[Dev] RNG: Ammo Adjustments

Well I mean at this point at 99 with max merits and gear for Recycle surely you don't burn a whole quiver in a matter of minutes... I hope? ._. Or is RNG even more crazy then I thought at first?

In a 4x VW run I use a little over 3 stacks of adaman bullets with 5/5 recycle merits, so yeah anything is helpful.

I was under the impression that at 99 (or close) RNG's and COR's nowadays would be able to do 3~5 fights with one quiver/bullet stack. Thanks for enlightening me...

11-07-2012 01:27 PM [source]
Camate Community Rep		Siren.Kalilla said: » Camate, there is a bit of confusion going on at the other forums atm. Is this only for RNG? or will COR be receiving some love as well? COR obviously doesn't need it as much as RNG, however it would be nice to know if both jobs are in the deal or if it's just RNG. From the looks of things this is a ranger specific change; however, I will double check with the development team to be certain.
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As usual I am going to post based of OP not off what a single person has said and will say my piece.
There are different classes of players, there are different classes of ammo, we should keep it that way, If you cannot afford to play at the level of others, then use the next tier down. If you adjust the prices of ammo they will all be the same price just about and nobody will buy the next lower tier, if you look back at old ammo prices now, Demon and Scorpion arrows are right about the same price for a stack of quiver.

That being said If the price is changed, all ammo will be the same cheap price, and there will be players out of their league with gear they don't Understand,need,deserve.

My major point here is if they adjust this in such a way to where ammo is damn near infinite, It will kill the market for all lower tier ammo's point of being. (Considering nobody levels the way they used to, there will be no need for lower tier Ammo.

One of the main reasons why I didn't level RNG (or COR for that matter) past level 10 is because I was told how expensive it can be. I may be encouraged to try now.

Oh
my
god.

This is amazing news for scout's beret +2 as well. I hope to god they don't nerf it. 90% almost guarantees at least 1 proc per tp phase. Should increase RNG's tp gain dramatically.

11-08-2012 07:53 AM [BG source] [JP source]
Slycer BG Translator		Regarding the Cost of Ammunition (continued) {{Couple of JP Posts about Scout's Beret +2 augment essentially saying it will become a required piece of gear for all RNGs for almost everything, asking if that was intentional. [JP Post 1 - Siren.Momama] [JP Post 2 - Bismarck.Sclud] }} In the current state, with 5 merits in "Recycle," ultimately, the effect will yield TP+5 about 90% of the time, as you said. However, in order to allow for the use of a variety of equipment, this does not seem acceptable at this time. I would appreciate any further feedback, if you have any. Translated by: Slycer
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you've got to be kidding me. i thought that place was all smart with their entrance examinations..

Cooking is pretty cut throat on Siren as is.... People under cut the hell out of other all day..... to the point there losing money sometimes.....

Yea, I was always pretty frustrated by that until I finally decided to just drop cooking altogether. The only conclusion I could come to is that people intentionally drop the prices to yield negative profit margins to chase out people like myself, and then resume using the original price once they have the market back to themselves.

That, or they're just idiots.

11-08-2012 01:26 PM [source]
Camate Community Rep		I went ahead and checked with the development team about your question regarding corsair. While the possibility is not zero for corsair to receive a Recycle job trait, in the event that they did, it would not be as strong as the effect ranger is to receive. The current focus at the moment is for ranger adjustments, so once concrete plans for this have been decided we can look into this as well.
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So with that I'll leave the title as RNG only, sorry COR's :(

To ammo tiers existing to separate quality of players:

As the game stands, lower tier gear is near irrelevant and ammo shouldn't be different. Requiring a playable job to cost any amount in arbitrary consumables is akin to giving you the finger.

At 75, one could swap ammo in & out as fights had varied durations. Whoever could / wanted to, used just expensive ammo.

At 99, its an unspoken requirement that RNGs use real ammo to try to keep up with current melee scopes.

Wow, how stupid can you get? The piece is already required as it is. This update will just boost its effectiveness. How the hell can you be angry about a buff? I'm going to be REALLY pissed if the JPs cause the beret to be nerfed.

That's like saying, "Thaumas body is so amazing it's required in gear sets. Is that intentional?" No, but you're ***if you don't have it. Why ask for nerfs?

*** whiny *** JPs need to learn to keep their slanty mouths shut, just because they don't have, or can;t get a piece of equipment

wow that's just nuts this player base at times makes me wonder....

Because AF2+2 is so hard to get. It's a justified point, and I said yesterday on BG that the beret would almost certainly be nerfed to proc on ~half of all Recycle shots such that the effect is comparable to current performance.

Also racism is super cool.

90% proc rate granting Store TP+10 per Recycle merit level whenever Recycle procs. Yeah that might be a tad broken lol....

Why do people think it's store tp +10... Camate even said what it was in his post... It's TP+1 per recycle merit per shot if recycle procs.

If it's nerfed down to its current performance, it's still worth using over everything else, which doesn't really solve the issue these two JP posters are worried about. Their point is that the beret will replace every other head gear out there, which is true, but it already does... so I don't see the problem. They should have been complaining about this back when AF2+2 was released...

You also have to take into consideration the fact that the new recycle proc rate is 90% WITH gear. Beret increases recycle proc rate quite substantially. If they nerf it completely, then the recycle update will be somewhat meaningless, dropping the proc rate back down to around 60%. It basically needs to be "the best" head piece so we can benefit from the recycle procs; I think these JP posters are forgetting how much the beret increases recycle procs. Thus, their argument still makes zero sense to me.

Yeah, I fail to see how the beret is any different from any other "must have" piece of gear out there. Especially when it's something everyone has access to. I love when people post about non-issues on the official forums... and get a response from Devs.

RNG has a ton of "must have" pieces anyway... Sylvan legs +2? You'd have to be crazy not to use these in EVERY tp build. Sylvan caban +2? You'd have to be crazy not to use this in EVERY tp build and almost EVERY WS build (this body is even more ridiculous than the beret). There are basically 2 different pieces of equipment for the other slots, e.g. sylvan back vs terebellum, scout's feet vs gules, rajas is pretty much mandatory, etc. So yeah, I don't understand their argument at all. Maybe they should look at their pants every now and then.

For the record, the two quoted JP people in the dev post said the following:

First quoted person (Acerola), basically said something along the lines of,

"So that means Scout's Beret +2 will become pretty useful, huh?" (Sounds like looking forward to it

The second person, Sclud, did ask if it was intentional, but clarified that he was asking because he didn't want to invest in the Scout's Beret +2 just to have it get nuked right after he finished getting it.

Really the way people are reacting to this tells me more about you than it does about JP players, as dumb as their playing style might be at times (macc swords gogo). Worst you can accuse them of is not already knowing that Scout's Beret +2 is good. I'm baffled why people thought they were asking for a nerf instead of the more obvious answer that they're just as cynical about SE nerfing everything in the game as we are.

It probably comes more from Slycer's choice in wording the post. Though I agree with Helel (shocker!!), the beret is basically mandatory as is. And even if it does get nerfed down to 5-10%, the augment is still gonna make it damn near mandatory since the Recycle rates will likely still be higher than now.

And to reach 90%, I'm sure you'd have to be using some trashier gears unless they have a lot of nice gear with Recycle+5(or more) planned. There's really only four pieces with it currently. Not much use for Entois Trousers because of AF3+2 or the gun because of Relic/Empy. Libeccio and beret are about it atm in terms of "Has Recycle" and "Is usable."

Store TP +10 per merrit is effectively the same thing as TP+1 per merrit.

Only if you're getting 10TP per hit.

Store TP+10 on a 15TP shot would give you 1.5TP (7.5TP total for 5/5), whereas 1TP per merit would give you 5TP.


Unless I've totally misunderstood how STP works for the past few years.

You didn't, you're both right actually since Damon only said 1 tp per hit is 10 STP and you clarified that 15 STP would be 1.5tp but you would only see 1 extra tp for every other hit since you'd have the .5 adding on the other shots which gives you the 2.5 extra tp.


Think I said that last part right lol it's easier understood/caculated than explained.

It's 1tp/level. Every weapon I have cause to use on RNG (Box/Xbow/Gun) gives +5tp. If it was StoreTP+XX each weapon would get different boosts.
It is also not the same effect as Ikishoten for SAM. The TP is added AFTER StoreTP is calculated.

Store TP isn't a % it's a flat rate store TP +10 is 1 TP per hit store TP +15 is 1.5 TP per hit, I have +51 STP on sam, I do not get +51% per hit I get 5.1 tp a hit