Store TP

Ok, so I'm going to start leveling SAM soon (actually i've already leveled it some, but i mean i'm going to take it seriously) And i lke numbers, "number freak" I guess you would say, and I was just wondering what the cap is on Store TP+, gear wise, if there is one?

Also wanted to know about the natural Store TP SAM get's from traits without gear, and the potency and stages of it.

Wiki's Store TP

There is no cap for Store TP, in the sense of caps like on Haste or skill caps. There is, of course, a maximum amount you can get, but after 45 total (25 in traits and 20 in gear, or 35 in traits+merits and 10 in gear) it becomes pointless, unless you have capped merits and like +70 in gear for a 5-hit build. This, however, means you have to sacrifice a lot of other gear to get the 5-hit build, so you will be missing more often and for less damage, which is still not worth it.

Wiki guide covers it, but in case you can't view it where you're at, here are the very basics:

Store TP I-IV you get at various levels (10/30/50/70 I believe).

It's 10/5/5/5, so at SAM 75 you'll have 25 Store TP natural. You can merit up to 10 more, 2 per merit, for a total of 35 before gear. After that, you'll need to get it from gear or food (not likely that you'll use STP Food for that purpose).

The magic number for a 6-hit build with a 450 Delay GK is +46 Store TP. With full merits, you'll need 11 from gear.

How you accomplish that depends a lot on your gear, but the simplest way for someone with non-stellar stuff is Hachiman hands and feet.

As far as how it actually works, it funtions as a multiplier on your TP Return from an action.

Someone with +46 STP will get 1.46x the TP return as someone with no Store TP.

It is actually possible to get a 5-hit build with Great Katana, but you have to sacrifice so many other things in that pursuit that it's just not worth it. When you hear people talk about a 5-hit build, they are most likely talking about with a Polearm.

Even the concept of 6-hit is really WS + 5-hits, and since you probably dump some Store TP gear for WS gear, that actually does matter a little bit.

A good SAM has it closely calculated, and will come out right at or barely over 100 TP in WS+5, so that they are maximizing other things with their other gear. If you can only get to 99% in 6 hits, it might as well be 88% with more accuracy, attack, and haste.

It's been a long time since I started SAM, but I think that you start out with 8-hit for 100 TP, and you can get to 7-hit in the 50s if you have SAM JSE(Shinimusha). You most likely will not be able to get a 6-hit in any form until 70+.

Its pretty simple for a Sam. Get 75 > merit 5/5 Stp > +11 Stp in gear through 5 melee hits + WS = 6 hit build. This is the sweet spot, as Entern said going for a 5 hit is foolish b/c you sacrifice too many other stats, while giving up 6 hit for other stats will also slow you down.

This is also considering that you are using a 450 delay weapon. Using the same amount of STP gear I have a 5 hit build when using Tomoe (4 melee + Penta) and I believe that Futsuno and Pachipachio can also 5 hit with decent gear but lol at getting a Futsuno and the -Acc on pachi is going to negate any benefit that you gained anyway.

Until your 75 I wouldn't worry about STP too much outside of Rajas and once you hit 50 you can test to see if the JSE will shave off a hit, if it does then it would be worth it to use.

Note: At 50, Rajas+Shinimusha Body+Shinimusha pants with Soboro is enough for a 7-hit build, and with Soboro, it's the most fun you'll ever have in FFXI.

Frob,

I posted as Moose in case someone wanted to check and say "j00 don't have SAM" but your conjecture on JSE is correct.

You can get a 7-hit in the 50s with JSE and not sacrificing too much, but to see a SAM 59+ wearing the JSE body and not Hauby, or at least a Scorpion Harness would make me doubt their understanding of what's really important.

Having a 7-hit instead of an 8-hit doesn't matter if you miss one and need an extra swing anyway.

Seeing a SAM 75 wearing the JSE pants also makes me want to cry just as much, and I fear I see it far too often, mais c'est la vie.

This is all correct, although JSE @ 75 isn't as bad as you might think. For someone that doesn't have any of the 3 haste pants, I would argue this is the best option.

This allows for the use of haste gear on both the hands and feet during the TP stage, instead of having to use hachi gear and some form of att leg gear.

FTFY

I guess it just depends on their other gear.

Hell, I wore Rasetsu pants soloing for a long time and everyone told me I was insane, but those Ice Spikes and the paralyze they induce (quite frequently) saved my butt more than a few times.

Biggest thing I could see is if someone had Tamas or Sattva, they might be a good boost for the ol' STP. Depending on how much they needed to hit the critical STP number, you could even advocate Hachiman Hakama (although I only use them for /RNG personally because I just don't use it enough to justify buying Dusk)

Most SAM needs with a 450 delay is +46 sTP in order to land a 6 hit build. Anything more than this is pretty useless unless you have a 480 delay GK, in which case you need +56.

With merits, youc an get a full +35 from job traits alone.

Fixed.

Fixed, getting a 7 hit @lvl50 by just wearing RSE+Rajas at 50 is enough



Well... if you see me you have to cry a lot then... but since i dont have askar Body nor any haste for my Pants ill keep on using the 6 store tp on my legs and +3% haste on hands and feet each for TP than giving that up for Shura or some lol2atkrasetsu in this spot ^~^ (Dusk would be an option too but... 6hit > even if it had 50 atk)

Greetz ('-')/

Oh nearly forgot the topic :o

25 from trait - +21 from merits/gear @ 75 - dont worry bout it much earlier, but never let ANYONE tell you that its worth giving up less hit at that lvl <.< sam = tp *** gdi! o.o

If you want to quote me, at least take a direct quote and don't change the numbers, even if the same concept still applies. You didn't "fix" anything.

I also am not the one who suggested the Rajas Ring. Just like I don't take it as a given that every SAM has a Hagun or Byakko's Haidate, I also don't take as a given that they all have a Rajas Ring.

I mentioned JSE in reference to having Shinimusha Hara-Ate and/or Haidate, which gives you a whopping 15 Store TP combined(9 and 6 respectively). Even with both, you don't have a 6-hit, so wearing both is almost pointless.

Once you hit 57, you are sacrificing a potential 10-12 Accuracy by wearing the body, and that's a hell of a lot to voluntarily give up.

What I'm suggesting is that if you don't have Rajas Ring and you've been using the JSE to get a 7-hit up until 57, someone should think long and hard about just giving it up and wearing SH at 57, then Hauby at 59. In the long term, the added stats will do a lot more for them than the Store TP.

Yes, at 75, if you don't have Myochin +1, Shura, Byakko, Barbarossa, Usukane, etc. for your legs and the ONLY way that you can get a 6-Hit is using Shinimusha Haidate, then maybe they are not a bad choice.

There is also nothing wrong with using Hachiman Kote and Sune-Ate to get to +46. Combined, they cost less than Dusk Gloves, so for someone on a budget, that's probably a more reasonable first step, with a goal to build a more solid Haste set later on.

Rasetsu Hakama are decent for soloing because they serve two purposes, defense and enfeebling. They also don't look half bad either, so not bad for "town gear"

Haste should only be a consideration AFTER you have satisfied the needs of a 6-hit build. Even then, Haste should only be worried about once you are good for Accuracy (it doesn't matter how fast you can miss, it still gives 0 TP return and no damage).

Edit: Yes, I realize I'm not actually IN town. So sue me.

Dammit Enter, I can't see that at work... What funny shizz did you post?

xD It's not funny. It's a screenshot of my town gear.

See if this works.

You could also say you are sacrificing ACC+5 and ATK+5 @55 by not using Jaridah Peti as well. The 7 hit at that level was not appealing to me since I was fighting birds and would not eat any ACC food just to have it stolen.

Meh, I'll just have to check it in a few hours when I get home.

If I'm just running around town, I usually go with 4/5 Osode set and Wyvern head in place of the short bus helmet.

Back a while ago it was Wyvern Helm, Amir Body, Hachiman Hands/Feet, Rasetsu Legs.

I have other headgear, but the Wyvern Helm really is pretty badass looking when you consider it's a damn skull on your head.

Yeah but you're sacrificing ACC+4 by not wearing Jujitsu Gi.

At a certain point, Store TP does become more valuable than ACC. You can easily make up for the 4 ACC in other slots, but the 9 Store TP will be hard.

Good call, Jaridah is not bad either. Actually when I was in that range, I was leveling rather fast and already had an SH.

There were no Jaridah on AH, so I used the Royal Knight body at 55 and I was 57 before I would have been able to get one anyway.

I did use Jaridah for a long time for SAM/RNG Body, with Hachiman for Sidewinders (until I had an Osode, which is now my SAM/RNG body).

The thing with the Store TP, is if it doesn't push you over a threshhold into a different x-hit category, it's mostly going to waste.

The exception could be if it puts you close and you are fighting something that does AoE damage regularly that would make up the gap.

For the most part, 98% TP might as well be 87% TP because it will take you one more swing to be able to WS either way.

Jujistu Gi isn't bad, but for SAMs it's not as big a deal as it is for MNKs. SAM can wear things between the Gi and Peti/SH/Haub that MNK can not, plus they get the added DEX bonus on their accuracy that MNK and NIN do not.

I believe I used Royal Squire, Brigandine, then Royal Knight. I was fairly poor at the time, so I went with what made sense on my budget.

While I agree with you for the most part there are a few things that I don't.
First, I think that at any point we are talking about Sam you should always assume they are using Rajas. Its agruably the most critical piece that a Sam can own in that there is nothing else that can replace it.
Secondly, I don't agree that Shura is a better choices than JSE pants. Shura forces you to remove haste to maintain 6 hit which is never a good thing. AF+1 works virtually the same way as JSE with a few other gear tweaks.

Also Haste vs Acc isn't as clear as you make it sound. True missing faster doesn't help but for example say you land 85/100 swings for 85% acc but I land 88/108 swings in the same period of time for 81% acc I have still gained TP faster than you did even though I missed more often. Items like dusk gloves and fuma sun-ate are much cheaper now than they have ever been and are not very difficult get anymore.

Also pants models are hidieous and should never be used in town gear! Shorts models onry!

Everyone should have read so far so... w/e :p

For the Shura legs thing, i have them but i wont give up my 3% haste when im @~93% acc for vts (only 6/8 GK merits so meh ; ; - lazy :x)

so lets finish it that way o.o 6 hit > acc > haste for store GK (for polearm with 480 delay its another story, 5 hit ftw) :o

uh btw... how many you needed again for 450 delay 5 hit? x.x forgot

Fumas are not hard at all to get, I got mine doing the KSNM with LS friends. Easily won every one even though some of us were killing whoever got charmed, this included the WHM and PLD.

A lot. You have to even sacrifice good ACC food for food with Store TP+6 and a meager amount of Attack.

Agreed, Frob. The Haste/Accuracy line is a curve. Now stop giving away the secrets to why my Soboro madness works better than people might think...

Actually if any of the math whizzes out there want to go do some parses and draw it up, it would actually be an interesting graph.

As far as haste gear, for people who can afford them, certainly get Dusk/Fuma right away, but for people on more of a budget, Hachiman is quality gear for those two slots for a lot less gil.

Plus, the Hachiman holds its value pretty well, so you should be able to flip 'em for even money when you're ready to upgrade.

i personally use Onimaru Pole Grip Askar Korazin Walahra Turban peacock charm Brutal earring fowling earring rajas ring ulthanum ring fuma sune ate byakkos haidate swift belt Foragers mantle Hachiman kote and have 5 hit not fully merited either though just 2/5 atm

Actually, that's a 6-hit unless you have some kinda of magic no one knows.

When people say 6-hit, it really means WS + 5 hits, or in the case that you have 0 TP, it would be 6 hits.

The advice above is generally sound, just for 450 delay GKT: Hachiman Kote/Haubergeon > Dusk Gloves/Askar Korazin. 16accuracy~ is better than 3% Haste and 2% DA in most situations.