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February 2017 Version Update
By Treizekordero 2017-02-10 17:32:53
I suspect it was something more like:
1) Design guy says, "Focus should give Magic Accuracy+10~30%! Languor should give Magic Evasion -10~30%!"
2) Implementation guy makes focus give +10~30% MAcc and Languor -10~30% MEva.
3) Design guy actually meant something like Acc (Hit rate +10% is +20 Acc, not +10% accuracy).
So we've might have been enjoying massively overpowered spells for a long time. I suspect the fact that it still might be possible to use the same strats with more buffs might already be a concession from SE. Facts
Theories without testing != Alternative Factsftfy
Theories without testing == Alternative Facts
I think you forgot to change != to ==
By Calinar 2017-02-10 17:33:49
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/52114-Elemental-Magic-Accuracy
Quote: Elemental Magic Accuracy
I am unable to deal unresisted Magic Damage that was anywhere as close as to what I was able to deal before the update to Frazzle and Geomancy spells. I have the best magic accuracy gear available and I cannot consistently land spells unresisted anymore on difficult content(Omen, Reisenjima HELM monsters). I have Laevateinn with Afterglow 119, all of the new Ambuscade armor that was just released, all 5 Amalric +1 pieces, stikini ring +1 x2, etc. I have the best gear available and I can't land spells even with the aid of RDM and GEO. Please look into this problem.
 Phoenix.Capuchin
Server: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3480
By Phoenix.Capuchin 2017-02-10 17:37:31
Has anyone checked to see if you can get another NQ Adoulin ring after upgrading one to +1?
Walked right back over, the npc at the gate gives the same message about choosing one of the rings, but no menu pops up - same as before I +1'd my ring and would still have NQ in inventory. If you trade her your +1 ring, does she offer to exchange it for another +1 ring, an NQ ring, or nothing? No like he said. The system acts as if you already have a NQ ring causing you not being able to pick another one.
That wasn't really the question though. Znitch confirmed that just talking to the NPC gives you a message as you normally would if you already have a ring. The question was about what happens if you try to TRADE the ring though (which is the way you switch NQ rings, trade and pay the Bayld fee to choose a different ring).
Will Ploh will accept a straight up trade (plus Bayld payment) for a different +1 ring, or is there some other process to choose a different ring. As in, can you trade a +1 ring for a different NQ (then repeat some quest steps to upgrade that to +1)? Or do you need to drop the +1 ring, have Ploh return you a ring (maybe the NQ?), then swap that for your desired ring (NQ to NQ) and upgrade it to +1? I wouldn't want to be the one testing what happens after dropping a +1 ring, but it would be interesting to know!
Not that I have the option to do that quite yet... guess this is my motivation to get my furrow from rank 6 to rank 7 and do those last couple quests I never bothered with! No complaints though, I'm well aware I've had ages to do most of this stuff. Nobody really has much excuse aside from laziness, after the massive whining about needing coalition ranks to get Ergon, and the extremely useful Cheers from the higher ranked raised monsters.
Server: Odin
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3816
By Odin.Drakenv 2017-02-10 17:38:19
I suspect it was something more like:
1) Design guy says, "Focus should give Magic Accuracy+10~30%! Languor should give Magic Evasion -10~30%!"
2) Implementation guy makes focus give +10~30% MAcc and Languor -10~30% MEva.
3) Design guy actually meant something like Acc (Hit rate +10% is +20 Acc, not +10% accuracy).
So we've might have been enjoying massively overpowered spells for a long time. I suspect the fact that it still might be possible to use the same strats with more buffs might already be a concession from SE. Facts
Theories without testing != Alternative Factsftfy
Theories without testing == Alternative Facts
I think you forgot to change != to == lol haha "you mean false goods miss Conway?"
Crowd goes wild
[+]
Server: Odin
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3816
By Odin.Drakenv 2017-02-10 17:39:17
Has anyone checked to see if you can get another NQ Adoulin ring after upgrading one to +1?
Walked right back over, the npc at the gate gives the same message about choosing one of the rings, but no menu pops up - same as before I +1'd my ring and would still have NQ in inventory. If you trade her your +1 ring, does she offer to exchange it for another +1 ring, an NQ ring, or nothing? No like he said. The system acts as if you already have a NQ ring causing you not being able to pick another one.
That wasn't really the question though. Znitch confirmed that just talking to the NPC gives you a message as you normally would if you already have a ring. The question was about what happens if you try to TRADE the ring though (which is the way you switch NQ rings, trade and pay the Bayld fee to choose a different ring).
Will Ploh will accept a straight up trade (plus Bayld payment) for a different +1 ring, or is there some other process to choose a different ring. As in, can you trade a +1 ring for a different NQ (then repeat some quest steps to upgrade that to +1)? Or do you need to drop the +1 ring, have Ploh return you a ring (maybe the NQ?), then swap that for your desired ring (NQ to NQ) and upgrade it to +1? I wouldn't want to be the one testing what happens after dropping a +1 ring, but it would be interesting to know!
Not that I have the option to do that quite yet... guess this is my motivation to get my furrow from rank 6 to rank 7 and do those last couple quests I never bothered with! No complaints though, I'm well aware I've had ages to do most of this stuff. Nobody really has much excuse aside from laziness, after the massive whining about needing coalition ranks to get Ergon, and the extremely useful Cheers from the higher ranked raised monsters.
Still nope.
Phoenix.Capuchin
Server: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3480
By Phoenix.Capuchin 2017-02-10 17:46:43
Are you saying nothing happens when you try to trade Ploh a +1 ring? If that's the case, probably have to drop it. If some brave soul feels like finding out whether S-E properly implemented a re-quest for the +1 ring, go for it!
For NQs, if you drop your ring and wait 1 game day Ploh will return it. Shared with Councilors Garb and Cuffs, if you've dropped those she'll return one item per game day in the order of Garb > Cuffs > Ring.
If there's no +1 to +1 trade implemented, I'd assume you should get an NQ ring back and then you have to trade NQ->NQ and upgrade the ring. Probably redoing the new quests just added this update, and probably also requiring the HP Bayld payment again. That's just speculation though, so do at your own risk and all that. Wouldn't come as a total shock to me if they neglected to properly account for a +1 ring trade.
By Quetzacoatl 2017-02-10 17:47:35
Quote: The following jobs have undergone adjustments.
Red Mage
The durations of the following black magic spells have been increased.
Distract / Distract II / Distract III / Frazzle / Frazzle II / Frazzle III
The values of the black magic spells Distract III and Frazzle III have been increased.
Server: Odin
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3816
By Odin.Drakenv 2017-02-10 17:48:54
Are you saying nothing happens when you try to trade Ploh a +1 ring? If that's the case, probably have to drop it. If some brave soul feels like finding out whether S-E properly implemented a re-quest for the +1 ring, go for it!
For NQs, if you drop your ring and wait 1 game day Ploh will return it. Shared with Councilors Garb and Cuffs, if you've dropped those she'll return one item per game day in the order of Garb > Cuffs > Ring.
If there's no +1 to +1 trade implemented, I'd assume you should get an NQ ring back and then you have to trade NQ->NQ and upgrade the ring. Probably redoing the new quests just added this update, and probably also requiring the HP Bayld payment again. That's just speculation though, so do at your own risk and all that. Wouldn't come as a total shock to me if they neglected to properly account for a +1 ring trade. Nope. It's all a dream :0 YouTube Video Placeholder
 Shiva.Znitch
Server: Shiva
Game: FFXI
Posts: 188
By Shiva.Znitch 2017-02-10 17:50:52
Has anyone checked to see if you can get another NQ Adoulin ring after upgrading one to +1?
Walked right back over, the npc at the gate gives the same message about choosing one of the rings, but no menu pops up - same as before I +1'd my ring and would still have NQ in inventory. If you trade her your +1 ring, does she offer to exchange it for another +1 ring, an NQ ring, or nothing? No like he said. The system acts as if you already have a NQ ring causing you not being able to pick another one.
That wasn't really the question though. Znitch confirmed that just talking to the NPC gives you a message as you normally would if you already have a ring. The question was about what happens if you try to TRADE the ring though (which is the way you switch NQ rings, trade and pay the Bayld fee to choose a different ring).
Will Ploh will accept a straight up trade (plus Bayld payment) for a different +1 ring, or is there some other process to choose a different ring. As in, can you trade a +1 ring for a different NQ (then repeat some quest steps to upgrade that to +1)? Or do you need to drop the +1 ring, have Ploh return you a ring (maybe the NQ?), then swap that for your desired ring (NQ to NQ) and upgrade it to +1? I wouldn't want to be the one testing what happens after dropping a +1 ring, but it would be interesting to know!
Not that I have the option to do that quite yet... guess this is my motivation to get my furrow from rank 6 to rank 7 and do those last couple quests I never bothered with! No complaints though, I'm well aware I've had ages to do most of this stuff. Nobody really has much excuse aside from laziness, after the massive whining about needing coalition ranks to get Ergon, and the extremely useful Cheers from the higher ranked raised monsters.
Still nope.
If I trade my +1 ring, it starts the cutscene to exchange my ring for another by paying 300k Bayld - I'm not really wanting to go any further past that. So either A) you get a NQ ring and have to get it reforged at the HP Bayld NPC with another 100 HPB (probably) or B) She gives you a different +1 ring at the castle gates.
[+]
 Shiva.Avero
Server: Shiva
Game: FFXI
Posts: 11
By Shiva.Avero 2017-02-10 20:56:32
Following up to previous posts on HIer tier NMs being Broken - WoC is taking horrible DMG mage style - Deaths would hit 5-6k, can not aga down wyverns either easily as before.
Attempting a Kirin soon DD to test acc/dmg, with BRDs Bolster and RDMIII EDIT: Yeah no acc issues - Magic seems to be the only problem on some NMs
Server: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6052
By Leviathan.Comeatmebro 2017-02-10 21:08:47
i mean, there's not really anything to test on DD kirin
it was doable in under 2 min with slightly above average DD and no 1hrs already, it's obviously going to be doable and even easier with all those buffs
[+]
Asura.Saevel
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 9728
By Asura.Saevel 2017-02-10 21:42:05
Ok screwing around with distract III in Ballista with a friend. 594 skill and capped dMND (352 MND vs 102) and the effect was -155 evasion with 24% boost and 313 with Sab. I've since added another 8 skill. So yeah extremely power debuff.
By knoxvegas 2017-02-10 21:57:32
Well just tried Teles BLM style and it was pretty sad... After first few MBs the dmg just floored... timed out at 35ish%. Intresting that a N/T marcato thren resisted... didnt even think that was possible. guess will have to add that to melee list now.
Fenrir.Ramzus
Server: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1387
By Fenrir.Ramzus 2017-02-10 22:28:45
I think Vagary is broken. Didn't get a single Perf/Plouton objective cleared. Will confirm after I re-enter
Valefor.Omnys
Server: Valefor
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1759
By Valefor.Omnys 2017-02-10 22:32:44
Well just tried Teles BLM style and it was pretty sad... After first few MBs the dmg just floored... timed out at 35ish%. Intresting that a N/T marcato thren resisted... didnt even think that was possible. guess will have to add that to melee list now.
Job setup and buffs used? Focus, languor, threnody, tier of frazzle, etc?
Oh, and element(s)? Sorry, never maged Teles.
Server: Odin
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2254
By Odin.Llewelyn 2017-02-10 22:34:35
Good luck landing Dark Threnody on Teles. Pretty sure everything light-based is useless.
By Lexouritis 2017-02-10 22:37:23
18manned t3s in Rei just fine with SCH GEO GEO BLM BLM COR x2, PLD RDM GEO GEO WHM COR. Doing HELMs tommorow
Bubbs were: GEO Fcous/GEO Int, Indi Haste/Acumen in each nuke party.
2 GEOS in tank party did focus/int/lang/mal.
Had about 24 people, so alternated supports and killed them twice, 2-3 idris in each allaince at any given time. One Tupsi AG SCH.
I'm assuming BRD + RUN would be necessary for less experienced groups, but other than Frazzle3 we didn't do much Different than pre-update.
T1s and T2s were a joke still, with Gajashimha taking a bit longer.
In any case, INT/frazzle 3 were enough for us, with the top group for t3s.
Yet to try helms, that's tommorrow, will update~
By Quetzacoatl 2017-02-10 22:37:31
Ok screwing around with distract III in Ballista with a friend. 594 skill and capped dMND (352 MND vs 102) and the effect was -155 evasion with 24% boost and 313 with Sab. I've since added another 8 skill. So yeah extremely power debuff. Wow, geez. I may have underestimated this buff, then.
Asura.Saevel
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 9728
By Asura.Saevel 2017-02-10 22:41:29
The real question is does Frazzle III follow the same formula as Distract III? If so then that's a huge *** amount of magic evasion to remove, assuming you can land it in the first place.
By Verda 2017-02-10 23:14:24
Neak still dies to 99k TF with 99k light chain, and we did 80k death on the same mob using only storms II and one idris geo and RUN. So that was without languor at all, or frazzle III.
I've also landed gravity full duration first try on fodder with smn/rdm which means like 166 enfeebling skill... was also able to do with just rdm land para and slow with no geo or other support on t2 Gajasima. Yakshi is more annoying mage setup now though and didn't try Maju yet.
Seems only some t3 and perhaps all t4 and high tier sky mobs affected to a huge extent while anything lower is easier, but will test more tomorrow.
Also friendly reminder Burn + Fire shots and impact exist for int down on mob, or conflag strike + impact if you have a smn along.
By Quetzacoatl 2017-02-10 23:17:21
The real question is does Frazzle III follow the same formula as Distract III? If so then that's a huge *** amount of magic evasion to remove, assuming you can land it in the first place. No idea, but I've been waiting to use this for some time now
Fenrir.Ramzus
Server: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1387
By Fenrir.Ramzus 2017-02-10 23:19:15
I think Vagary is broken. Didn't get a single Perf/Plouton objective cleared. Will confirm after I re-enter
false alarm but it is being annoying
Sylph.Braden
Server: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 397
By Sylph.Braden 2017-02-10 23:34:41
Checked my favorite Apex buddies:
Apex Bat Lv134: 1257 > 1193 (-64 Evasion)
Apex Bat Lv135: 1290 > 1224 (-66 Evasion)
Apex Bat Lv136: 1322 > 1254 (-68 Evasion)
For funsies, let's use numbers from before the August 2016 patch:
Apex Bat Lv134: 1351 > 1193 (-158 Evasion)
Apex Bat Lv135: 1387 > 1224 (-163 Evasion)
Apex Bat Lv136: 1423 > 1254 (-169 Evasion)
Combined with the BRD and RDM changes, it's really easy to hit ***now.
[+]
Fenrir.Snaps
Server: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1139
By Fenrir.Snaps 2017-02-10 23:50:54
Checked my favorite Apex buddies:
Apex Bat Lv134: 1257 > 1193 (-64 Evasion)
Apex Bat Lv135: 1290 > 1224 (-66 Evasion)
Apex Bat Lv136: 1322 > 1254 (-68 Evasion)
For funsies, let's use numbers from before the August 2016 patch:
Apex Bat Lv134: 1351 > 1193 (-158 Evasion)
Apex Bat Lv135: 1387 > 1224 (-163 Evasion)
Apex Bat Lv136: 1423 > 1254 (-169 Evasion)
Combined with the BRD and RDM changes, it's really easy to hit ***now.
I actually feel like they've made it way too easy to do melee content. Only needing 1250 accuracy to hit Omen bosses is pretty stupid. What's the incentive to get accuracy gear now?
Server: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6052
By Leviathan.Comeatmebro 2017-02-10 23:56:22
I feel like it was intentional and they intend to drag out current content by forcing setup changes. Pretty obvious that melee will be the way to go across the board for t4 if it stays as is. Dont know many linkshells with as many capable melee as death blms, though.
By Lexouritis 2017-02-10 23:58:19
Mastered well geared RDM landed it easily with focus/int, and even without Focus/Int (slight resist rate on Tree) Frazzle 3 that is
By Lexouritis 2017-02-11 00:00:10
Oh edit, Maju was shitty in terms of landing deaths, so advising a 'accuracy death set' for some BLMs. Our usual Top parsing BLM parsed last on the t3s, others had better magic acc sets, again that with the above stated setup. Prettyn sure a RUN + BRD poking withn threnodies would have made our nuker parse 'normal.' So yeah, Magic acc sets are back >.>
By Lexouritis 2017-02-11 00:01:44
and yeah these mobs (so far at least t3s in Rei) need slight adjustments if any for the stronger groups.
Fenrir.Snaps
Server: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1139
By Fenrir.Snaps 2017-02-11 00:19:23
Leviathan.Comeatmebro said: »I feel like it was intentional and they intend to drag out current content by forcing setup changes. Pretty obvious that melee will be the way to go across the board for t4 if it stays as is. Dont know many linkshells with as many capable melee as death blms, though.
Yeah I dunno about that. They reduced mob evasion drastically while also providing massive accuracy buff adjustments. You can get away without any deliberate accuracy gear against the hardest mobs in the game so long as you have a single well geared Bard. The same mobs are stat checking mage setups out of viability. That's not balance. I think it's just a hasty, poorly thought out implementation that will probably be fixed after massive amounts of JP bitching.
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