Occupy Wall Street Protests

Job, company - is there really any difference? You could be a genius at the job yet most companies won't care if they don't see you've attended college. Put down on your resume that your education ended at HS and it's a death sentence to your chances of landing the position and at it's worst an invitation to be taken advantage of.

You could alternatively attempt to work your way up the ladder at an organization and I know people who have been paid through college by their jobs while holding a position but this is a gamble once again not something you should hope to happen because it's most likely not.

Your best bet still turns out to be college, regardless of what the opposition to OWS say. While I agree people should take a little more time to investigate alternatives to the most expensive private institutions, the idea that people should be mocked for wanting to better themselves is sickening.

exactly my sentiments.

For the most part I'd agree with you.
But on the other hand, there are many careers that don't require a degree.
They require people who know what the heck they are doing and can do it well.
Of course you can make a counter-point that many careers there's just so much that you can't, but there are many careers that you can as well. More than one way to skin a cat. Do what you feel is right, if you screw up at least it was your choice and you didn't just go to a school because you felt that it was what you had to do. That being said, I plan on taking a few writing classes for college in the future, something that is within my price range that won't develop into debt, and idgaf if I get a degree or not. What matters to me is what I can get with the knowledge. Paper doesn't amount to squat if it makes you "over-qualified"

It just bothers me that this argument always becomes so sided with one side exclaiming that "college is the way!"
I believe it's counter-intuitive to think so, you can generalize all you want and say "most" situations it is, but that doesn't really amount up to beans if someone has a scope of what they can do and it doesn't have to include college, not saying that it shouldn't but it's not always the only option.

I'm a chef by trade, and I don't necessarily "need" college, or a culinary school degree. Matter of fact, a co-worker of mine, just graduated from one of the most prestigious culinary schools in the country in Vegas, and said all it really was, was a waste of $50,000... Sure a culinary school degree wouldn't hurt me, but its not required, by any means.

I feel that this should go here.

Is this even useful?

I found it useful.

That was actually a really good read lol

I thought so too.

I thought being "well rounded" and involved in extra-curriculars was something that gives you a leg up in college applications. In this state we have the "top ten percent" rule, and you have to be competitive to get into UT, Rice, and Baylor. I forgot what UT's acceptance rate was when I was scouting. I know it's ranked like thirty or forty-something nationally.

Honestly, I thought NHS was pretty worthless lol

You highlight the uses of it, why it helped you get a 'foot into the door', but did you benefit from those experiences? Did the experience you gain from being in the NHS teach you leadership skills or some other stuff? Maybe, but I doubt it since I don't remember doing anything special for it other than a banquet or two. Hey, at least we got those cool shirt pins?

I'm not bitter about it, I just feel that the time I spent dicking around with computers with my friends far exceeded the experience value I ever gained at school. The school I went to didn't teach Latin, but I was interested in it enough to go out and find books on it during middle school. I know a lot more Latin than I know Spanish, the language I was taught for three years of high school, yet the Spanish classes "meant" something on my college resume.

I get it though, application assistants can't do comprehensive background checks on the students to see if they really know the crap they've been taught, so they just have to rely on accreditation and test score then hope for the best.

Neither of you did any type of community service? How is charity worthless? I mean, yeah...We had the nifty pins and the banquets (and don't forget the tassels for graduation), but you didn't do anything else? Visit retirement homes, carved pumpkins with disabled kids, volunteer at local animal shelters?

/tilts head

Not at my school. It was just a "hey, you're in this club now" kind of thing. I give mad props if your school actually encouraged you to do these things under the name of NHS though. Even more if your group actively organized these events.

That alone shows that my NHS and your NHS were not equal. So you should be upset that I can parade my NHS membership at the same worth of yours even though you actually accomplished something of value. See what I mean? The title means nothing.

Well, I'm perplexed. I assumed every school's NHS required community service. Hmmm...WTH? LOL!

***! I guess Nausi was right. Our generation is kind of molly coddled. I was just trying to make the point that we're just as competitive.

Funny how that works out huh?

My sister was apart of the NHS and graduated HS this year after doing community service at a soup kitchen, participating in a theater revival for teens and helping a young entrepreneur in launching an online fashion collection.

When I was in HS and NHS was about? There was an effort to help clean up the parks but nothing compared to what my sister's school had to offer. We had a park cleanup, a couple of fairs organized to increase awareness of various social pitfalls and some minor anti-drug displays.

..and my HS is ranked as better than hers.

On our generation being coddled? While on some aspects I'd have to agree completely the previous generations simply did not have to deal with the type of job markets and realities we're facing.

Well im wrong actually since many Boomers are feeling the effects of the new realities.I guess I should direct my statement towards those who simply want to blame the young for "whining".

Everyone is touting degrees, globalization means jobs are being shipped out, falling into an obsolete skillset happens in the blink of an eye thanks to rapidly growing technology, older folk are directly competing against younger folk since they aren't retiring, benefit programs are shrinking, everyone's working harder for flatlined wages and costs are increasing on all fronts even if you put your best fiscal conservative face on.

Hrm. I wrote a quick blog post about some of my opinions on the actual issue of the Occupy protests. I don't really feel confident in the post, though. Seems like most of my ideas are unfeasible, implausible, and unoriginal. It's here: http://snippetsbyme.wordpress.com/2011/11/11/occupy-protests/ if any other writers (*cough* Vinvv/Xeuye/Catnip) are incredibly bored and feel like giving me a critique. But considering it's just a blog, meh. I stole some of Jaerik's citation sources from earlier in the thread and Zahrah's idea about fixed tuition in it, so I thought I should let you guys know that I snitched. I'm a totally shameless thief. I swiped Novaria's lol picture comparing babies and zombies for my facebook, too. *shame* :-(

Don't feel bad Liela.. a lot of my funny pictures on my FB are stolen from the LOL thread lol

I went out to Occupy Sacramento today, I'm not so much politically righteous
but I agree with the general principals.

Anyone who has followed this movement is familiar with what is happening in Oakland.
There was a Town Hall meeting in Sac last night to curb a spread of police action in a peaceful protest.

I think what struck me most is that the ground zero is Ceasar Chavez Park,
where the homeless get their free soup on Sundays.

Its hard not to support when veterans who've been all but forgotten
are there out of necessity, not fashion.

Didn't someone get shot at Occupy Oakland?

Saying that a college degree doesn't mean you're good enough to perform a job is like saying:

I don't need to be rank 10 to perform my job as a dark knight, but I don't get any party invites, because I'm Rank 1.

The people making 'parties' will see your qualifications. Do you want them to see Rank 1, or Rank 10. In FFXI you can see who else is seeking, and I can tell you if there is another DD seeking who is rank 10, he will be picked over you.

Unemployment for people with college degrees is lower than people without.

not the same thing.
not everything in the world can be boxed into fantasy land.

aren't living in a digital world where there are strict concrete guidelines to determine value. I.E. some people can be as skillful as a "Rank 10" without a rank at all in the REAL WORLD.
SO it makes you're parallel a BIT ineffectual as it's not very relative to reality.

If people clicked the links in my post earlier they would see the riot footage. :S pretty bad tbh

Was anyone expecting anything less from LOLOakland? Come on...It's Oakland!

Reality is a lot more about perceptions than you think.

Who are you to say what "I" think, son?
:P

My "perception" of the world is that it can't be boiled down into something so simple and black and white as ranking systems in a video-game. You're just being silly.

It happens all the time though. I've seen people walk in the door for an interview and people made up their minds not to hire the person because he was "too fat". Especially when going on to apply for a job there are some things that right off the bat get you turned down. Its how the person whos hiring you percieves the role and who would best fit it. Sometimes ability has nothing to do with it or it turns into well okay... these two are the same based on ability but oh hey this one has a degree so yeah lets give it to him. Or that one seems to be in better shape. or hes a man/woman that makes that person that is the opposite sex most likey not as good a choice.

It really has nothing to do with things being black and white. It's how people perceive you. The example of the video game I think is actually a good one as people take meaningless characteristics and use those to base their decision on whether they want you or not rather than looking at the meat and bones.

You're still missing the big picture, sorry.
Apparently a few slanted situationals are all the perceptions you need, apparently a piece of paper does better than a portfolio in your little world, I guess I'm just acknowledging a world where people actually MAKE stuff and are judged by the quality of their work, rather than just their name tag. I do agree that a good deal of that should be factored, but AGAIN it's not as black and white as you keep on asserting.
I have a real world example.
My father doesn't have a college degree.
He makes quality custom cabinetry as well as a number of things and keeps regular customers because of.....OH WHAT?!?! the quality of his work. So keep on strapping the job market into one version of reality, by all means.
It's a whole load of BS to only acknowledge one method when another spits blankly in your face.

You're doing the same thing on the opposite spectrum as you accuse me of doing lol.

I can say this about my father. Without his degree he would never have been considered for the promotions he got and he was at the top of a multi billion dollar company before he retired. He produced quality work and made his way from being a janitor at the company to near the the top. He would never have made it much of anywhere without that piece of paper. Did that degree and what he went through make him more qualified or perform better? I can't say. Did it allow him to advance higher than he would have without it? yes, most definitely.

Sure there are places that judge you on your quality of work instead of things like did you go to college. There is even a possibility that a person without a degree can perform that work better than a person with one. In corporate America a college degree matters. Plain and simple. You can argue however much you want that it shouldn't or whatever but it does, fair or not.

As for your father I think that line of work wouldn't really need a college degree or attract people that would go to college. I would assume that form of work is more along the lines of trade school or just on the job experience. People don't really go to college to become someone who makes custom cabinetry so I don't think it really applies. Unless you are running your own business a few classes couldn't hurt but then again wouldn't apply because the person wouldn't be hired by anyone as they run their own business. I also understand that people can make good livings this way as well. I went to school as I didn't want to go the way of manual labor.

Patronage is also another big hire. A large portion of the people that work in my office are either family or friends or kids of friends or family or a business partner. You live in an ideal world Vinnv where everyone is hired based on their ability and work ethic. In the real world its not like that at all. There are even some companies that will only hire you if you graduated from a specific school. and just so you don't come back at me with the same thing again yes there are some people that are hired based on perceived ability instead of arbitrary things.

l2read.
I've already conceded to the fact that what you say must be considered but not JUST that, but anyway. done with this(meaning this argument, nubs) since you only pay attention to the parts that disagree with you and hit only on that.
not like me being reasonable will change the way you see things.
this is a big world and full of a lot of different people. just because "it might be a good idea" doesn't mean that you can't be successful without it. not saying that it isn't good and didn't say that it wasn't good to better your education or go through a tradeschool, just that it's not the only way.
but you are free to ignore what you want and just imply things when i say the world is full of many DIFFERENT perceptions and isn't as black and white as being "certified" in EVERY case.

I would urge you to take your own advice as you evidently ignored the times that I have agreed that you can be successful without a degree just as I have said a degree does not guarantee you success. Also, I never said it happened in "EVERY case" as you put it. Nor did I say all people are turned away for the same reason. In fact I provided other reasons that they may be turned away that had nothing to do with possessing a degree. Take your own advice before laying it out on others.

whatever you have to say to make yourself seem right brother. :D