Endeavoring To Awaken --A Guide To Rune Fencer

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Endeavoring to Awaken --A Guide to Rune Fencer
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By Taint 2023-01-19 18:49:33
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Lionheart is really strong when buffed to the teeth but Epeo all the way if you have to pick one.
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By intrloper 2023-01-19 19:58:07
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I still dont have Nyame augmented at all if that matters. I could R15 both but didnt want to waste gil if I either dont end up playing RUN often or am always using Epeo. I dont know how much lionheart is used these days or if i will even be good at the job :)

Thanks for helping.
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By Nariont 2023-01-19 20:35:56
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Would just tank with them at base and see if youll even enjoy run. R15 for them is just a bonus, theres nothing really vital about them vs base versions(119 AG in epeos case)
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 Phoenix.Iocus
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By Phoenix.Iocus 2023-01-19 20:48:01
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Lion does really well when Radiance is in play, otherwise Epeo is just strong with a decent hybrid tp set. It's nice to not worry about dying on a tank
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 Odin.Creaucent
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By Odin.Creaucent 2023-01-20 07:56:21
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Epeo is no slouch for damage especially at r15 and provides some hafty tanking buffs. -75% PDT is absolutely great and AoE Liement is great if you catch a hate reset or a DD rips hate.

I normally see average 40-50k Dimi's when I'm trioing Omen bosses with a BRD and GEO.
 Bahamut.Nolatari
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By Bahamut.Nolatari 2023-01-20 08:02:52
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I would also Recommend R15ing Epeolatry. I have both at R15 and the only time I really use Lionheart is for older content like Omen bosses when I low man and have a full set of brd buffs and geo bubbles. Its super fun hitting Gin for 60k resolutions and 99k Radiance but I almost never switch out of Epeo, except for GA stuff.
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By RiggityWrekd 2023-01-24 02:33:22
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What's your opinion on the last updated tanking set by spicyryan on BG?

I'm talking about the one with 5/5 empy, warder's charm and shadow ring.

I guess that at that stage of the game buffs and debuffs are so strong that the only thing that would make a difference in the hardest content is the annull/absorb magic damage.

I'm interested to see what other people think about it.
 Odin.Creaucent
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By Odin.Creaucent 2023-01-24 08:58:17
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RiggityWrekd said: »
What's your opinion on the last updated tanking set by spicyryan on BG?

I'm talking about the one with 5/5 empy, warder's charm and shadow ring.

I guess that at that stage of the game buffs and debuffs are so strong that the only thing that would make a difference in the hardest content is the annull/absorb magic damage.

I'm interested to see what other people think about it.

Id rather use Nyame Gauntlets instead of the empy+3 its 1% damage absorb for 32 extra MEVA.
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By Taint 2023-01-24 09:23:51
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RUN meva is so high you are probably capping on most
Everything which is why absorb is your only option to decrease damage.

I use Emp body, legs, feet. Nyame head and hands currently in my magic absorb set but I’ll Try Emp 5/5 next Sortie run. My assumption is it won’t make a difference worth noting.
 Asura.Pergatory
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By Asura.Pergatory 2023-01-24 11:58:16
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I used a similar set heavy on absorb/annul/MDB for Aminon, but outside that, the defense offered by Nyame tends to be more beneficial than the absorb/annul/MDB.

RUN is notoriously defense-starved, and like Taint said, we have boatloads of magic evasion already. I'm currently using Nyame head/gloves, AF body (for refresh), and Empy legs/feet in my main set. I find it to be a pretty good balance. If I'm doing a fight where I take actual damage, I sometimes swap body to Empy as well.

Most recently we've been doing Ongo v25 and I'm actually finding myself swapping Empy back to Nyame for more defense because his magic attacks all hit me for like 3 damage while his physical can hit for hundreds. I also swapped Yamarang to Brigantia and +2 neck to Loricate for that fight.

I think ultimately it depends on what you're fighting, but I can't imagine ever going full 5/5 Empy except on Aminon or similar.
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 Asura.Geriond
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By Asura.Geriond 2023-01-24 17:33:33
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If you get multiple minnes (or even SV minnes), then the ~100 or so defense that Nyame has over the Empy +3 makes a much smaller difference. If I'm getting minnes I'll often use 5/5 Empy.
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By RiggityWrekd 2023-01-25 00:17:58
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well spicyryan quoted my question in his guide saying it's not about absorb. I wish he could be less cryptic and give us his insight but I'm not sure if he writes in this forum.

While we all agree that empy body, legs and feet have a role in several tanking sets, we can't say the same for the hands and head.

The empy hands have some extra DT compared to nyame but you are losing too much of the other stats: 18 def, 32 hp, 25 meva. Also resist status is not so great since it's nerfed vs NMs.

The empy head has 20 more hp than nyame and 21 less def, but it doesn't have DT which means you need to wear some other DT accessory to cap.

The only reason I can think of to use empy head and hands in a tanking set instead of Nyame is the extra MDB. 4 from head and 3 from hands seems quite relevant, considering that your total MDB is 45 with 5/5 empy and 38 with 3/5 empy and 2/5 nyame.
 Asura.Sechs
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By Asura.Sechs 2023-01-25 00:52:29
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Asura.Geriond said: »
If you get multiple minnes (or even SV minnes), then the ~100 or so defense that Nyame has over the Empy +3 makes a much smaller difference.
Wouldn't that make a larger difference if you're getting a buff that multiplies base defense?
Like Gallant's or Cocoon?
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 Bahamut.Justthetip
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By Bahamut.Justthetip 2023-01-25 05:31:26
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Asura.Sechs said: »
Asura.Geriond said: »
If you get multiple minnes (or even SV minnes), then the ~100 or so defense that Nyame has over the Empy +3 makes a much smaller difference.
Wouldn't that make a larger difference if you're getting a buff that multiplies base defense?
Like Gallant's or Cocoon?
That's my thinking which is why I'm confused on why 5/5 emp in tank set but the aoe set he doesn't. The aoe tank set is what I use for most part give or take a piece. Also I'd change evasion tanking boots from nyame to emp feet +3 for extra little evasion but I'm sure it wouldn't make a difference.
 Sylph.Brahmsz
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By Sylph.Brahmsz 2023-01-25 07:33:37
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RiggityWrekd said: »
well spicyryan quoted my question in his guide saying it's not about absorb. I wish he could be less cryptic and give us his insight but I'm not sure if he writes in this forum.

He's been banned from posting for literally years...
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By RiggityWrekd 2023-01-25 09:13:05
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Sylph.Brahmsz said: »
RiggityWrekd said: »
well spicyryan quoted my question in his guide saying it's not about absorb. I wish he could be less cryptic and give us his insight but I'm not sure if he writes in this forum.

He's been banned from posting for literally years...

Oh well I came back to the game less than a year ago and last time I played was during abyssea so I only know him for the BG wiki run guide
 Asura.Geriond
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By Asura.Geriond 2023-01-25 15:36:48
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Asura.Sechs said: »
Asura.Geriond said: »
If you get multiple minnes (or even SV minnes), then the ~100 or so defense that Nyame has over the Empy +3 makes a much smaller difference.
Wouldn't that make a larger difference if you're getting a buff that multiplies base defense?
Like Gallant's or Cocoon?
No, percentage-based increases keep the relative difference exactly the same, and it's the relative difference the determines how much damage reduction changes in defense give you.

Base: (using example numbers):
5/5 Nyame: 1500 defense
5/5 Empy +3: 1400 defense
1500/1400 = Nyame has 7.14% more defense

Add Cocoon:
5/5 Nyame: 2250 defense
505 Empy +3: 2100 defense
2250/2100 = Nyame has 7.14% more defense.

Compare that to adding 800 defense from Minnes:
5/5 Nyame: 2300 defense
5/5 Empy +3: 2200 defense
2100/2000 = Nyame has 4.54% more defense
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 Ragnarok.Martel
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By Ragnarok.Martel 2023-01-26 16:27:28
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So... Turns out that additional targets hit by AoE enmity actions each have to already be on the mobs hatelist for you to get credit, enmity wise.

Posted testing over in the PLD thread.
https://www.ffxiah.com/forum/topic/46016/first-and-final-line-of-defense-v20/129/#3655184
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 Asura.Sechs
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By Asura.Sechs 2023-01-26 17:14:36
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I hope those people using One For All / Valiance at start when nobody but you has enmity on the target will learn the lesson!

I honestly didn't know that and have been using the mentioned actions (or Warcry) on purpose at pulls. Meeeh...
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 Asura.Pergatory
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By Asura.Pergatory 2023-01-26 18:04:14
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Yup this follows from the same logic that, for example, casting on someone outside hate range will not generate enmity even if you yourself are inside hate range when you cast. It's the target that determines whether enmity is generated, not the caster.

Hate range is 30 yalms plus enemy radius, generally no more than about 32 yalms.
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By Ragnarok.Martel 2023-01-27 01:11:51
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Asura.Pergatory said: »
Yup this follows from the same logic that, for example, casting on someone outside hate range will not generate enmity even if you yourself are inside hate range when you cast. It's the target that determines whether enmity is generated, not the caster.

Hate range is 30 yalms plus enemy radius, generally no more than about 32 yalms.
Enmity range, per Kaeko's testing ages ago, is 25' from the mob. But it's been a long time so I went to retest.

Went out to ye' olde Ceizak, and grabbed a bee.

Agro'd it on PLD to prevent the 200 CE pull bonus. WHM alt cast slow(1 CE.) PLD cast shell on the WHM(0CE.) Mob turns to the PLD for a second then returns to the WHM. So, we're both on the hatelist.

PLD moved 25.61 away from the mob. Used Palisade. No change. the mob did not move. Moved in a step to 24.77. Used sentinel. Mob came to the PLD.

Enmity range is 25 yalms. Though I can't speak for how or if this might be affected by mob model size.
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 Asura.Pergatory
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By Asura.Pergatory 2023-01-27 12:19:57
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Interesting, I was pretty sure of the 30' thing. Maybe mob sizes vary more than I thought... or maybe I was just wrong and/or my tendency to be overly cautious made me build in some buffer to be safe and my brain forgot I did that.

I might do some more testing tonight, but that's really good to know. Thanks for verifying it!
 Ragnarok.Martel
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By Ragnarok.Martel 2023-01-27 13:23:11
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Asura.Pergatory said: »
Interesting, I was pretty sure of the 30' thing. Maybe mob sizes vary more than I thought... or maybe I was just wrong and/or my tendency to be overly cautious made me build in some buffer to be safe and my brain forgot I did that.

I might do some more testing tonight, but that's really good to know. Thanks for verifying it!
I've only ever tested this on small model mobs. So it is entirely possibly, that much like casting range, enmity range could be extended by a large mob model. Something to test at some point.
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By Asura.Sechs 2023-01-28 09:33:18
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Anybody mind sharing their cure potency midcast set for when /WHM?
Assuming someone still uses it.
One could argue at ML45+ it no longer has a point with Magic Fruit from /BLU, but I find /WHM can still be a funny alternative for messing around.


Edit:
Obviously I mean without Sroda Belt. I'm still questioning wether it's worth or not to go for Sroda Belt. Sure it allows you to cap Cpot fast, but then you have +25% cost and you can't use Gishdubar.
Still, to cap DT and Cpot without Sroda you have to accept a lot of compromises which I'm not sure are worth it anymore
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 Ragnarok.Martel
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By Ragnarok.Martel 2023-01-28 10:12:52
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Huh? what? We get subjobs? Oh sorry, I've been trapped in Gaol hell and feel like I never have a subjob anymore. /tableflip.

Sorry for the not helpful reply. My cure set for RUN is ancient and may or may not have ever actually been used. <,<;
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By Phoenix.Xax 2023-01-28 13:15:31
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well one thing to know is that the +25% cure cost does not affect blue magic. so you get the bonus to potency with magic fruit but not the cost extra
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By Ramuh.Austar 2023-01-28 14:29:46
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Asura.Sechs said: »
Anybody mind sharing their cure potency midcast set for when /WHM?
Assuming someone still uses it.
One could argue at ML45+ it no longer has a point with Magic Fruit from /BLU, but I find /WHM can still be a funny alternative for messing around.


Edit:
Obviously I mean without Sroda Belt. I'm still questioning wether it's worth or not to go for Sroda Belt. Sure it allows you to cap Cpot fast, but then you have +25% cost and you can't use Gishdubar.
Still, to cap DT and Cpot without Sroda you have to accept a lot of compromises which I'm not sure are worth it anymore
I can run it through an optimizer if you know what stats you want or need.
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By Taint 2023-01-28 14:50:13
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Sacro Neck, Sroda Belt, Mendi Earring caps Cure Pot. Leaving the rest for DT/HP slots.

The 25% cost is a lot but if you are curing yourself there should be some sort of outside MP support. Magic Fruit sounds ideal since no penalty and access to other /BLU spells.
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By Cerberus.Shadowmeld 2023-01-28 18:18:13
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I don’t really see any point for /whm for single target cures. /sch gives 10% white magic cost reduction plus storm. Curaga is different.
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By quelthos 2023-01-28 18:27:06
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/blu once ML is reached is best, but most of us don't have that ML and don't feel like getting it... you know what i mean

i use sroda belt for /whm cure I don't notice the mp issue personally, if you have to spam cure4 on yourself, the fight is going south anyway. its meant for solo speed pulling and to help your healer out, not main healing yourself. The added benefits of erase, haste and banishga + foil combo is what i really like about /whm
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