing a huge variety of spells, and as of the September 2018 version update, a contender for the top spot in Dark Knight's most damaging weapon overall.
What makes Liberator so good? Short answer: AM3 and Insurgency
Long answer: Liberator TPs faster than any other Drk weapon thanks to a combination of Aftermath level 3 and high weapon delay. It comes built-in with Insurgency, which is a surprisingly strong weapon skill which has gotten even more powerful recently. Also it excels when you need to self-skillchain, land spells on resistant targets, spam physical AoE damage, or for whatever reason need to spam magical weapon skills. On top of that its tons of fun to use in general.
Mythic Aftermath Mythic weapons have three levels of Aftermath, but only one of them is truly relevant. Aftermath level 3 (AM3) grants the user 40% chance to attack twice, and 20% chance to attack three times. This does work on weapon skills, but does not stack with double and triple attacks. This makes gearing for Liberator significantly different than gearing for other dark knight weapons, so lets get down to it.
You need an AM3 TP set. While multiattack builds rule in most other situations, they are somewhat redundant with Liberator's AM3. While it is down you want to build to 3000 TP with a standard issue multiattack set, weaponskill with Insurgency, then swap to a set of gear that prioritizes accuracy and store TP over all other stats. Ideally this will put you into a 3 hit build (Weapon skill plus 3 melee hits).
Its important to note that quadruple/triple/double attack procs from gear take priority over AM3 procs from Liberator. This means that a double attack from gear may override a triple attack from AM3 for instance. QA/TA/DA in gear are still stats that are good to have overall, but their efficacy is diminished. As a rule of thumb, consider gear DA to be worth 20% of it's listed value, gear TA to be worth 60% of its listed value, and QA to be worth about 73% of its listed value. These numbers are not perfectly accurate, but suffice for general use.
To actually create a 3hit AM3 build, you need loads of store TP. To make that easier, I put together a google spreadsheet to calculate just how much Store TP you need in TP and WS sets:
Liberator 3hit build calculator
To use it, make sure you have 528 delay set, then input your WS phase store TP and the number of hits you expect to land with your WS. The blue cell at the bottom will show you how much store TP you need for a 3hit build. Note, this does not assume Samurai sub, so make sure you factor in an extra 15 store TP.
For reference, here is the AM3 set I currently use used when this guide was posted:
ItemSet 360024
The Abyssal Beads +2 are rank25 with store TP +7
The Ankou's mantle is augmented with Store TP +10, dex +20, accuracy +30, and attack +20.
89 total store TP including /Sam sub
This particular gearset is aimed at being able to maintain a 3hit build even while using a single-hit weaponskill, assuming 22 store TP in the WS set, from /Sam and the Abyssal Beads +2.
Now lets look at something more accessible:
ItemSet 360020
This entry level set has 83 store TP with sub and assumes 0 store TP in the WS set, outside of /Sam. It requires all 4 hits of Insurgency to land. For every 3 store TP in gear beyond 83, it becomes tolerant of another hit missing.
Other gear options:
There is a ton of wiggle room when putting together your ideal build. Here are some alternatives:
Grip: bloodrain strap, nepenthe grip, nepenthe grip +1 Utu grip is by far best in slot, but these other options will do in a pinch.
Head: flamma zucchetto +2 So good its worth mentioning twice. Don't bother with anything less.
Neck: combatant's torque or ainia collar
Body: valorous mail Potentially best in slot, depending on augments and your accuracy target.
Hands: odyssean gauntlets or valorous mitts Augmented with at least store TP +6, to a maximum of +8
Rings: chirich ring, chirich ring +1, moonlight ring, petrov ring, Niqmaddu ring Niqmaddu ring is so good its worth building around, despite not having any store TP. Consider something like a dedition earring to offset the store TP you lose by not having store TP in this ring slot.
Earrings: enervating earring, neritic earring, tripudio earring Try to get earrings from one of the sets above, these alternatives mostly suck.
Back: Ankou's mantle Another item worth mentioning twice. Store TP +10, dex +20, accuracy +30, attack +20. Don't bother TPing in anything else.
Waist: ioskeha belt, ioskeha belt +1 Better than sailfi belt +1 if you are a high-buff situation and Last Resort is up. Personally I do enough low-buff content that I prefer to have at least 25% haste in gear at all times, your mileage may vary.
Legs: odyssean cuisses Augmented with at least store TP +3, maximum +8. With the right augments these can be best in slot.
Feet: valorous greaves Augmentable with store TP 1-8. If the extra store TP on these feet make or break your build, these can be a more appropriate than flamma gambieras +2.
Thats a lot about AM3, now what about putting it to use?
Weapon Skills
Insurgency
Liberator's bread-and-butter weapon skill. It consists of four hits, the first having an fTP multiplier ranging from 0.5 at 1000 TP to 6.0, subsequent hits having fTP values of 1.0 each. Liberator grants a hidden 30% damage boost to all hits, and augments can apply an additional 15%. Its stat mods are 20% Str and 20% Int, making raw stat stacking less than appealing. Because the first hit scales so well, and also because stacking multiattack is somewhat redundant, it made sense to stack this WS with all the +Weapon Skill Damage % gear you could get your hands on, even before the September 2018 update that made WSD% gear apply to all hits of weaponskills. After said version update, gearing Insurgency is a no-brainer:
ItemSet 360043
The Ankou's Mantle can be either STR+30 Acc/Att+20 WSD+10% or Dex+20 Acc+30 Att+20 WSD+10%
I have both backs and am currently using the high accuracy Ankou's to bring Insurgency's accuracy closer to parity with my TP set. At 3000 TP swap out moonshade earring for Telos, Cessance, Brutal, or another earring of your choosing.
Gear alternatives:
Ratri cuisses +1 These pants are amazing and worth taking extra time to talk about. They have higher accuracy than fallen's flanchard +3 and one less WSD% which makes them very competitive, but what really sets them apart is the store TP +10. Since 3hit builds are so thirsty for store TP, having an extra 10 in the WS set is potentially build-enabling. Do the math, look at your store TP options, and judge for yourself whether these are best-in-slot for you.
Belt: I feel like Fotia is good, but not that good. As it is most effective at low TP when Insurgency's initial hit is weak. Unfortunately, the competition for the belt slot just doesn't seem to stack up either. If anyone knows of a better belt, please let me know.
Sulevia's leggings +2 Better than NQ Ratri.
NQ Ratri set: The budget option
ignominy burgonet +3, ignominy gauntlets +3: Swap these in when you need the extra accuracy.
Valorous/Odyssean with WSD augments: I don't actually recommend these pieces because they tend to trail Ratri in accuracy and attack. And even Ratri+1 is lighter on accuracy than I would personally like. Remember that Insurgency has at least 3 extra hits that need to land, so try not to gear it like Torcleaver.
Niche WS
Spinning Scythe
What? Really? Spinning Scythe?
ItemSet 360043
Yes really. With the WSD% change Spinning Scythe under AM3 puts out a ton of AoE physical damage, unseating Fell Cleave as Drk's top AoE weapon skill. Reuse the above Insurgency gear set because accuracy/attack/WSD are key. Don't throw out your great axe though, because there are plenty of times where you need AoE and don't have time to futz around with gaining aftermath.
This was written during the WSD bug, during which multiattack and AM3 procs on weapon skill would inherit the Weapon Skill Damage values normally restricted to the primary hit. This has been fixed and while Spinning Scythe still does decent damage, for AoE Physical damage look to Fell Cleave with Lycurgos.
Shadow of Death and Infernal Scythe
ItemSet 360660
Ankou's Mantle with Str+30 Magic Acc+20 WSD+10%
I wasn't kidding when I said this section was niche. Liberator's huge TP gain and native magic accuracy make it Drk's go-to weapon for spamming tons of magic WS. Yes, its rare that you will want to spam magical WS, but there are times when its beneficial, such as blue eye statues in Dynamis San d'Oria D, abusing the attack down on Infernal Scythe or when you are opening a solo light skillchain.
Now, I will be up front and say I don't know much about magical weaponskills. The above gear set should be pretty good, but I don't know the proper ratios of MAB to WSD and the like, please let me know how this set can be improved.
Neat things you can do with a Liberator that are not spamming Insurgency Boosted Absorbs! ItemSet 362414
Carmine Mask path D
Ankou's Mantle with Magic Accuracy +30
Dark Knight gets a ton of gear to support Absorbs. Unfortunately, almost all of that gear is generally lacking in magic accuracy. We have Dark Seal, but if you aren't using that on Drain 3, you're doing it wrong. Chances are that if you need to cast Absorb-Accuracy on a target, it will have high enough magic evasion that you need all the magic accuracy you can get; there's no point stacking Absorb potency or duration if you are just going to get resisted. So stack all the magic accuracy you can get!
That said, even with Liberator, Absorbs are still too weak for general use, especially with the pitiful mods on Insurgency. Don't waste precious swing time casting them in combat. That said, they make great spells for pulling, and if a target is Perfect Dodging, Invincible, or just being kept asleep, absorb away!
Solo self skillchains! Yes, you can do these without a Liberator. But those other weapons don't have Liberator's insane TP generation, and thus can't skillchain as reliably.
If you are soloing mobs, are the only DD on a particular target, or the situation demands a skillchain, Liberator is there.
4 Step Solo Darkness
Insurgency to Entropy to Cross Reaper to Quietus = Gravitation, Darkness, Darkness.
You can string all the WS together for massive overall SC damage, or cut out Insurgency for a 3 step double darkness if you're short on time or patience.
3 Step Solo Light
Shadow of Death to Shadow of Death to Insurgency = Fragmentation, Light.
Bet you didn't think you could make Light with a Scythe. Then again, why would you want to when Torcleaver exists? Situations like the Mamool Ja Ambuscade come to mind when you need to crank out either Light or Darkness on a moment's notice without changing weapons.
Dedicated sleeper for Lowman Dynamis
Credit to Sapphire for this one. If you are in a pinch, Liberator Drk/Blm makes a great sleeper. Drain 3 plus Dread Spikes makes us highly survivable. I figure there isn't much point in posting an enfeebling gearset as that should be in the primary Dark Knight guide.
Got any crazy/silly/off-meta things you do with your Liberator? Let me know so I can add them to the list!
Neat things you can do with a Liberator that are in fact spamming Insurgency Did I mention Insurgency is really strong right now?
Insurgency is really strong right now. You should use it, it hits really hard.
That's all I can think of at the moment, please let me know what I can improve in this guide.
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