[Dev1188] Job Points System

All nifty things for sure, but my big hope is +range. 0.2' per point, caps at 6.0', it'd allow us to indi-debuff and be out of most AoE range, and with SP2, there'd be at least SOME use to it to be able to indi-debuff and be out of range of all AoE.

Doubt they'll add JAs to this system, but if they do, I'd love to see a JA that blows up the loupan ala Radial Arcana, and grants whatever buff/debuff it was to surrounding players/enemies for 3 minutes. That'd really be a step in the right direction for the job. Debuffs added to Concentric Pulse aligned to the element of the Loupan would be cool too.

its very true pups dont get invited because ppl dont understand it, one rerasons i was gonna quit because people only care about brd/whm/rng/pld/mnk to the new end game crap

PUP IS a great DD job, period.

Oh tell me more about that !

lol elitism in this era of XI? Cute.

id say the last update awoke all the elitists from FFXI slumber... at least on leviathan.

people just dont want to accept an alt way of doing things. they dont even want to try lol. its the Skill of the player that fails not the job. give and take the roles of said job, obviously brd isnt gonna be a great tank DD'er lol.

you can win any content with any job based solely on the fact you can win any content with less members than the bc allows(sans eald and kam vds)

that doesn't make the job a good choice for the content, there are countless cases where pup is just a waste of space

it's not the fault of the players that bringing a pup to a rng event cuts damage by over 40% vs another rng, or that bringing a pup to a melee event costs 20-30% vs another dd barring kenkoken.. if the content is hard enough you're going to struggle winning, you want to bring the job that will give you the best chance of doing so

Inb4 "you don't have that job, you don't understand".

Inb4 job point parties don't want you unless you've got RME.

Cmon SE, if you want my money make this content worthy of doing meripo again.

Make your own party and try it yourself then.

It's how I got Blue Mage accepted in my old HNMLS when everyone was sucking SAM phallus.

Now Blue Mage is master race.

/THF cannonball build so OP!

For what it's worth, PUP/NIN with Oats is legitimately good as a DD on AAs up to Difficult if you're using a main tank (VD is a a bit of a stretch just due to the much more stringent acc requirements).

Ventriloquy (1min timer) lets the master dump hate to the puppet, which can be wiped completely by deactivate/activate. If your PUP has good gear, it's got plenty of DD as well with virtually zero risk for a nice smooth fight. I regularly go PLD WHM BRD PUP DRG (again, good DD and able to shed hate well) and a random 6th with no issue. I'm competitive on damage with the master alone, and the group gets some extra utility from the puppet (I tend to use WHM puppet, which casts near instant -na on the tank, hastes, does some curebombing to support the WHM)

A good relic RNG is indeed the king of AA DDs. But not everyone constantly has competent relic RNGs around, and PUP is quite good as a next choice. I'd rather bring it to AAs than my RNG (no relic but otherwise good gear), Oat MNK or THF, all of which I've also used.

OK, public service announcement derail over. And realize that while I like PUP a lot, I'm also not one of these intolerable "unique snowflakes" trying to make the job fit in places it just doesn't work so well. I absolutely don't think it's good in all content, for instance Delve or anything Zerg (say, ADL). But I'll speak up when there's somewhere it works well, and in current content it's quite good for AAs and Skirmish, as well as being fantastic for solo stuff.

I'm all down for trying new stuff, I go run fencer to everything we're comfortable enough to win with it, I don't try to sell it saying run is a GREAT DD/TANK/W/E.


If you want I can make it sounds like run is the best AA job for both setup dd/nin or rng but I won't cause it would be just theorycraft and not really working in practice.

I burn my job in aby to 99 in one da and play it at 99 for a month, you level it over the course of a month, at the end of that month who is the better player?

To use to your Law book example, a closer-fitting example would be: We both receive the same legal textbook and will both be taking the test at the end of the month. Lets say the book has 30 chapters, you're only allowed to read up to the chapter of the day it is, so you can't read chapter 27 till day 27.

PUP is a sh!t DD, but it has access to some tricks that allow it to do things other DD's can't. Winning in FFXI is about finding the loopholes the battle designer didn't think about and exploiting those to maximum effect. Sometimes it's about layering insane amounts of buffs on DD's while abusing stun mechanics, other times it's about spamming temp items, and some times it's about simply staying out of range and dumping enmity onto a PLD who can survive.

Whenever SE's battle designer builds a fight, he is looking for ways to force us to fail over and over again to artificially extend the duration of the content. He walks a tight line because if he's overly abusive we just don't do the content and it makes Japanese Gaming news (AV/PW are prime examples of this) as it's considered horribly game design. If he doesn't put enough cheap shots in it then we'll end up steamrolling it. So he's gotta equip the fights with just enough cheating boss's and cheap shots to force us to use restrictive exploitative strategies while not making the fight nearly impossible.

With all of that in mind, what unique ability does PUP offer that allows us to exploit or bypass the cheats that SE's battle designer gave his pets?

F*** NO!

SE please give dual wield jobs triple/quad attack% rate points pretty please :3

Only job I could see getting anything like quad as "native" ability would possibly be blu...if you use all spell points on totally useless spells...lol. But seriously i don't see native QA on any job without it coming from gear, and thf already has TA merits.

Magic mor...never mind.

No... just no.

That doesn't mean that any shitty BRD can do the job but it is definitely not the hardest job to play.

allow drks to break the haste cap

What in your opinion is?

I would say hardest job to play if done right on backline jobs is kind of a toss up between SCH RDM and WHM.

Hardest solo would be and this is just my opinion RDM solo tons of buffs to keep up and debuffs to manage all while dodging what you can and swapping into MDT PDT Tp/Ws whatever.

Outside of going above and beyond with gear swapping, just focusing on playing the job correctly, my vote would be Whm for backlines and Dnc for frontline. Dnc always feels like like you're having to make split second decisions if you should burn your TP to heal someone or not, plus having to juggle FMs and Steps.

i did, and won perfectly fine on it. in fact helped out the party more saving whm some mp and kept us alive longer as i DD.

your ***Dmg, pup is GREAT. brd is a ***DD rune rune is even rng is not as efficent or constant.

dont need Oats, WKR weapon can do good DD as well. oats is better but WKR is perfectly fine

My vote is sch especially if you are utilizing the full potential of light and dark arts at the same time and not just sitting in your stun set/on stun duty. Stratedgem(spelling?) management can become a *** if constantly swapping arts.

Also, it depends on whether or not we include spellcast. Because SCH gear swapping without spellcast is also a ***. I haven't used spellcast on sch since i started playing it on release. I just personally preferred using in game macros to do it, made the job feel more interactive to me. That being said, I used all 10 macro sets in the book, with macros inside sets that swapped to other sets for me, etc etc. Since I've started playing again, I've been using spellcast on run and geo, and if i ever do feel like gearing the pain in the *** that is sch again, I will probably spellcast it. Far to lazy to remake allllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll those macroes again.

Also 5/5 Focalization merits or go home! :P

#focalization > all

Edit: (Because making a third post is lame)
My predictions for sch job points:

1. Stratedgem recast- (after a certain amount of levels give you another charge)
2. Something to do with Libra to make it useful
3. Enhances Tabula Rasa or Enhances Kaustra / Enhances Embrava
- the enhances tabula rasa could increase the bonus to regens and helix while tabula rasa is active. the enhances embrava and kaustra could just increase their effects, or better yet, their duration.
4. Enhances Sublimation
5. Enhances Modus Veritas accuracy (maybe it will actually land now >.>)
6. Enhances Perpetuance / Immanence

Then why not just continue to make your own pt and do it your way, instead of wanting others to make pt your way?

Everyone do events in different way, some choose to do events using certain setup because they find their setup most comfortable or less risky. Even if certain setup works, others in the pt may be skeptical/uncomfortable and IF anything goes wrong, it's always leaders to blame.

I often use RNG setup for AA D/VD, because it's the setup with least risk to go wrong with more room for human error. I CAN use melee setup or even take jobs like PUP, but even if I accept a PUP, others may feel uncomfortable because PUP is new, and if the run fails 100% of the time they'd blame me for using PUP over RNG, while PUP or other melee job blame me for inviting a shitty WHM that can't keep them alive. Further more, because they feel uncomfortable, they may ended up having worse performance than usual because there's no trust in the team.

Making a run, is more than just "hey look, this setup should work fine, if you can't do it with this setup you sucked and you're ignorant about the job". You get party morale to manage, you get responsibility to deal with. I've been making my own event for years, the hardest part of making an event, IMO, is not dealing with gimps nor people who can't play, but dealing with people thinking their way is the best, and have no trust in the team because the leader do it different way. It's often the No.1 reason why a run goes ***even with good players.

If you think PUP is great, that's perfectly fine. Make your own party, take your own responsibility as a leader. But don't blame others for not doing the event your way. They don't need to take the responsibility of the result, just because you want the party setup to be what you want. It's their run, not yours.

If you only sing and afk, it's probably the easiest. If you're doing singing AND cure/support or even main healing, it's probably not much harder than WHM. It's just that bad WHM is more noticeable because WHM is almost always the main healer, BRD almost never main heal in anything serious, unless WHM d/c or died.