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Merit Weaponskill 2014
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 414
By Asura.Reichleiu 2014-09-03 08:02:20
Quote: Stardiver - Top Polearm ws for none Mythics, must have if main, Drakesbane is an accept alt ws, Camlaan torment option too?
Stardiver is the best Polearm WS at the moment. With changes to tp gain, Stardiver takes over even if you have a mythic due to the fact that it scales the best with more TP.
This could change again in the future as DRG gets more attack / crit hit through gear + next updates 20% attack boost enhancement. Main issues with Drakesbane are lack of crit rate and attack.
Right now however..
1. Stardiver: Best all around WS for DRG.
2. Camlann's Torment: Best for low attack + fighting an enemy with high DEF. Consistent output after changes. Closes or opens a light skillchain.
3. Drakesbane: Best for fodder / old content (where your attack is capped and you capped Ddex). Closes or opens a light skillchain so can be used situationally. Best crit WS.
In situations where you are fighting alongside someone who can open or close light, using Camlann's will provide a slightly higher overall damage output on modern content; obviously due to skillchain damage. Camlann's > Camlann's does light as well.
Stardiver can work well in darkness skillchains with certain WSs but is the highest pure damage WS DRG has for modern content.
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Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 34187
By Asura.Kingnobody 2014-09-03 08:29:43
Upheavel - Nice GA ws but not necessary with Res and Ukko's Upheaval is a great WS for Mighty Strikes Spam.
Especially when you have an Aftermath L3 Conqueror....
By FaeQueenCory 2014-09-03 08:30:36
One theory to explain it's weakness is that the Ergon weapon might give a 35% WS bonus similiar to what the other mythic weapons do, which would bring it more in line with post-update Reso. Too bad Ergon weapons aren't Mythics.
(They're actually JSEmpyreans... No Damage boost... High ƒTP mod WSs.... WSs that make "double Light".... Ergon Weapons are the *** answer to RUN and GEO not getting Relic or Empys.
Just like how Empys were their "solution" to post-CoP jobs not having Relic access.)
And isn't it +40% on Mythics and +30% on Relics?
Server: Excalibur
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By Creaucent Alazrin 2014-09-03 08:52:42
Nope its +40% on relics, +30% on mythics and none of empyreans.
No Ergon weapons arent JSEmpyreans they are mythic equivalents hence having the mythic aftermath and JA/stat enhancments.
By volkom 2014-09-03 09:55:30
Bismarck.Bloodrose said: »With Dimidiation, Resolution isn't even close to necessary for RUN, and with Torcleaver beating the hell out of Resolution for any aptly geared drk, it's even less necessary.
wut ? Unless you're using sc or have poor attack, you should be using resolution.
Torcleaver is the best
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3213
By Asura.Failaras 2014-09-03 11:14:15
Entropy is a must for main DRKS; a weapon skill that does decent dmg and caps your mp back up, paired with Catastrophe = infinite MP and HP. Or just use resolution.
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By Odin.Jassik 2014-09-03 11:33:23
Entropy is a must for main DRKS; a weapon skill that does decent dmg and caps your mp back up, paired with Catastrophe = infinite MP and HP. Or just use resolution.
A liberator drk would be foolish to use a GS in most situations, for lowman, apoc is quite useful as well, so there are plenty of situations where having access to entropy would be worthwhile. Just having the MP to buff yourself after being plagued if you don't have time to rest or idle could be quite useful.
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By Asura.Failaras 2014-09-03 11:39:03
Entropy is a must for main DRKS; a weapon skill that does decent dmg and caps your mp back up, paired with Catastrophe = infinite MP and HP. Or just use resolution.
A liberator drk would be foolish to use a GS in most situations, for lowman, apoc is quite useful as well, so there are plenty of situations where having access to entropy would be worthwhile. Just having the MP to buff yourself after being plagued if you don't have time to rest or idle could be quite useful. Are we assuming all "main" Drks have a Liberator now? Apoc is and since 75 will be a toy to play with in ballista and soloing old things for no reason. If you lack Liberator like most people who are still main Drks, you should be using a Gsword and Resolution/Torcleaver. Saying a Drk needs some silly MP regeneration WS attached to a weak weapon type to be considered a "main" Drk is insane.
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By Odin.Jassik 2014-09-03 11:42:05
Entropy is a must for main DRKS; a weapon skill that does decent dmg and caps your mp back up, paired with Catastrophe = infinite MP and HP. Or just use resolution.
A liberator drk would be foolish to use a GS in most situations, for lowman, apoc is quite useful as well, so there are plenty of situations where having access to entropy would be worthwhile. Just having the MP to buff yourself after being plagued if you don't have time to rest or idle could be quite useful. Are we assuming all "main" Drks have a Liberator now? Apoc is and since 75 will be a toy to play with in ballista and soloing old things for no reason. If you lack Liberator like most people who are still main Drks, you should be using a Gsword and Resolution/Torcleaver. Saying a Drk needs some silly MP regeneration WS attached to a weak weapon type to be considered a "main" Drk is insane.
I didn't say only people with Liberator are main DRK's... I just said there's plenty of situations where Entropy is worth using. Spamming Reso isn't the only way or always the right way to play DRK.
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Server: Asura
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By Asura.Failaras 2014-09-03 11:46:19
Entropy is a must for main DRKS; a weapon skill that does decent dmg and caps your mp back up, paired with Catastrophe = infinite MP and HP. Or just use resolution.
A liberator drk would be foolish to use a GS in most situations, for lowman, apoc is quite useful as well, so there are plenty of situations where having access to entropy would be worthwhile. Just having the MP to buff yourself after being plagued if you don't have time to rest or idle could be quite useful. Are we assuming all "main" Drks have a Liberator now? Apoc is and since 75 will be a toy to play with in ballista and soloing old things for no reason. If you lack Liberator like most people who are still main Drks, you should be using a Gsword and Resolution/Torcleaver. Saying a Drk needs some silly MP regeneration WS attached to a weak weapon type to be considered a "main" Drk is insane.
I didn't say only people with Liberator are main DRK's... I just said there's plenty of situations where Entropy is worth using. Spamming Reso isn't the only way or always the right way to play DRK. The original quoter said that "Entropy is a must for main Drks" and he was saying it from an Apocalypse perspective. The thing is spamming Reso/Tor IS the right way to play the large majority of the time. You basically have to make up situations to make Apocalypse and Entropy worth caring about.
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By Odin.Jassik 2014-09-03 11:49:47
Entropy is a must for main DRKS; a weapon skill that does decent dmg and caps your mp back up, paired with Catastrophe = infinite MP and HP. Or just use resolution.
A liberator drk would be foolish to use a GS in most situations, for lowman, apoc is quite useful as well, so there are plenty of situations where having access to entropy would be worthwhile. Just having the MP to buff yourself after being plagued if you don't have time to rest or idle could be quite useful. Are we assuming all "main" Drks have a Liberator now? Apoc is and since 75 will be a toy to play with in ballista and soloing old things for no reason. If you lack Liberator like most people who are still main Drks, you should be using a Gsword and Resolution/Torcleaver. Saying a Drk needs some silly MP regeneration WS attached to a weak weapon type to be considered a "main" Drk is insane.
I didn't say only people with Liberator are main DRK's... I just said there's plenty of situations where Entropy is worth using. Spamming Reso isn't the only way or always the right way to play DRK. The original quoter said that "Entropy is a must for main Drks" and he was saying it from an Apocalypse perspective. The thing is spamming Reso/Tor IS the right way to play the large majority of the time. You basically have to make up situations to make Apocalypse and Entropy worth caring about.
Let me put it this way... Would you consider Reso a must for main WAR's? Not every WAR has Rag, and spamming ukko's or upheaval is the right way to play it the majority of the time. But there are plenty of situations where having reso is worth it, and a person who takes their job seriously should have access to all the tools it offers.
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Server: Asura
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By Asura.Failaras 2014-09-03 11:57:45
Except there are real situations in which Reso is good and worth using, on real content, Reso is an important part of the Wars toolkit in actual events (and a large portion of the time too). Entropy is almost never a useful tool in real events, in fact it's rarely useful outside of real events. You lose absolutely nothing by not having Entropy during delve for instance, there is no real situation that using a Scythe (non liberator) is correct in that event. The same is true for the majority of end game.
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By Odin.Jassik 2014-09-03 12:00:14
we'll agree to disagree then. I think it's stupid to purposefully limit your toolkit on any job you take seriously, especially when that job isn't in strong demand.
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Server: Asura
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Posts: 3213
By Asura.Failaras 2014-09-03 12:04:40
we'll agree to disagree then. I think it's stupid to purposefully limit your toolkit on any job you take seriously, especially when that job isn't in strong demand. What good is wasting a space on a tool you will never use in real events? Especially when you are talking about merit WS slots, you already have 1/3 of your slots taken by Resolution. For most people these slots have a large value and wasting a slot on a WS that will never be used in real events seems stupid to me.
Server: Excalibur
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By Creaucent Alazrin 2014-09-03 12:07:15
Apart from drks look badass with a Scythe... im an old school drk when scythe was the main weapon and entropy does nice damage now. I will switch to GS when needed but I just like scythe more.
Oh how different it would be if entropy and reso were switched lol. Drk would be back to using the weapon it was supposed to be.
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By Odin.Jassik 2014-09-03 12:09:30
we'll agree to disagree then. I think it's stupid to purposefully limit your toolkit on any job you take seriously, especially when that job isn't in strong demand. What good is wasting a space on a tool you will never use in real events? Especially when you are talking about merit WS slots, you already have 1/3 of your slots taken by Resolution. For most people these slots have a large value and wasting a slot on a WS that will never be used in real events seems stupid to me.
Since there's only 2 WS that DRK can merit, you're not wasting anything. That's the point of noting it as your main job. At one point, being WAR main required me to have 3 WS fully merited. That was the price of being the best WAR I could be. People just don't view a main job the way they used to.
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 Valefor.Sehachan
Server: Valefor
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Posts: 24219
By Valefor.Sehachan 2014-09-03 12:10:20
A serious drk would have Koga, cause only sam matters!
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By Creaucent Alazrin 2014-09-03 12:12:35
A serious drk would have emo died a long time ago, cause only sam matters!
Ftfy
Server: Asura
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By Asura.Failaras 2014-09-03 12:13:27
we'll agree to disagree then. I think it's stupid to purposefully limit your toolkit on any job you take seriously, especially when that job isn't in strong demand. What good is wasting a space on a tool you will never use in real events? Especially when you are talking about merit WS slots, you already have 1/3 of your slots taken by Resolution. For most people these slots have a large value and wasting a slot on a WS that will never be used in real events seems stupid to me.
Since there's only 2 WS that DRK can merit, you're not wasting anything. That's the point of noting it as your main job. At one point, being WAR main required me to have 3 WS fully merited. That was the price of being the best WAR I could be. People just don't view a main job the way they used to. Having a single job makes you so much less useful right now as a player, you can still main a job without wasting your WS points on a ***WS with no real use. I can main a job without making all my other jobs bad to gain a non existant amount of utility.
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Server: Excalibur
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By Creaucent Alazrin 2014-09-03 12:25:05
Theres only a handful of merit wses that are at the top now stardiver, last stand, resolution, upheaval, ruinator... rest have pretty much been made redundant by other wses. Fudo, VS, evis/rudras, JR and CDC. In your logic the mage wses offer nothing useful in endgame then shouldnt merit them at all.
Server: Asura
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By Asura.Failaras 2014-09-03 12:29:36
Creaucent Alazrin said: »Theres only a handful of merit wses that are at the top now stardiver, last stand, resolution, upheaval, ruinator... rest have pretty much been made redundant by other wses. Fudo, VS, evis/rudras, JR and CDC. In your logic the mage wses offer nothing useful in endgame then shouldnt merit them at all. Shoha/Apex are both pretty important for Sam. I won't pretend to know how every Mage WS works because I don't, I know there is some melee Geo movement and such that could make their WS useful. More importantly if you say "A Whm isn't a real Whm without the merited club WS", you are dumb.
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By Creaucent Alazrin 2014-09-03 12:33:37
Fudo/Namas are better and totally missed the point with the mage wses should have /sarcasm.
Edit: Saying apex is important for sam and entropy isnt for drk is rather silly since its not really adding much utility. Sure you can hit piercing weak phases but any serious sam will have a yoichi.
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By Odin.Jassik 2014-09-03 12:34:12
Creaucent Alazrin said: »Theres only a handful of merit wses that are at the top now stardiver, last stand, resolution, upheaval, ruinator... rest have pretty much been made redundant by other wses. Fudo, VS, evis/rudras, JR and CDC. In your logic the mage wses offer nothing useful in endgame then shouldnt merit them at all. Shoha/Apex are both pretty important for Sam. I won't pretend to know how every Mage WS works because I don't, I know there is some melee Geo movement and such that could make their WS useful. However if you are choosing to merit up a almost useless mage WS over a good WS that you would actually use on real events, it is silly.
If someone has only DRK and WHM, why would they leave WS's unmerited only because they would never use them? Shoha really only needs 1/5 because it's used almost exclusively for chaining at this point, Apex is nearly worthless on anything higher than Bee delve, etc. That's basically 8 WS merits you can use elsewhere, having 1/5 in entropy is hardly a sacrifice for anyone who actually plays DRK and owns a scythe.
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By Asura.Failaras 2014-09-03 12:36:35
Shoha is important for making 4 step light. Apex allows for using Cibitshavore and gaining hate, Apex is great for bee. Both have real uses for end game that make them worth having, depending on how your LS operates.
Quote: If someone has only DRK and WHM, why would they leave WS's unmerited only because they would never use them? Shoha really only needs 1/5 because it's used almost exclusively for chaining at this point, Apex is nearly worthless on anything higher than Bee delve, etc. That's basically 8 WS merits you can use elsewhere, having 1/5 in entropy is hardly a sacrifice for anyone who actually plays DRK and owns a scythe. So sacrifice Apex or Shoha, both which have REAL uses in end game and are used pretty commonly, to get Entropy for no reason?
I never once talked about having free spaces, just that you are losing nothing from being a "real" Drk by not having entropy.
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By Chyula 2014-09-03 13:09:42
I thought drk only use Guillotine.
By volkom 2014-09-03 13:15:54
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 Asura.Loire
Server: Asura
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By Asura.Loire 2014-09-03 13:50:20
Creaucent Alazrin said: »Fudo/Namas are better and totally missed the point with the mage wses should have /sarcasm.
Edit: Saying apex is important for sam and entropy isnt for drk is rather silly since its not really adding much utility. Sure you can hit piercing weak phases but any serious sam will have a yoichi. Any serious sam would have a koga and subsequently have apex since relic and mythic aftermath don't play well together
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By Asura.Gippali 2014-09-03 13:54:25
Shoha is important for making 4 step light. Apex allows for using Cibitshavore and gaining hate, Apex is great for bee. Both have real uses for end game that make them worth having, depending on how your LS operates.
Quote: If someone has only DRK and WHM, why would they leave WS's unmerited only because they would never use them? Shoha really only needs 1/5 because it's used almost exclusively for chaining at this point, Apex is nearly worthless on anything higher than Bee delve, etc. That's basically 8 WS merits you can use elsewhere, having 1/5 in entropy is hardly a sacrifice for anyone who actually plays DRK and owns a scythe. So sacrifice Apex or Shoha, both which have REAL uses in end game and are used pretty commonly, to get Entropy for no reason?
I never once talked about having free spaces, just that you are losing nothing from being a "real" Drk by not having entropy.
Stop using this "real situation" or "real events" crap. If a player finds it useful in the events that they participate in it's worth having.
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2014-09-03 13:54:43
real drk's dual wield Kraken Clubs
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Server: Leviathan
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Posts: 6052
By Leviathan.Comeatmebro 2014-09-03 13:56:19
this thread inspired me to merit apex instead of going back to tsuru when using ranged
Finishing up my recapping my merits and currently re evaluating my merit-able weapons based on practicality. would appreciate your opinions and hopefully bring attention to situations/logic i have missed.
Shijin 0/5 - Not necessary with release of Victory Smite and various adjustments from other option via ws update.
Exenterator - Most have for non REM and Dancer.
Requiescat - Utility for Cor, Sam, Run in Delve. Must have options for BLU/PLD mains.
Resolution - Must have for DRK/WAR/RUN.
Ruinator - Must have for Serious BST, Rampage is meh vs it. option for war.
Upheavel - Nice GA ws but not necessary with Res and Ukko's
Entropy - none necessary, with Res/cata
Stardiver - Top Polearm ws for none Mythics, must have if main, Drakesbane is an accept alt ws, Camlaan torment option too?
Blade: Shun - not needed with Hi and jin.
Shoha - Fudo is king. unlock if main.
realm - unecessary
Shatter - nice for blm brd soloing, but not worth points if short on options
apex arrow - must have for bow non relic sam, otherwise dont bother.
Last Stand - Must have if you pay cor or rng.
so that leaves me at
3/5 Last stand
3/5 Res
3/5 Exen
3/5 ruin
3/5 Requiescat
i dont play bst must but the ws seems necessary so depending on feedback and suggestions for which i must 5/5 (if serous about job). i probably will put 1/5 ruin toss those into last stand or exen or res.
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