The Beast Within -- A Guide To Blue Mage

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The Beast Within -- A Guide to Blue Mage
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By FaeQueenCory 2014-11-26 08:05:46
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Doesn't Exenterator already copy ƒTP across all hits, Prothescar?
Cause it's a merit WS.

These "increase the power of one-handed weapons"... Do they not realize that they super boost DW with these?? L0L
This is gonna be crazy depending on how high things get.

And you think the first category is ƒTP for 1000 and not a further increase in statmods?
Cause CDC has static ƒTP across the board, so... Wouldn't it wind up in the second category too if the first was ƒTP at 1000?
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By Valefor.Prothescar 2014-11-26 08:19:47
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what's the sinker drill and CDC averages? rough melee attack average?

to get a rough idea of your damage output over time with different melee/spell scenarios, take a certain period of time (30-45 seconds works for CP mobs). Add together the number of melee attacks you'll do in that period of time, then take your gearset's avg multiattack rate, multiply your average melee attack damage by that, and multiply it by the number of melee attacks over that period of time.

Next, take your TP generation and find out how many melee rounds it will take you, on average, to reach 1000TP. You need multiattack rate, hitrate, and attack speed for this. Divide your total number of melee attacks in x minutes and divide it by your melee rounds to 1000TP. You now have # of WSs in x time. Multiply average WS damage by this number.

You now have the rough average amount of damage you'll do over x number of seconds in combat if you add together melee damage and weaponskill damage.


For spells... take the time you're using (30s, 45s, whatever) and logically remove the total number of seconds you'll use casting. Sinker Drill has a 6s recast or something with haste and stuff. So in a 45 second timeframe, you can cast it 7 times, leaving you with 3 seconds. Multiply your average sinker drill damage by this number. You have the amount of damage you'll do with Sinker Drill over that period of time if you use it on cooldown.

Now... you need to remove damage from your melee and weaponskill damage outputs if you want this to be fair. You can't melee/WS and cast at the same time. Every time you cast, you impose a 3 second delay upon yourself in addition to casting time. For sinker drill, it's about 3.3 seconds. So every time you cast sinker drill, you can't weaponskill or melee attack for 3.3 seconds. If you cast 7 times, you lose 23.1 seconds to delay, leaving 21.9 seconds to melee and weaponskill, around 51% of the time. Just multiply your melee/ws damage by .51 and call it a day. Add it to spell damage. Is the spell damage + adjusted melee/ws number higher than just melee/ws number? If yes, then sinker drill to your heart's content. If no, stop it.

Sorry I can't really do anything else for you here besides telling you how to do a rough approximation, it's all based on your own damage output. I get the feeling that spamming spells is dumb though unless you're in a low buff situation, and thanks to Erratic Flutter there really aren't low buff situations. A truncated way of doing this is looking at your DPS, then look at the DPS of spamming Sinker Drill on a similar target. Compare and contrast.




FaeQueenCory said: »
Doesn't Exenterator already copy ƒTP across all hits, Prothescar?
Cause it's a merit WS.

No. Not all merit WSs transfer, Exenterator is one that doesn't.




FaeQueenCory said: »
Cause CDC has static ƒTP across the board, so... Wouldn't it wind up in the second category too if the first was ƒTP at 1000?

no, because the fTP "potency" boost and the TP Bonus boost are separate things. TP bonus for CDC would be crit rate.
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By Cerberus.Doctorugh 2014-11-26 08:43:31
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Valefor.Prothescar said: »
with this? CA/EFF only spells. removing from WS frequency and TP phase damage to toss out a 3k sinker drill is going to be enormously detractant to overall DPS if this fTP transfer thing happens

spell delay removes 1-3 melee rounds every time you cast a spell.


Works well to 2HR sinker drill spam on Tojil/Shark piercing weak and Bee esp first 50%

Without CA/Efflux you are getting 10k on weakness

On really weak mobs (die in one WS), casting has the advantage of slight distance and no "engage/draw weapon" time.
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By Valefor.Prothescar 2014-11-26 08:49:03
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no reason to discuss those types of mobs though, doesn't matter what you do since they die in an inconsequential amount of time regardless (and it's probably better to be AoEing them anyway). As for tojil/dakuwaqa/muyingwa, yeah I guess. but those die so quickly no matter what you do to them that the exception isn't really a defining rule for using blue magic in combat. for things like she brought up (CP mobs), i'm willing to bet that casting constantly is a dps loss.
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By Asura.Highwynn 2014-11-26 09:35:22
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Nectarious Deluge could be decent as a non-conal aoe water nuke like a charged whisker but adds a potent 20-30/tick poison. Molting Plumage seems like another Wind Breath, but it could potentially have an dispel effect like Tulfaire's version. Sweeping Gouge seems redundant, like a Paralyzing Triad-1, but given it has a 2min recast, it could be extremely potent or maybe auto-crit(compared to Sinker Drill which is a potent spell with like a 20s recast). The aoe drain sounds worthless but probably is pretty potent, would be cool if it had a drain2 effect and buffed max hp.

These spells likely will have interesting traits however. I think the traits that have yet to be covered for 1 slot are what, auto regen, auto refresh, store tp, counter, dual wield(besides the crappy ones like rapid shot and killers).
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By Sylph.Oraen 2014-11-26 12:51:53
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I would be incredibly thankful if we finally received a new DW spell, even if our max rank only stayed at 3. I find it ridiculous that we need to set two haste spells in order to smack things with two weapons efficiently.

Also, when it comes to the proposed changes to CDC, I am so excited. A lot of people underestimate just how strong BLU is even now, and I could see this catapulting the job into ridiculous new territory.
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By Lyncath 2014-11-26 13:00:50
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Get the feeling that at least one of those spells is going to be used in the Dual Wield trait, be nice to take Animating Wail and Mortal Ray off...
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By Sylph.Hyunkyl 2014-11-26 13:21:09
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If I get a good price on it, any use of Vell. Mantle +1 ? Didn't chose Haverton ring from SoA and don't have Shetal belt yet...
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By Sylph.Oraen 2014-11-26 13:23:04
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Sylph.Hyunkyl said: »
If I get a good price on it, any use of Vell. Mantle +1 ? Didn't chose Haverton ring from SoA and don't have Shetal belt yet...

Feel free to buy it...but you can't wear it on BLU. It would probably look good in your mog safe though =p
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By Sylph.Hyunkyl 2014-11-26 20:42:38
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Posting when tired never wins XD
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By Asura.Sabishii 2014-11-26 22:43:58
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Just an FYI for hunting spells, a hydra in nyzul isle used polar bulwark, my friend killed the hydra, it displayed "Learned Polar Bulwark", and the spell in the list is Pyric Bulwark.
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By Asura.Vinedrius 2014-11-27 03:55:02
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Valefor.Sapphire said: »
what is optimal dps if you have unlimited mp? Is there a spell spamming rotation that beats mixed melee+CA+WS?

I've done cp party with a few BLUs (i'm on cor and havent played blu in long time) and noticed they only start to parse well if the whm props up their mp pool with devotion,etc.
I think we got the BLU buffed up to 19/tick refresh messing around with buffs+refresh sphere+moogle+evoker roll+geo etc.

Maybe these blu are bad and they are terrible at mp management or something, this is for Dho/Woh targets. Should they not be spamming sinker drill or what?

Even only with haste2 on me while solo, I find the tp charging up so fast that (also considering your melee acc with tp gear would be more than likely better than that of with your blue magic gear), I feel like I would simply waste so much dps by spamming sinking drill.

Another issue is that, when I solo SC, my tp usually jumps to like 600~ tp post-WS with some additional hits inbetween animations before I close the SC with a spell and I imagine I would even be able to reach 1000 tp in a buffed party, if not at least much closer to. I am wondering if I am just wasting time to solo SC while I could simply wait to WS in the next few rounds (mostly likely 2 or even 1 with some multihit luck), unless the mob is weak to piercing for quad/sinker/amorphic or slashing(?) for trashing.
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By Valefor.Prothescar 2014-11-27 05:11:06
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I'm actually wanting to math out if Efflux/CA spells are even worth doing in the longrun. They impose even more delay than a non-JA spell for minimal benefit.

never got around to testing thrashing's damage type, you can go hit some ASA mobs with it and see which one takes damage to find it.
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By Ragnarok.Luloo 2014-11-27 06:22:15
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Prolly like talked before, an up date realmrazer set? Same as requiescat switching element of neck/belt? Also best augments on alluvion club being what? Store tp and acc? Thx in advance :3
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By Sylph.Hyunkyl 2014-11-27 07:21:26
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Around page 102-108 if my memory ain't too bad, if not ask the Doc :P
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By Leviathan.Stamos 2014-11-27 09:55:11
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Thrashing Assault is slashing. Does well on Tree
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By Asura.Highwynn 2014-11-27 11:55:25
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Due to Gouge's long recast, it could potentially be quite powerful or have a high stick rate of defense down. Sinker drill is our strongest spell but its a 20s recast, rail cannon is also quite powerful and has a 2min recast. Sweeping Gouge may be like autocrit spell or maybe has lv3 light properties, 120s is unusually long for a spell, though with haste gear and spell its probably shorter. But it seems like it might just be an empty thrash/benthic typhoon upgrade, cone damage+defense down(without magic def down).
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By Ragnarok.Luloo 2014-11-28 10:40:05
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Finally obtained a Nehushtan with Att+8 and Crit hit rate+3%, im wondering if it's good and what is better to sub, Bura or maybe another club? Was thinking about a Gabaxorea path B. What you think? T!
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By Siren.Kyte 2014-11-28 12:33:01
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Those aren't really the best augments for a Realmrazer-type setup, no. Ideally, you want things that increase WS rate, such as STP and DA.


For your offhand, you'll want either another Nehushtan or Bura. Which is is superior will depend on how much STP you have (i.e. does the extra delay improve your hit build?), whether or not you are getting Haste Samba (can you drop a tier of DW to improve your hit build?), and whether or not the enemy is weak to blunt damage. Gabaxorea path B is ehhh- the only Gabaxorea that is particularly worthwhile for BLU is A for nuking/Flash Nova.

I would suggest perhaps waiting until after the update before spending too much money/frustration on this, as CDC may be gaining more than Realmrazer.
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By Cerberus.Doctorugh 2014-11-28 16:30:42
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Valefor.Prothescar said: »
I'm actually wanting to math out if Efflux/CA spells are even worth doing in the longrun. They impose even more delay than a non-JA spell for minimal benefit.

never got around to testing thrashing's damage type, you can go hit some ASA mobs with it and see which one takes damage to find it.

For a round about answer, at the moment it is (barely) better to use Sinker Drill when its up (no ca/eff). Normal Sinkers hit for 3.5k, when your melee DPS in comparison is going to hover around 1k.

Im not going to bother running up a whole set of numbers showing this with the next update that will throw this out the window .
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By Asura.Vinedrius 2014-11-28 18:02:55
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Does Augury cuisses +1 (with capped unity bonus) replace the iuitl tights +1 (without DA augment) in the first tp set?
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By Sylph.Oraen 2014-11-29 05:40:09
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Asura.Vinedrius said: »
Does Augury cuisses +1 (with capped unity bonus) replace the iuitl tights +1 (without DA augment) in the first tp set?

Without 1 DA or 2 crit, Augury at max rank will win. However, last I checked, even 1 DA will make Iuitl superior due to the STP. I'll check in the morning.
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By FaeQueenCory 2014-11-29 07:56:43
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Valefor.Prothescar said: »
FaeQueenCory said: »
Doesn't Exenterator already copy ƒTP across all hits, Prothescar?
Cause it's a merit WS.
No. Not all merit WSs transfer, Exenterator is one that doesn't.

FaeQueenCory said: »
Cause CDC has static ƒTP across the board, so... Wouldn't it wind up in the second category too if the first was ƒTP at 1000?
no, because the fTP "potency" boost and the TP Bonus boost are separate things. TP bonus for CDC would be crit rate.
Ah, my mistake. I was under the assumption that all MeritWSs have their ƒTP coppied across the board. That they all lack an a (when that was a thing) and they coppied ƒTP.

Ah! That's what was meant. Dur.
Though I still think "potency" means a mod adjustment again. That's what they said last time. (ƒTP levels changing was "attack bonuses".)
So maybe CDC and Rudra's will go over 100% mods? (80% current)
Either way, those are two WSs that didn't NEED a buff... But I ain't complaining! (CDC getting +potency +crit% AND ƒTP copied to all hits??? Jesus. Christ. That is gonna be craycray.)
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By Valefor.Prothescar 2014-12-01 15:31:30
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Quote:
As Molting Plumage will deal a considerable amount of damage in a fan-shaped AoE, we have not added the dispel or knockback effect as an additional effect. Considering how powerful this blue magic will be for blue mage, if we were to add the dispel effect it would become too strong compared to other blue magic.

Still unlikely to be worth 5-6 points and a slot, but may be fun to MB with.
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By Odin.Jassik 2014-12-01 15:38:19
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Valefor.Prothescar said: »
Quote:
As Molting Plumage will deal a considerable amount of damage in a fan-shaped AoE, we have not added the dispel or knockback effect as an additional effect. Considering how powerful this blue magic will be for blue mage, if we were to add the dispel effect it would become too strong compared to other blue magic.

Still unlikely to be worth 5-6 points and a slot, but may be fun to MB with.


I think it's a shining example of why SE needs to rethink giving mobs tp moves that are too powerful to give to players. They dull them down so far they're near useless and end up being nothing more than filler spells to learn. I wish they'd replace animating wail with a useful spell for dw3.
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By Valefor.Prothescar 2014-12-01 15:39:58
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I mean, Molting Plumage isn't very strong on the BST pet or the actual monster, so what they've done is buffed the damage and removed the extra effects. Tbh it's not like we're lacking for dispels as it is. Personally I'm more upset that we aren't getting Pentapeck.
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By Valefor.Sehachan 2014-12-01 15:52:01
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Pentapeck is one of the best ability names ever.
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By Ragnarok.Sekundes 2014-12-01 16:00:14
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Odin.Jassik said: »
I wish they'd replace animating wail with a useful spell for dw3.
This so much...
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By Ragnarok.Sekundes 2014-12-01 16:06:54
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Valefor.Prothescar said: »
I mean, Molting Plumage isn't very strong on the BST pet or the actual monster, so what they've done is buffed the damage and removed the extra effects. Tbh it's not like we're lacking for dispels as it is. Personally I'm more upset that we aren't getting Pentapeck.
I prefer my dispels to be fast casting, recasting and cheap on points and mp. I just wonder why they are so scared to give blu some decent magical spells. Most of them are terrible.
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By Sylph.Oraen 2014-12-01 16:51:23
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I think SE is scared of giving us powerful magical spells due to balance issues. BLU is already an exceptionally strong physical DD that also lends a potent support role. Adding magical nukes to that might be problematic.

Granted, this is also the same company that gave COR an A in parrying and crap weapon ranks and continues to make us set two haste spells for DW3, so they could also just be pants-on-head HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE.
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