Another Pro Choice Vs Pro Life Thread

I think your argument misses a more profound point.

Sorry, I didn't think saying "99%" in a video game forum required footnotes and sources of reference to free one's self of accusations from haughty know-nothings of "pulling numbers out of one's ***".

And there is PLENTY of evidence for a soul. Rock-solid proof that meet's your pedestrian criteria? Probably not. But then you don't matter anyway. Bold proclamations from the person to whom I responded apparently flew by your radar undetected, so what faith would I have in your intellectual requirements for deeper meaning? It'd be like granting a PhD to a kindergartener who failed finger-painting.

Judging from the BS the pro-abortioners here are putting up it would be casting pearls before swine.

Judging from the BS the pro-abortioners here are putting up it would be casting pearls before swine.

no but it makes you look like a fool. no there is no evidence for a soul, none.

I mean, if you just wanted to just be offensive and arrogant you got that point across pretty nicely.

If it came across as offensive, I make no apologies. I get offended by watching pseudo-intellectual geeks use elementary debating techniques and make vast proclamations about the existence of the soul or the beginnings of life from their grandma's basement. *** for tat. Some of you just simply aren't as smart as you think you are, and certainly not smart enough to realize how dumb you sound. Call me arrogant, I give your opinion on such matters the same as I would if I asked your advice on neurosurgery. If my disdain for stupidity disguised as a discussion in intellectual and spiritual matters comes across as arrogance to you, then so be it. I'm not the one making such bold claims, but rather that in the absence of anyone being able to make such a claim, that we should not go around killing fetuses, or finding weak excuses to justify it, such as "well gee I would feel bad about having a baby at 17 because there's so much I couldn't give him that I had" and blowing past the adoption options. Give me a break.

You are correct in a sense that there doesn't need to be evidence to prove anything. How can one prove their love for someone? I do get you there BUT I do feel that something so monumental as a soul should have more of a background then "it's there because [person/church/corporation X] told you it was there."

I'm really not sure how anyone can make the argument for a girl raped by a family member (let's say her father) to be force to carry to term and give birth to that child.

What is to separate us from another mass with equal protons, neutrons, and electrons? The arrangement of such sub-atomic particles?

If it came across as offensive, I make no apologies. I get offended by watching pseudo-intellectual geeks use elementary debating techniques and make vast proclamations about the existence of the soul or the beginnings of life from their grandma's basement. *** for tat. Some of you just simply aren't as smart as you think you are, and certainly not smart enough to realize how dumb you sound. Call me arrogant, I give your opinion on such matters the same as I would if I asked your advice on neurosurgery. If my disdain for stupidity disguised as a discussion in intellectual and spiritual matters comes across as arrogance to you, then so be it. I'm not the one making such bold claims, but rather that in the absence of anyone being able to make such a claim, that we should not go around killing fetuses, or finding weak excuses to justify it, such as "well gee I would feel bad about having a baby at 17 because there's so much I couldn't give him that I had" and blowing past the adoption options. Give me a break.

I'm absolutely for adoption, but they need to allow more leeway. I have no idea why the process is so hard in the US. My German aunt and uncle adopted their daughters from the Czech Republic over a decade ago. It took them months to make the adoption final (of course they have to take the time to do a thorough evaluation of the family adopting), but I think that the adoption laws in the US are more stringent than in Europe for some reason.

If I remember correctly, they had a disappointing five years before the adoption of my cousins. (Moms bailing out in the last minute and what not, which can be understandable.) It was an emotional roller coaster for my aunt and uncle in those five years.

What's really bad now is my cousin who was two at the time of the adoption has some really bizarre psychological problems. (I think they let my cousins know too early that they were adopted.) My cousin and uncle do not speak to each other in any capacity. They completely indulged both of them, I guess to compensate for all the years that both wanted children so badly, but the older one has just turned out rotten! It makes me so sad that my aunt has to go through the stress of having such an ingrate in her home. Her younger sister is well mannered and very loving.

I think she saw some really terrible behaviors from her birth mother that she may or may not remember to this day. When I was about twelve or thirteen we went over for our annual visit after the adoption. I saw her get on top of a stuffed bear and mimic sex. There's no way that she had any concept of what she was doing, but even at that age, it disturbed me that she must have seen it.

The last time I went to Germany in 2007, I was home alone with both my cousins. I heard them get into a small skirmish. When I went in to intervene, the older one had the younger one cornered. She didn't see me as I entered the kitchen behind her. I watched her completely wail on her younger sister before I jumped in, pulled her hand back, and gave her the verbal finger wag of a lifetime. My brother went to visit with his son more recently. He also caught our older cousin beating the younger one closed-fisted. Yeah...Both my brother and I "got into it" in our childhood, but never as malicious as that, and never in our teens! I'm really afraid that the older one has serious rage issues.

The older one consistently has terrible performance in school, constantly lies, etc. It's just bad. I jumped on Skype with my German family on Christmas Eve. It took every ounce of restraint not to ream that girl for her horrible behavior. It wouldn't do any good anyway. My brother and I have both tried to speak to her. All of my cousins and second cousins who are all in their twenties or early thirties have tried. We've got nothing!

What scares me now is that she has her first BF. She's going to get pregnant. I know it.

Sorry to dump family drama, but yeah...Her sister is the sweetest thing on the planet. Adoption can be a double-edged sword. "A Tale of Two Siblings"?

Just wondering, but do any other states impose this law where the mother must have an ultrasound and/or a sonogram before going through with an abortion, or is it just Texas? This is a relatively new law here. Not sure if it was passed or was just hear-say or whatever.

Also, I do legitimately feel bad for a couple of guy friends whose GFs had their pregnancies nixed. One of which, had an abortion three times with HIM! Who knows how many she had with others, if she did? They both had their degrees, were settled into their careers, he bought his house, and they had the finances. Geez! He could have taken care of a child on his own!

It disgusted me, because that very night she joined us at the bar. She had those vics and booze, and acted as though nothing had happened. The guy, on the other hand, was distraught. She basically used abortions as birth control all three times. I can understand one "oops", but three?!?

I've only run into one other girl in college who did the same. I think I've already dumped that story in another thread. A couple of friends and I walked in on her having a train run on her, so she was that type of girl.

The argument would be that despite the evil that has happened to that girl, the child is innocent. Since life starts at conception, you can't murder the child for the sins of the father.

That's simply a basic tenet of chemistry. Molecules arranged in different ways exhibit different properties.

Genetically speaking though that child is screwed. It won't be normal. There's a good chance it will die young. That child reproducing is also bad for the gene pool.

However since we are talking religiously, well the bible has lots of incest in it, so I can see why it's justified. god says it's fine.

Properties that don't include "living".

Properties that don't include "living".

I don't think people believe in a soul simply out of being told so. There is no shortage whatsoever of anecdotal stories of something about us separate from our physical beings. Also, most, if not all cultures have historically believed in a soul/spirit. The way I see it, I am not the same entity as something with my identical chemical makeup. What is to separate us from another mass with equal protons, neutrons, and electrons? The arrangement of such sub-atomic particles?

I don't think people believe in a soul simply out of being told so. There is no shortage whatsoever of anecdotal stories of something about us separate from our physical beings. Also, most, if not all cultures have historically believed in a soul/spirit. The way I see it, I am not the same entity as something with my identical chemical makeup. What is to separate us from another mass with equal protons, neutrons, and electrons? The arrangement of such sub-atomic particles?

If it came across as offensive, I make no apologies. I get offended by watching pseudo-intellectual geeks use elementary debating techniques and make vast proclamations about the existence of the soul or the beginnings of life from their grandma's basement. *** for tat. Some of you just simply aren't as smart as you think you are, and certainly not smart enough to realize how dumb you sound. Call me arrogant, I give your opinion on such matters the same as I would if I asked your advice on neurosurgery. If my disdain for stupidity disguised as a discussion in intellectual and spiritual matters comes across as arrogance to you, then so be it. I'm not the one making such bold claims, but rather that in the absence of anyone being able to make such a claim, that we should not go around killing fetuses, or finding weak excuses to justify it, such as "well gee I would feel bad about having a baby at 17 because there's so much I couldn't give him that I had" and blowing past the adoption options. Give me a break.

I don't think people believe in a soul simply out of being told so. There is no shortage whatsoever of anecdotal stories of something about us separate from our physical beings. Also, most, if not all cultures have historically believed in a soul/spirit. The way I see it, I am not the same entity as something with my identical chemical makeup. What is to separate us from another mass with equal protons, neutrons, and electrons? The arrangement of such sub-atomic particles?