The Rokkenjima Murder Case - Umineko Spoilers

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The Rokkenjima murder case - Umineko spoilers
 Phoenix.Dabackpack
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By Phoenix.Dabackpack 2012-09-18 16:06:48
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Hey all! I've been meaning to post the Umineko pictures from Otakon on this thread, but the person in charge hasn't put them up yet :(

There were a lot of good costumes there! I think people liked my Kanon too :)
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By Phoenix.Dabackpack 2012-12-23 14:58:17
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I will perform my Endless Magic to revive this thread once more for good fanfiction!

Witches and Woodlands! This is a fantastic fangame based around Dungeons and Dragons, and it actually (surprisingly) fits in VERY WELL with Umineko. It's not too long, but it's very satisfying and hilarious.

Redacted! The guy who is making this uploaded ~1.5 hours of preview footage. It seems really interesting and is a pretty serious story. Really thought-provoking.
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By Ragnarok.Zohnax 2012-12-23 15:46:02
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Is this the same as Umineko no Naku Koro ni anime? o:
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By Phoenix.Sehachan 2012-12-23 16:22:08
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The anime is taken from the visual novel, but only covers half of it. The original VN goes further into the mystery and leads to more hints and possible conclusions. It's amazing.

Phoenix.Dabackpack said: »
Redacted! The guy who is making this uploaded ~1.5 hours of preview footage. It seems really interesting and is a pretty serious story. Really thought-provoking.
Man, just hearing the music again completely thrills me. Is this fanmade?
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By Phoenix.Dabackpack 2012-12-23 16:24:58
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Phoenix.Sehachan said: »
The anime is taken from the visual novel, but only covers half of it. The original VN goes further into the mystery and leads to more hints and possible conclusions. It's amazing.

Phoenix.Dabackpack said: »
Redacted! The guy who is making this uploaded ~1.5 hours of preview footage. It seems really interesting and is a pretty serious story. Really thought-provoking.
Man, just hearing the music again completely thrills me. Is this fanmade?

Yeah, it's fanmade, and I think the guy has been working on it for a few years now. He put this up on AnimeSuki not too long ago. I think he's eventually going to distribute it into an actual VN once he's all finished, which is exciting.
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By Ragnarok.Zohnax 2012-12-23 17:11:52
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My mind... @_@
Is the purple-haired witch really Rika from Higurashi btw? 0.o
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By Phoenix.Sehachan 2012-12-23 17:14:36
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Yes and no :p
They make some reference to it, but you can consider it a parallel universe, Bernkastel is definetely not Rika, not at personality level at least.
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By Ragnarok.Zohnax 2012-12-23 17:24:07
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Phoenix.Sehachan said: »
Yes and no :p
They make some reference to it, but you can consider it a parallel universe, Bernkastel is definetely not Rika, not at personality level at least.
I see. o: Interesting tie-in; was hoping the same people who did When Cicadas Cry did this too once I saw the title. Definitely going to keep watching/reading. :3
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By Phoenix.Dabackpack 2012-12-23 21:09:00
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Phoenix.Sehachan said: »
Yes and no :p
They make some reference to it, but you can consider it a parallel universe, Bernkastel is definetely not Rika, not at personality level at least.

I think the Higurashi manga (Minagoroshi-hen) describes "Frederika Bernkastel" as the collection of all the Rikas that failed in Higurashi ;____;

Umineko's Bernkastel is speculated to have the origins (and personality) as that character, but in Umineko she is a physical manifestation of the abstraction known as "miracle". That's basically the role Rika fulfills in Higurashi, so there's that connection too. Especially when compared against Takano/Lambdadelta.

On the other hand, Ryukishi (the author) asserts that there is absolutely no connection, but many of the fans think that's a load of crap :)
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By Phoenix.Dabackpack 2012-12-24 20:19:35
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Apparently Japan likes Gohda more than Sakutaro :(
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By Phoenix.Sehachan 2012-12-25 06:07:03
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I don't like Sakutaro either, more surprised of Ange third place and many other placement. Wtf at Lion at the bodyguard dude that high? And why Kumasawa nearly last!
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By Phoenix.Dabackpack 2012-12-25 10:06:25
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and Kumasawa's son, lol
I'm happy that Rosa's so high though: badass Momma Bear!
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By Phoenix.Dabackpack 2013-01-24 23:19:37
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Made this today to practice!





STORYTIME WITH THE SIESTA CORPS!

I put this on Tumblr, lol.
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By Sylph.Jrpg 2013-01-25 02:22:19
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oh hey, didn't know about this thread

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i'm just waiting for the umitweak chiru patch. i finished eps 1-4 in august and have been deprived of DESIRE since
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By Phoenix.Dabackpack 2013-01-25 14:01:09
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By Phoenix.Dabackpack 2013-01-31 15:32:40
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THIS IS SO ADOWABLE~ OMOCHIKAERIIII

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By Valefor.Sehachan 2013-07-25 12:01:47
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Using endless magic to revive the thread once again.

Lately I've been(by coincidence at first)watching Umineko clips and reading stuff around, which has led me to thought a lot about it in the past few days.

SPOILERS

-----------------------

While I still believe Kyrie's theory to be still plausible, I am starting to notice it has a lot of weak points. Most important thing: Beatrice is the representation of the Ushiromiya head, which she(and per extention Hideyoshi and Natsuhi, although she is regarded as a family member by Kinzo)cannot be.

This first thing narrows down the list of culprits to the following:
Krauss, Eva, Rudolph, Rosa, the kids and Shannon(if we believe her to be Yasu).

Yeah, you read it! Requiem of the Golden Witch might be full of bloody lies! I mean, sure Will actually reveals the truth, but he does it in a very clouded way and things surrounding his solutions might be deceptions. Basically everything that isn't directly stated as the solution from him might be false(the sentences he starts with "Illusions to illusions..."). There are some inconsistencies about the Shkanon theory and that episode, most notable: how can Lion even exist alongside Shannon? Although the 7th world is purely fictional, this still causes a discrepancy in the theory of Shkanon-Yasu-Beatrice.

Other points of interest to narrow down the list of possible culprits:
First game: it could be anyone imo, it's merely the introduction chapter and not much can be extracted from these murders other than the behaviour of the characters.

Second game: this one highly suggests that Rosa might be the culprit. I am starting to think Misao was right all along here, afterall he did say before everyone else that Rosa was the most likely culprit, and this chapter is pretty easy to read and does not only imply Rosa could be it, but it's actually said from Kanon "Don't go to Rosa, she is the culprit, she said she'll kill us all". HOLY ***DID YOU REALIZE IT WAS IN OUR FACE ALL ALONG?!?

Third game: this is complicated, so unless we wanna discuss it in detail I'll leave it alone for now.

Fourth game: in this game I think it's revealed that Beatrice must be one amongst Krauss, Eva, Rudolph, Rosa and Shannon(thus ruling out the kids, although they still may be accomplices). Because during the meeting where kids are not present and in each other's surveilance the new "Kinzo" presents himself to be acknowledged by the family. At least that is how I interpret it, Kinzo being the title of head of the family that everyone must accept(because as we know the real Kinzo is dead). This would work since there is a lot of magic since the beginning, which suggests that things aren't exactly as we see them.

Now...I think Maria is a key character. She is the only witness of the real Beatrice(she differentiate people through personalities and not appereances), which would highly point towards Rosa once again as Maria on multiple occasions states that she transforms into "an evil witch" when she is enraged. Doesn't this mean she could also become the good witch Beatrice to her eyes? We do certainly know that Rosa is *** up and has a great guilt for killing Beatrice II. We are also shown that Rosa is capable of solving the epitaph, which could have happen in the previous years, where Kinzo gave her the ring making her the rightful heir.

There is a lot that can be discusses, from the specific twilights(I have theories for most of them actually)to the reasons.

I actually believe to be two culprits: Rosa and George(once again Misao was incredibly ahead of all of us if this is correct), with possible multiple accomplices, certainly Nanjo as he's the one able to cover up fake deaths, and probably passive ones which are Kumasawa, Genji and Shannon(Kanon if its own person is shown to be aware of the plan but rebels against Beatrice, every time).

Discuss discuss!! I need someone to talk with about this!!!

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By Phoenix.Dabackpack 2013-09-22 01:58:57
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Hi Seha! Wow I totally missed your new post, sorry :( If you're still interested, I have some ideas.

Rosatrice, huh? That reminds me of some YouTube videos by a fellow named KnownNoMore. His series is 9 hours long (9 *** HOURS YO) but it describes how Rosa/George could have done it and why the official explanation is wrong. I haven't watched all of it though (only maybe a total of 30 minutes)

When I'm at my computer later today I can make a much more detailed post, if you're still interested
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By Valefor.Sehachan 2013-09-22 05:20:43
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Of course I'm interested! And I know of those videos actually, because after formulating the theory myself I went looking around the internet to seek confirmation/check if anyone had the same crazy idea as me and was glad to see someone did XD
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By Phoenix.Dabackpack 2013-09-22 15:15:16
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Ok! So to start, I actually think that all of the Forgeries are solvable using Rosatrice/George. I don't remember HOW, but I think we can figure it out :)

However, I personally don't agree with Rosatrice being "THE solution" to Umineko. To begin, here are some of my thoughts: (spoilers because long)

I'm sorry if my thoughts are disorganized, but that's what I think if we had to give a "true solution" to the stories.

That said, it's still fun to come up with alternate solutions so let's try! :)

EP1: Anybody could have done the First and Second Twilights. As for Kanon's death, I don't think there's actually a death proclamation for Kanon, lol. (I might be wrong though, it's been a while). So Kanon didn't die! And from there, if Kanon is an accomplice, the rest is easy. But isn't Rosa actually confirmed dead on the First Twilight? It seems weird that the culprit could have died without killing anybody, but EP1 could be an anomaly where, say, Kanon hijacked the games from Rosa.

EP2: Yeah, Rosa is very suspicious in this one. Like all around. Even in the Yasutrice theory, Rosa must be an accomplice, so a Rosatrice theory should be easy for this one.

EP3: Hooooooooo-wee, this one'll be tough. I'd have to review the Red Truths one more time, but we might be able to make it work. I don't remember all too well ;_; The First Twilight will definitely be hard...

EP4: I don't remember the specifics on this one either. I think Rosa died in the First Twilight? When is her death proclamation given? I'd have to check.

In all honesty, we might be able to pull a EP3-Nanjo death-type theory: Yes, the Red Truth guarantees that Rosa is dead, but WHEN was that Red Truth given? There's a chance that Rosa might not have actually died on the First Twilight! Take that! (blue lasers) Or George could have done it.

That wouldn't be very fun, but it could happen, lol. Anyway, I'll look at the Red Truth list again and try to familiarize myself with the specifics again. I do have a question, though: What's the motive for Rosa and George?
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By Valefor.Sehachan 2013-09-22 16:20:33
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Holy ***I wrote a huge paragraph and hit back by mistake it's all gone *blows up an island*
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By Valefor.Sehachan 2013-09-22 17:43:53
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Sigh..I'll go first in the how cause it's more fun, and also somewhat easier since reasons are also hard to confirm/deny at all.

this was re-rewrited after I accidentally wiped it so sorry if it wasn't clear enough <_<
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By Phoenix.Dabackpack 2013-10-04 23:17:49
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Happy Umineko weekend! Don't get sacrificed by the Witch~

Also Seha, sorry for being slow with posting, college is hard ; ;

You have good points though and I'd like to talk about them later!
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