The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim

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The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim
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 Phoenix.Ingraham
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By Phoenix.Ingraham 2010-12-12 18:04:59
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I just realized this game isn't running on Gamebyro.

Yes.

To hype up people more about Skyrim, here's a summary of the region.

I still stand by saying Oblivion was incredibly uninspired, but then I remember Shivering Isles, which was an awesome representation of TES' true nature of being generally messed up as hell. Hopefully they'll follow up with what they did there and portray Skyrim decently.

tl;dr: Skyrim has a very bloody history. EXPECT SNOW AND BLOOOOOD.
 Odin.Zicdeh
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By Odin.Zicdeh 2010-12-12 18:07:24
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Phoenix.Ingraham said:
I just realized this game isn't running on Gamebyro.

Yes.

To hype up people more about Skyrim, here's a summary of the region.

I still stand by saying Oblivion being incredibly uninspired, but then I remember Shivering Isles, which was an awesome representation of TES' true nature of being generally messed up as hell. Hopefully they'll follow up with what they did there and portray Skyrim accurately.

tl;dr: SNOW AND BLOOD. SNOW AND BLOOD.

From what I've read (All rumors, but still) Bethesda is using an in-house developed Engine. If that is true, it's amazing, because it means they tailor-made the engine to suit their specific needs, instead of relying on an inadequate engine by default.

Also, I totally have to agree with how uninspired Oblivion felt. I use that word cautiously, because it was a great game still, but it came out way too cookie-cutter for me in the end. I'd have to sum Oblivion up in the phrase "As good as average gets", since it didn't have anything truly phenomenal about it, like Morrowind did, nor create any real precedents for gaming.
 Asura.Matzilla
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By Asura.Matzilla 2010-12-12 18:23:25
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I also thoroughly enjoyed bloodmoon/tribunal, played that game for so long.. every time i got bored of a new one i'd go back to playing morrowind, reroll on a different class/race and have fun levitating and telekinesis stealing stuff, smacking the heart of a god with SUNDER AND THAT DAGGER THING, that game was just so *** awesome

oblivion had a lot of random gore lol in those fire dimensions everywhere you looked was a dismembered body or someone hanging from the ceiling
 Phoenix.Ingraham
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By Phoenix.Ingraham 2010-12-12 18:27:50
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I gotta stop editting myself so much...

But yeah, I'm gonna be optimistic about this though after all. Bethesda doesn't exactly have a perfect track record, but every title and expansion they've released has been a direct response to the complaints of the original (Battlespire to Daggerfall, Shivering Isles to Oblivion, NV to FO3, and NV being the pinnacle of Gamebyro in general etc.).

One thing I'm gonna admit for sure, is battle improvement over the ages. They may "dumb down" (mo' like streamlinin' amirite) and simplify the games as the series goes on, but things like Alchemy and combat become more tolerable over time. That, and murdering the Adoring Fan is hilarious.
 Odin.Zicdeh
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By Odin.Zicdeh 2010-12-13 09:19:50
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Just a Follow-up to my previous post about a possible "Rumor" that Skyrim won't be using the tired, old Gamebryo Engine. It is now officially confirmed that Bethesda has created a custom engine for Skyrim.

Huzzah!

It's pretty big news for every fan of the Elder Scrolls game series, as Bethesda has used an incarnation or direct iteration of Gamebryo since Morrowind (NetImmerse). This is their first custom-engine build since Daggerfall.
 Shiva.Flionheart
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By Shiva.Flionheart 2010-12-13 09:22:02
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I saw that news too, I'm incredibly chuffed seeing as the Gamebryo engine is awful... hilarious at times but awful.

I popped in Oblivion a few days ago to get in the mood, and I lol'd so much at the dialogue between the guards and civilians.

Guard: Good day
Civilian: Hello
Guard: Mudcrabs are horrible creatures
Civilian: Mudcrabs are horrible creatures
Guard: I don't want to talk right now
Civilain: Goodbye
Guard: Goodbye
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 Odin.Zicdeh
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By Odin.Zicdeh 2010-12-13 11:25:53
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Shiva.Flionheart said:
I saw that news too, I'm incredibly chuffed seeing as the Gamebryo engine is awful... hilarious at times but awful.

I popped in Oblivion a few days ago to get in the mood, and I lol'd so much at the dialogue between the guards and civilians.

Guard: Good day
Civilian: Hello
Guard: Mudcrabs are horrible creatures
Civilian: Mudcrabs are horrible creatures
Guard: I don't want to talk right now
Civilain: Goodbye
Guard: Goodbye


Yah, at least they got Radiant AI a little better in Fallout 3-New Vegas.
 Shiva.Flionheart
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By Shiva.Flionheart 2011-01-03 22:00:02
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I just saw this on Kotaku. Not Skyrim, but a graphical enhancement for Morrowind.

I suggest 720p.

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 Odin.Zicdeh
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By Odin.Zicdeh 2011-01-08 05:44:49
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Our fist look at the actual game.
Just looking at the shots, I am deeply relieved to see a much more inspired take on the scenery. Instead of the Bland "Generic rolling grasslands no.B017" of Oblivion.

 Valefor.Prothescar
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By Valefor.Prothescar 2011-01-08 06:01:18
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Gameinformer "Dragon Language" puzzle, imparts the name of the main villain. Surprisingly annoying to do.

http://www.gameinformer.com/p/skyrimpuzzle.aspx

 Odin.Zicdeh
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By Odin.Zicdeh 2011-01-08 06:07:29
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I want to tell myself to just Preorder it (Collector edition of course) and forget it exists until it shows up on my doorstep, but I know that ain't gonna happen. Much as I'd love to stumble unkowningly into the game, as I did with Morrowind, my insatiable curiosity will keep me up at night.

I just hope Spears are back, one of the screenshots showed the "Enhcant" Skill has returned, so hopes remain high.
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By Valefor.Slipispsycho 2011-01-08 06:25:50
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Damn you! I had forgotten, at least for now, that this game was on it's way. Now it'll take me another month to forget about it.
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 Phoenix.Ingraham
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By Phoenix.Ingraham 2011-01-08 06:33:51
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With scans, we now know that they've dropped the worthless class system in favor of something a little more ambitious.

And Mysticism too, but no biggie, they'll probably break down notable spells from that school into the others. Knowing the series, they'll probably do this with more than just magic (watch them mash Blunt and Blade together into a generic catch-all "Melee" skill).

Then again, we're getting blacksmithing and enchanting among others.


 Shiva.Flionheart
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By Shiva.Flionheart 2011-01-08 13:28:42
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I like the fact they're adding the perk system in place of the old system, and I like the intuitive class system. What I don't particularly like is the fact it seems to have less skills than Oblivion.

Though I'm still looking forward to it, and mega pleased they dropped Gamebryo.
 Odin.Zicdeh
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By Odin.Zicdeh 2011-01-08 14:01:57
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Shiva.Flionheart said:
I like the fact they're adding the perk system in place of the old system, and I like the intuitive class system. What I don't particularly like is the fact it seems to have less skills than Oblivion.

Though I'm still looking forward to it, and mega pleased they dropped Gamebryo.


Many of the skills were kind of redundant, however in the Morrowind -> Oblivion jump, they targeted the wrong skills.

Removing Mysticsim was a good call, the spells are usually very easily placed in other areas.

I saw the enchant skill made a return, so I doubt there really are "Less" skills, as the scans only showed schools of magic, though I don't have access to the main article.


The most important thing right now, is bringing back weapon variety and feel. With 3 weapon types in Oblivion, (4 if you're a little more open minded) every class felt the same. And magic tended to be just a little underwhelming.

Things we need moar

-> Spear (WTF was this removed)
-> Staff as a viable melee weapon
-> Speechcraft and Barter a little more useful, New Vegas did well with the Barter skill (usually called Merchantile in TES)
-> Retooled Armor Properties (One of the redundant skills that should be removed, in Lieu of a balanced pro-con to each armor class, rather than a skill oriented with their use)


Adding a perk system was a good step, I'm glad they were willing to learn and evolve with something that is very well-received in Fallout (Their approach to perks actually is much more similar to the Original Fallout games), instead of letting their stuff stagnate with the same tired Ideas.
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By Alexander.Odaka 2011-01-08 14:06:15
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played the shiiiit out of oblivion, although the AI acted kinda ridiculous at times xD

Odin.Zicdeh said:

Things we need moar

-> Spear (WTF was this removed)
-> Staff as a viable melee weapon
-> Speechcraft and Barter a little more useful, New Vegas did well with the Barter skill (usually called Merchantile in TES)
-> Retooled Armor Properties (One of the redundant skills that should be removed, in Lieu of a balanced pro-con to each armor class, rather than a skill oriented with their use)

i agree with these
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By Enternius 2011-01-08 14:14:47
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In this thread: Apparently Oblivion sucked.
 Shiva.Flionheart
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By Shiva.Flionheart 2011-01-08 14:17:50
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I like the dual wield system being brought in.

Quote:
Firstly, combat: according to a piece in the latest issue of Game Informer, you can now dual-wield weapons in the game. To many it will sound like a cheap take on a Halo/Modern Warfare staple, but where in those shooters it's a part-time indulgence, in Skyrim it forms the cornerstone of your approach to the game, as you can allocate which weapon or tool goes in which hand.

So, for example, you can put a sword in one hand and a dagger in the other. Or two daggers. Or a staff and a shield. Or a shield and a mace. For magic users, a different spell can be cast from each hand, or for a multiplying effect, the same spell can be thrown from both hands.
 Odin.Zicdeh
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By Odin.Zicdeh 2011-01-08 14:52:47
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As long as with Dual Wielding, they also have two-handed weapons still. And Spears goddammit.

My only concern is how they approach the Spell part of this. It sounds way too similar to Fable III's system, but at the same time, it can be interpreted not much different than the original games, since you had to "Equip" your spell anyway. Basically, as long as there's a way to switch spells quickly on-the-fly, it'll work for magic.

And you were right, 18 total skills down from 21 in Oblivion. Kinda lame, but I can probably guess which skills got axed.

Heavy Armor
Light Armor
Mysticism



Possibly more removed if they added some skills. Such as the Return of weapon diversity (Spear, Axe, Blunt, Blade, Marksmanship, Throwing)

Enternius said:
In this thread: Apparently Oblivion sucked.

I think I'm really harsh on Oblivion (Games in general actually) but I don't think Oblivion sucks by any stretch. Had it not followed The greatest *** game of all time as it's successor, it probably would have fared a little better. I've played Oblivion and Morrowind a lot lately, and rather than some pretentious argument like "It was the golden age of PC gaming" I can simply explain why Morrowind was so much better than Oblivion.

Deep, rewarding exploration.

The contrast between Morrowind's world exploration, and the rewards for seeing what lies over the next ridge (Cliff Racers not withstanding) made the game so much more compelling. Combine that with the totally alien feeling of Vvardenfell, and rewards didn't just come from "Sweet loot dawgs" But just seeing the world.

Oblivion on the other hand, looked so, well, bland. The environment was just much less inspired, though I still really like the Alyied Ruins.
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 Sylph.Zenairis
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By Sylph.Zenairis 2011-01-08 15:42:35
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Although this is off topic but I found there was a good many ways to enhance elder scrolls IV especially through modding just hopefully Bethesda will keep it this way. My thanks also goes out to all the modders out there that make this possible.

Edit: This is a fairly older SS that I'm just using as a example.

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By Enternius 2011-01-08 15:51:23
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Odin.Zicdeh said:
I think I'm really harsh on Oblivion (Games in general actually) but I don't think Oblivion sucks by any stretch. Had it not followed The greatest *** game of all time as it's successor, it probably would have fared a little better. I've played Oblivion and Morrowind a lot lately, and rather than some pretentious argument like "It was the golden age of PC gaming" I can simply explain why Morrowind was so much better than Oblivion.

Deep, rewarding exploration.

The contrast between Morrowind's world exploration, and the rewards for seeing what lies over the next ridge (Cliff Racers not withstanding) made the game so much more compelling. Combine that with the totally alien feeling of Vvardenfell, and rewards didn't just come from "Sweet loot dawgs" But just seeing the world.

Oblivion on the other hand, looked so, well, bland. The environment was just much less inspired, though I still really like the Alyied Ruins.
I agree, for the most part, but I don't think Oblivion was bland at all. The reason it was sort of iffy and short, was because it was originally designed for Xbox (Xbox 360 wasn't announced at the time), so most of the game was done for Xbox. Then they added lots of voice overs when Xbox 360 was announced.

Long story short, it's an Xbox game on Xbox 360 more or less. That doesn't make it bad at all, just not as good as it COULD have been. It's still one of my favorite games for this generation, which says a lot because it's barely even part of this generation.
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By Enternius 2011-01-08 15:53:33
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 Odin.Zicdeh
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By Odin.Zicdeh 2011-01-08 16:07:36
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By bland, I mean Generic. The world just doesn't really "Pop" Like Morrowind's did. Meadows, some mountains and a ton of trees. There were a few places of true beauty though, along the Gold Road for example, and Around the Priory Somewhere southwest of Chorrol.

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By Enternius 2011-01-08 16:10:10
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Odin.Zicdeh said:
By bland, I mean Generic. The world just doesn't really "Pop" Like Morrowind's did. Meadows, some mountains and a ton of trees. There were a few places of true beauty though, along the Gold Road for example, and Around the Priory Somewhere southwest of Chorrol.

I feel like a terrible person for insulting Morrowind (Yes, it's my favorite game of all time but that doesn't make it flawless), but how is Morrowind any better? Dead dirt and dead trees, or giant mushrooms.
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By Shiva.Flionheart 2011-01-18 08:07:45
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Technology behind Skyrim

Quote:
Radiant AI

The Radiant AI technology introduced in Oblivion went a long way toward making the NPCs act in realistic ways. If you followed a citizen through his daily activities, you would likely witness him or her eating breakfast, setting out to work the land, stopping by the pub for a pint after work, and then returning home to hit the sack.

In reality, the technology driving NPC behavior wasn't overly sophisticated. Bethesda could only assign five or six types of tasks to the townspeople, and there wasn't a lot of nuance to their actions. In Skyrim, the characters have much more defined individual personalities.

You won't find townspeople loitering aimlessly in town squares anymore. Each denizen performs tasks that make sense in their environment. To impart the towns and cities with a greater sense of life, Bethesda has populated them with mills, farms, and mines that give the NPCs believable tasks to occupy their day. In the forest village we visited during the demo, most of the citizens were hard at work chopping wood, running logs through the mill, and carrying goods through the town.

The improved Radiant AI technology is also more aware of how a citizen should react to your actions. As you perform tasks for them or terrorize them by ransacking their home, the NPCs develop feelings about you. If you're good friends with a particular NPC and barge into his house during the middle of the night, he may offer you lodging rather than demand you leave the premises. “Your friend would let you eat the apple in his house,” Howard says. If you swing your weapon near an NPC, knock items off their dinner table, or try to steal something of value, they'll react with an appropriate level of hostility given their prior relationship to you.

Quote:
Radiant Story

Before they started planning missions for Skyrim, Howard and his team reflected on what they liked about their older projects. They kept returning to the randomized encounters in Fallout 3 and Daggerfall. To build off the success of those models and improve the experience so the random encounters feel less forced or arbitrary, Bethesda undertook the ambitious task of constructing a new story management system dubbed Radiant Story. Many quests are still completely governed by Bethesda, but the Radiant Story system helps randomize and relate the side quests to players to make the experience as dynamic and reactive as possible. Rather than inundate you with a string of unrelated and mundane tasks, it tailors missions based on who your character is, where you're at, what you've done in the past, and what you're currently doing.

“Traditionally in an assassination quest, we would pick someone of interest and have you assassinate them,” Howard says. “Now there is a template for an assassination mission and the game can conditionalize all the roles – where it happens, under what conditions does it take place, who wants someone assassinated, and who they want assassinated. All this can be generated based on where the character is, who he's met. They can conditionalize that someone who you've done a quest for before wants someone assassinated, and the target could be someone with whom you've spent a lot of time before.”

The Radiant Story system also helps deal with untimely deaths. Predicting player behavior in an open world is tough, as many often stray from the main quests and get into trouble by murdering quest givers. In Skyrim, if you kill a shop owner who had a few quests to offer if you spend the time to get to know him, his sister may take over the shop and offer the quest that was formerly ascribed to him. The quest logic automatically picks up with pre-recorded voice work because Bethesda already assigned her that contingency role. Tread lightly though, because she's not oblivious to your dastardly actions. She will still recognize you killed her brother and perhaps even try to exact revenge later in the game.

Radiant Story is also smart enough to know which caves and dungeons you've already visited and thus conditionalize where, for instance, a kidnapped person is being held to direct you toward a specific place you haven't been to before, populated with a specific level of enemy. This helps Bethesda avoid repetition and usher the player into areas the team wants you to explore.

The story manager is always watching you, which can leads to strange random encounters as well. If you drop a sword in the middle of town, someone may pick it up and return it to you, or two guys may get into a fight over who gets to take it. If you're really good at a particular skill, like one-handed weapons or destruction spells, a stranger who knows of your reputation may ask for training, challenge you to a duel, or beg you for a favor that will require you to show off your skill.

Skyrim also tracks your friendships and grudges to generate missions. Do a small favor for a farmer and it may eventually lead to a larger quest. Some NPCs will even agree to be your companion to help you out in specific situations.

Radiant Story doesn't limit these new missions to encounters in towns. Like in Fallout 3 and Red Dead Redemption, a lot of random events occur while you're exploring the wilderness as well. "There are a wide variety of these random encounters," says design director Bruce Nesmith. "Many of them are things the player can interact with, some are not. You might save a priest who then tells you about a dungeon where there are people trapped that need saving. You might run across mammoth beset by a pack of wolves."

Some open world games go overboard with these side activities and stray too far from the main storyline. Bethesda is aware of this pitfall and is actively engaged in preventing the feeling of being overwhelmed by the Radiant Story missions.

Skyrim still has several months of development left, but after seeing the technology in action it looks like Bethesda's on track to set a new high bar for open world role-playing games.
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By Caitsith.Jessie 2011-01-18 09:06:48
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Awesome, that Radiant Story thing looks great and I can't wait to see it in action.

"If you're really good at a particular skill, like one-handed weapons or destruction spells, a stranger who knows of your reputation may ask for training, challenge you to a duel, or beg you for a favor that will require you to show off your skill."
^ That sounds really cool.

It's nice to hear about a game company that takes its criticisms seriously and try to work to fix their problems instead of just saying "It's our game we can do it however we want" or "The game will sell based on the name alone".
 Siren.Enternius
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By Siren.Enternius 2011-01-18 09:11:33
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I did notice they're keeping the easy fast travel system, though. Kind of hurt Oblivion but it's not game-breaking.
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By Caitsith.Jessie 2011-01-18 09:26:33
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I just hope the loading isn't as bad as it was in Oblivion. I'd walk into a bar to talk to a guy and have enough time to get up and make myself a cup of coffee.

Well, lol, okay it wasn't that bad, but it did suck that it happened every time you changed from one area to another. As long as they allow you to install part of the game on your console this time it shouldn't be a problem.
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By Cerberus.Rayik 2011-01-18 10:47:22
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Enternius said:
Odin.Zicdeh said:
By bland, I mean Generic. The world just doesn't really "Pop" Like Morrowind's did. Meadows, some mountains and a ton of trees. There were a few places of true beauty though, along the Gold Road for example, and Around the Priory Somewhere southwest of Chorrol.

I feel like a terrible person for insulting Morrowind (Yes, it's my favorite game of all time but that doesn't make it flawless), but how is Morrowind any better? Dead dirt and dead trees, or giant mushrooms.

I gotta agree here. I loved Morrowind, but the environment was ugly and bland. I though Oblivion's environment was much more immersive, with wind blowing through trees and tall grasses, as opposed to Morrowind's weird shell houses and scorched ground.

I know the "alien-ness" of Morrowind was a big appeal for a lot of people, but it got on my nerves. I'm a fan of traditional sword and sorcery, pseudo-european RPG's, not Chitin-shell axes and riding huge bugs over flat, burned ground.
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By Siren.Enternius 2011-02-04 05:08:30
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Worth the bump? I think so.

First half is the official Skyrim theme, second half is a taste of the ambient music in the game. As awesome as the theme is, the ambient music got me really pumped for this game for some reason.
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