Producer Matsui Reveals Changes To SP Abilities

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Producer Matsui reveals changes to SP Abilities
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 Valefor.Esdain
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By Valefor.Esdain 2012-09-05 20:26:15
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No. BST eat the pet for a chance at protect V, shell V, CHR+5, EVA+5, or recast delay +5%. We're still thinking about the CHR+5 'cause it may or may not be overpowered.
 Quetzalcoatl.Kenrusai
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By Quetzalcoatl.Kenrusai 2012-09-05 20:28:37
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idk man, I'm thinking that EVA boost is mad op, ***that all looks pretty substantial
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 Leviathan.Comeatmebro
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By Leviathan.Comeatmebro 2012-09-05 20:32:55
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WHM's new 2h protects from statuses. Sacrosanctity helps with magic damage. Most DD can actually fulltime a decent amount of PDT or MDT without horribly breaking their tp sets under zerg buffs. You can bet PD will still do some form of damage mitigation, because, well, it's PD.

Embrava is up in the air, but my take is that it'll most likely have the haste reduced or removed so that you can't cap haste with only a scholar. Adloquium is scholar exclusive, and they also get the highest tier of regen, so there's a decent chance they'll leave those alone.

If haste was removed completely from embrava and PD was changed to a static 50% DT without status blocks, it still wouldn't make any current event impossible(or even drastically different really). Use WHM's new 2h for statuses, bring an additional brd or upgrade your 90 daurdaublas to 99, and make sure the mages are awake.

I think that's a worst case scenario though, it's probably going to be a much smaller scale nerf than that. Would suck if embrava lost regain, but we'll live.
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 Leviathan.Comeatmebro
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By Leviathan.Comeatmebro 2012-09-05 20:36:52
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BG wiki says it's 75% in a seperate step, which'd mean it's not MDB, MDT, or small. Misinformation due to overuse of PD, my bad.
 Phoenix.Dramatica
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By Phoenix.Dramatica 2012-09-05 20:43:09
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It's a large bonus, but only for one hit of damage.
 Leviathan.Comeatmebro
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By Leviathan.Comeatmebro 2012-09-05 20:49:34
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Still shouldn't make anything impossible or require a nerf for any current content, that I can see.

PD becoming entirely worthless without a replacement would certainly cause problems in legion, but it's unlikely it'd be that severe. You still have a TON of options for mitigation, and if the new WHM 2h is equivalent to PD in status prevention then it's irrelevant if that's removed or not. I really can't see PD being reduced below 50% mitigation, personally, and even that feels like a huge stretch.

The few people who still haven't capped nyzul gear would probably be upset at an embrava nerf, but it'd depend what gets nerfed. A general weakening wouldn't really change much. Complete removal of the haste would just mean you bring BRD SCH instead of SCH SCH and demand capped fast cast on BRD then embrava last 15 min. Removal of regen would be mildly inconvenient, removal of regain would be irritating.
 Midgardsormr.Sahagin
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By Midgardsormr.Sahagin 2012-09-05 20:52:00
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So I could Use both PUP SP for Mighty Strikes and 'Hundred fists'?
Hoping I read and understood the notes correctly
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By Jetackuu 2012-09-05 20:58:49
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may have missed it, but I didn't see where they were saying they were going to nerf anything, is it just implied conjecture or was it actually said?
 Leviathan.Comeatmebro
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By Leviathan.Comeatmebro 2012-09-05 21:03:52
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OP said:
As a general direction we will be raising all of the abilities so that they become useful. However, we believe that we will have no choice but add the lowering of effects of Perfect Defense and Embrava to our scope of adjustments.
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By Jetackuu 2012-09-05 21:08:10
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ah, ok carry on then.

(I didn't like that SMN was pushed to a single use thing anyway, it seems that they're trying to pull it out, with the time reduction, the only thing they need to do now is cut back the MP cost of blood pacts).


IMO of course.
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By Enuyasha 2012-09-05 21:10:17
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Midgardsormr.Sahagin said: »
So I could Use both PUP SP for Mighty Strikes and 'Hundred fists'?
Hoping I read and understood the notes correctly
meaning: you can use Overdrive and the new ability together. PUP just got broken :<
 Bahamut.Bojack
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By Bahamut.Bojack 2012-09-05 21:29:10
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Watch them make it unstackable with Perpetuance, or even with Accession.
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By Aikawa 2012-09-05 21:38:06
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Bahamut.Bojack said: »
Watch them make it unstackable with Perpetuance, or even with Accession.

that would makes no sense since all SCH only spells are "Compatible" w/ the sch abilities.
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By Bahamut.Bojack 2012-09-05 21:54:01
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Aikawa said: »
Bahamut.Bojack said: »
Watch them make it unstackable with Perpetuance, or even with Accession.

that would makes no sense since all SCH only spells are "Compatible" w/ the sch abilities.

When has SE ever made any sense? Just trying to think of ways they would nerf it without changing the effects of the spell itself.
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By Remora.Kyron 2012-09-06 02:44:26
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Siren.Kalilla said: »
I thought about this for a few minutes and decided it would be best to make a new topic for this one post so more players might get a chance to see the news. I will be making a copy of this post in the original topic, and future updates will be posted there, but this is just to share the changes Producer Akihiko Matsui announced on the official forums.

09-05-2012 01:07 PM
[source]
Akihiko Matsui
Dev Team

Hello this is Matsui.
Sorry to keep you waiting, but I have some follow up information in regards to SP abilities.

Today we once again looked into what would be the best way to implement the new SP abilities moving forward. I’d like to give a brief summary of the development plans based on the results of our discussion.

The below are the 4 main aspects of change for the 2-hour abilities.

  1. New SP ability and existing SP ability recast timer separation

    As we previously explained, the new SP abilities we designed based on the idea that the recast timer would be shared with the existing SP abilities and players would use them accordingly. While the effects and usages have been compared to the existing SP abilities and consideration has been given so that they are balanced, we will be completely separating the two and changing the concept so that each ability can be used separately.

    We will be making them so they are complete abilities on their own and do not need to be constrained to using one or the other.

  2. Recast time reduction

    Originally the idea for SP abilities was to have players use them one time for specific content or battle situations and to use it wisely. When considering the current battle tempo and the average time for content these days, we feel that it would be beneficial to make the recast 1 hour with the ability to reduce it a minimum of 30 minutes via merit points. With this, the idea of “2-hour abilities” will changed when we explore the effects.

  3. New SP ability effects revamp

    Based on the changes stated above, we will be looking into the effects for the new SP abilities once again.

    This does not mean only time related adjustments will be made. If deemed necessary we will be completely revamping the effect from the ground up.

  4. Existing SP ability effects revamp

    We will be looking into revamping existing SP ability effects based on the two points below.

    • Adjustments to effects to coincide with recast shortening
    • Balance adjustments to coincide with the new SP ability effects revamp

    Even with the existing SP abilities there is a division between those that have good uses and those that do not depending on the job. Ultimately our aim is to make it so that by putting together the effects of the two SP abilities every job can have a boon. With that said, we will be revamping the existing SP abilities so that balance is not thrown off when incorporating usage of the new SP abilities.

    As a general direction we will be raising all of the abilities so that they become useful. However, we believe that we will have no choice but add the lowering of effects of Perfect Defense and Embrava to our scope of adjustments.

[/b]
With all of these changes, the previously planned implementation date for the new SP abilities as shown on the roadmap will be significantly pushed back. I apologize deeply for making you all wait, but we took a lot of time to decide the above so that we could deliver something that everyone enjoys and matches the current game.

We are currently working on preparing a revised roadmap to be released. We expect this to take a little bit of time, but please hang in there.
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THIS IS BS!!!

As someone who played sch since it came out. SE has screwed us over time and time again. Upon release we had a 70 cap and t3 spells. No helix's

Then 75 comes we get T4 and helixes, and our AF spell khliflare. And very bad club staff skill like puppetmer.

The SE raises pups H2H, gives our helix spells and JA spell to EVERY job. They didn't even add a t2 of these spells or a new spell or JA to enhance these spells that other jobs couldn't use

RDM/ BLM has t2's on spell list.

80+ they give rdm t4 native but don't let ours be.


They don't give us flash nova or cataclysm weapon skills. We don't get hexa strke.80+ we get two of the most laughable spells, enmity gain and decrease spells.


I worked hard for my +2 and +3 armor sets. I shouldn't have to let them to be nerfed because SE can't get eneity for plds, nins and now rune fencers.

How about they lower rdm composure to 45 level, or let all ancient magic be learned from 30-45, so everyone has it as a sub. Or give us banish and dia spell lines natively

Stop messing with this Job. At the moment I so hate tis new director. Honestly I don't care about embrava much and I use it often, but all sch's get is nerf and shared everything to other jobs.

new stratagisms or new spell line yes please
 Shiva.Viciousss
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By Shiva.Viciousss 2012-09-06 02:46:53
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lol, blind fanboyism must be nice.
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 Asura.Myrrh
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By Asura.Myrrh 2012-09-06 03:25:43
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I admit it. I had a hard time reading that.
 Odin.Eikechi
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By Odin.Eikechi 2012-09-06 04:05:34
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Asura.Jadecc said: »
Odin.Eikechi said: »
As much as my sch weeps for the Embrava nerf it's necessary. But my sam is joygasming at 30m Meikyo Shisui's. *insert Bison YES YES YES!*
thinking they are going to lower the recast to 30 min and NOT nerf Meikyo Shisui is laughable

How so? We already have Sekkanoki which is basically a 5 min, 1 hit 2hour. What are they gonna do, put Meikyo Shisui on a 30m timer and make it 2/3 of that it is now? I'm not sure I'm seeing where you're going with that statement. They said you can merit it down to 30m or w/e, so it will still be a 1h move.
 Odin.Creaucent
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By Odin.Creaucent 2012-09-06 04:52:12
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ITT: schs needing 700+ enhancing skill builds for embrava to stay the same as what it is now.

I actually like sch too its fun embravaing generals in beseiged and watching them go crazy. By the sound of it these adjustments are a long way off since they are starting from scratch with the new 2hrs and redoing old ones.
 Odin.Tsuneo
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By Odin.Tsuneo 2012-09-06 05:26:26
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Matsui posted again today. This is only the google translate version of his post, so it may be hard to comprehend.

Quote:
Matsui is. Thank you for the many reflections immediately. Concerns due to the reduction of (aura) Renkan total / absolute defense, some of the content that I can no longer capture not believe in mind in this adjustment Upon development team. Therefore, not only the adjustment of the ability, but also about the content, it is scheduled to take needed action in consideration of the impact. I think that in any of the content of future content / existing monster special for that we are Umidasa purposes made ​​it Anwhei / aura absolute defense, only to counter them is not a favorable condition never . Go to correction so that it does not do so, is the first of intent / adjust this aura is an absolute defense. There is also the assumption also scholars and Summoner, as a result, as a wider range of play with other elements of that we want to be and let people active / know is there any surface that inconvenience but you, I think you'll understand me. Next, I supplement with respect to separation of the recast. It becomes possible by the separation of the recast, combination of the SP abilities of the two, since it is the scheme for the effect of the assumption can not be used at the same time the original, remains the current comes out some balance is poor. In carrying out a review of the effect, this point will be readjusted. Also, it's not enough counter recast in the present circumstances, I have not changed even now. In order to solve this problem, the frame work of the expansion has been ongoing, and reuse of the SP separation ability, this solution is required. This also has been one of the factors that introduce delay. In addition, this extension is completed, ability of other well SP abilities, has been tied to the upper limit of the frame so far (pillage / stolen, and Seoul Jump / Spirit Jump) also, the outlook that I would be attained to improve is.

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/22813-dev1058-%E3%83%A1%E3%83%AA%E3%83%83%E3%83%88%E3%83%9D%E3%82%A4%E3%83%B3%E3%83%88%E6%96%B0%EF%BC%92%E3%82%A2%E3%83%93%E3%81%AB%E3%81%A4%E3%81%84%E3%81%A6?p=359259#post359259
 Ragnarok.Corres
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By Ragnarok.Corres 2012-09-06 05:28:06
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soooo it gets nerfed? if you have no definite answer what exactly gets nerfed just wait for it.
You think SE is going to think:
"well, they made a clear statement that Neo-Nyzul-Isle is practically unbeatable without embrava, etc"
"let's just nerf everything else then."

if they nerf is so bad that noone can even go higher than floor 50 on Neo-Nyzul-Isle then you can cry about it.
 Leviathan.Comeatmebro
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By Leviathan.Comeatmebro 2012-09-06 05:41:38
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NNI is winnable without Embrava. I'd estimate you could expect over 1/3 winrate for a good group without it. It just makes everything that much easier.

Sorry, 1/3 win rate is still likely higher than SE expected given how great most of the gear is. They don't need to nerf anything because of an embrava adjustment. If you're that scared, go get 15/15 before patch hits.
 Odin.Tsuneo
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By Odin.Tsuneo 2012-09-06 05:43:42
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Leviathan.Comeatmebro said: »
NNI is winnable without Embrava. I'd estimate you could expect over 1/3 winrate for a good group without it. It just makes everything that much easier.

Sorry, 1/3 win rate is still likely higher than SE expected given how great most of the gear is. They don't need to nerf anything because of an embrava adjustment. If you're that scared, go get 15/15 before patch hits.

1/3 win rate without Embrava? Are you claiming to do this without clipper?
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By Leviathan.Comeatmebro 2012-09-06 06:04:58
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All you lose is regain if you replace your rune SCH with a gjallarbrd with decent fast cast, and about 1/3 of our runs end with over 5 min remaining. Regain doesn't account for anything near that, unless you have a run that's extremely heavy on kill-all. No clipper, just attention span.

Players love to whine about everything they can't do though..
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By Fairy.Mythrender 2012-09-06 06:09:36
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Incidentally, Matsui has directly responded here (in Japanese) that content will also be retuned in conjunction with the Embrava and PD nerf, to ensure that it doesn't become impossible.

EDIT: Ooops, beaten to it by a post I hadn't seen.
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By Odin.Tsuneo 2012-09-06 06:15:54
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Leviathan.Comeatmebro said: »
All you lose is regain if you replace your rune SCH with a gjallarbrd with decent fast cast, and about 1/3 of our runs end with over 5 min remaining. Regain doesn't account for anything near that, unless you have a run that's extremely heavy on kill-all. No clipper, just attention span.

Players love to whine about everything they can't do though..
Are you implying that I can't beat Nyzul?
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By Leviathan.Comeatmebro 2012-09-06 06:51:03
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Odin.Tsuneo said: »
Are you implying that I can't beat Nyzul?

No, I'm implying people say everything is harder than it actually is in general.
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 Bismarck.Punchus
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By Bismarck.Punchus 2012-09-06 07:18:17
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Leviathan.Comeatmebro said: »
Still shouldn't make anything impossible or require a nerf for any current content, that I can see.

PD becoming entirely worthless without a replacement would certainly cause problems in legion, but it's unlikely it'd be that severe. You still have a TON of options for mitigation, and if the new WHM 2h is equivalent to PD in status prevention then it's irrelevant if that's removed or not. I really can't see PD being reduced below 50% mitigation, personally, and even that feels like a huge stretch.

The few people who still haven't capped nyzul gear would probably be upset at an embrava nerf, but it'd depend what gets nerfed. A general weakening wouldn't really change much. Complete removal of the haste would just mean you bring BRD SCH instead of SCH SCH and demand capped fast cast on BRD then embrava last 15 min. Removal of regen would be mildly inconvenient, removal of regain would be irritating.

As I'm sure someone has pointed out in previous posts but there is Nothing Perfect about anything less than 100%.
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By Ragnarok.Sekundes 2012-09-06 07:26:32
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Bismarck.Punchus said: »

As I'm sure someone has pointed out in previous posts but there is Nothing Perfect about anything less than 100%.
There's nothing perfect about how it is now, it slowly deteriorates. All they really need to do is accelerate that deterioration to weaken it.
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