Corsair Job Adjustments - Answers To User Suggest.

Dice can come from other places like Campaign Battles.

I find it weird though that the new dice added were not included in gold chests.

I think dice are ok the way they are, but I understand where you're coming from. Actually, we could combine two awesome ideas here. Make an accessory that lowers the range of our rolls and make it a reward for that quest.~


I found this odd as well.

2 of them from an ANNM. And no one ever *** does ANNM.

Edit: No wonder nobody does them. Level caps are soooo 2003 lol.

Tbh I really like how it works now, RNG is better physical ranged attacker in general, but COR is better magical ranged attacker(higher dmg from WF/QD, and able to gain TP without physically TP on the mob via regain/QD). So if you want pure physical ranged attack dmg, get RNG. But if you're dealing with mobs that invincible/perfect dodge a lot, or just have high eva/def in general, then COR is extremely good at dealing dmg in such situation. It's unique and different from other DD jobs, not just a RNG -1, and I like how it works.




I know, I was just saying the /ra part, I don't think ranged attack/acc set is needed on COR nowadays due to the way COR gains TP and how inefficient it is, especially after recent No.11 update.(In Abyssea vulcan's staff is also better than joytoy IMO, joy only wins Nyzul/Einherjar where slug is stronger WS, or zerging with a BRD)

After recent No.11 update, the more you roll the more chance you'll hit a No.11, after you hit a No.11 you literally can do a serious of No.11 chain for rest of the rolls. Instead of spending 8 sec waiting for the gun to fire in VWNM for small amount of DPS(and probably see it miss if you're fighting the higher eva ones anyways), may as well just contribute the pt in other ways.

I don't really think marksmanship is a big problem to solve atm, since we can contribute to the pt in other ways, magical dmg isn't affected by marksmanship, and COR can do something else if not shooting. If they want to fix marksmanship, they probably have to fix how ranged attack work in this game entirely, which is more than just give better bullets and offensive JA/JT from RNG.

this.

yes dice cost less than buying all your blm spells, but with spells you have options, where a large portion of them can be quested/farmed for. which means, that if you're patient enough, you can get all your blm spells for much less than you can cor die.

Along w/ support, this is essentially what I was saying.


His argument about wanting quests with stories was valid. But the money argument isn't. I maintain that we should be happy with the way it is and something like Tactician's Roll isn't like R3 that all on its lonesome costs 1M+.

You mean the effect of "Recycle"?
http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Recycle





While it would be great to give this to COR, we do have some means to access it. Though a JA or Roll that temporarily gave it to us would be great.
Also, while I agree that bullets are expensive, SE has already given CORs a means to get passed this: Our Weapon Skills. Slug shot is dependent on gun and bullet damage but Leaden Salute and Wildfire, both equal-to/better-than slug shot on mobs that don't resist magic, deal magic damage that is fairly potent and aren't dependent on bullet or gun damage. So to get passed this you could always just use the cheap low level bullets if your wallet was hurting. I'm not saying that our guns are epic and we don't need some adjustments, but there are ways players can get around it in the meantime.

It's gonna be a dark day when I use a roll intended to save me a bit of gil on bullets over something that actually enhances either my damage output or my party's survivability.

If they were to waste a new roll on recycle, I would be very upset.

cause you know, they haven't already wasted rolls on much less-useful buffs like "Choral roll - Spell interruption", "Courser's roll - Snapshot", or "Allies roll - skillchain acc/damage"

While I agree that I personally wouldn't use it over something that enhances my party, I didn't specify solely a roll. I said "JA or Roll" in that It'd be more practical and hopeful for a JA, but SE would probably just troll us with a roll. besides, if you're solo skilling up, it might be semi-situational to use along with a ranged acc roll to cap off marksmanship from 90-95. It wouldn't have a place in a typical party situation, but if you gather all the CORs and RNGs in the same pt and have more than 2 rolls to give (2 CORs = 4 rolls) depending on the potency of it, it could be usable.

In the event you're shooting for TP, Courser's could be good. Allies Roll is good for brewing.

A job trait recycle wouldn't be bad, but it's hardly my first choice for any addition.

Could be useful in a rng and cor party. But those heady days of lining up all your ranged attacks in Sky and letting lose are long gone and unlikely to return.

It's not horrible in concept. But I just can't see it as being worth using in this day and age.

off topic, but these are better

@Cerberus.Irohuro
ah yeah, I forgot those existed lol, and they would be much better if they both have the same proc rate.

@Bismarck.Ramyrez
I haven't used Courser's like.. ever lol, since I have an Armageddon and a 4-hit on cor/sam I'm able to WS with such a frequency that it is more practical for me to full-time my WS buffs (Regain+MAB) because of recast timers. And in response to the ranged DD parties, I miss those so much. :/ A Recycle roll would probably not be very useful, or even have a place with some CORs depending on playstyle, but I'd still like to see a JA added. (reason I say JA and not job-trait is that even RNG don't get it without meriting it)

edit: I didn't actually think of using Allies roll for brewing, might actually be worth using in that situation D: but with that (brewing) you're probably using that roll about as often as you'd use a recylce roll, rarely if ever :x lol

I never shoot much either. But what I'm saying to you is that if you're arguing a situation where a Recycle roll would be useful, you're actually arguing for a situation where courser's would be even more useful.

I, too, am Armageddon it on. (...couldn't resist.) Frankly, as easy as it is to get to 85, I can't see any serious corsair NOT getting one. I find myself shooting very little. Which brings me back to my original point:

I don't want to see them waste an addition on a recycle-type bonus.

However, back onto the actual topic:

What Hiku would like to see:

1. Let COR use the RNG-specific marksmanship WSs. (blue procs) Along with a slight boost to marksmanship skill level.
2. If rolls would be added, we still don't have rolls that give us effects such as phalanx, enmity+, enmity-, "occasionally resists negative status effects" or conserve-tp (again, situational). This list isn't based off of what we necessarily -need-, but based on the effects of newer job traits or items that cor don't have access to modify (plenty others on top of this)
3. Let us have possibly more than 2 quick draws as well? or maybe make rolling an 11 reset the quick draw timer or something ridiculous such as that.
4. Maybe an ability that doubles the duration or potency of a roll, but also doubles the duration or potency of a bust effect if a bad roll
5. A job trait for enhanced ranged accuracy or attack
6. Maybe a trait like ninja-tool-expertise or recycle, but for quick-draw cards.


plenty of other ideas but I'm tired and multitasking atm D:

or~! we could noob it up and use both Courser's and Recycle TOGETHER!!!1 D:

Owmybrain.

I'm too old fashioned to know the loop in modern Abyssea based corsairs, but what exactly is it that makes ranged attacks redundant for dealing damage and TP gain exactly?

I'm assuming it is a combination of things like:
Skill cap and gear necessary to hit Voidwatch NMs
High delay shots with guns of almost any type
Lackluster base damage bullets and lack of availability.

What exactly would improve the marksmanship side of corsair enough to make it worth shooting regularly again?

Perhaps I'm far too nostalgic in my memories of Eruca parties where I could sub ranger and go out with guns blazing and a vulcan's staff strapped to my back and still do a decent job at dishing out numbers; though it cost me a fortune.

Upon reflection and acceptance of how Corsair operates now, perhaps it is for the best they take their DD aspect in the same manner as their support aspect goes about. Corsair makes incredible use out their magical based weapon skills such as Leaden Salute and Wildfire. Not to mention TP acquisition is gained on relatively even ground with the TP gained from QD as well as regain roll. All without even giving the mob a single bit of TP aside from the WS itself. Truly a beautiful thing now that I have some retrospect.

I just wish they'd have a little more to show for our marksmanship skill as well as the ranged based gear available for use. Sadly it seems a bit slow and redundant these days when measured with any other DD.

And the fact that you can gain TP without shooting any bullets at all plus you can contribute in the pt by just keep rolling over and over after recent No.11 update(and maybe help cure/-na/raise from it's SJ).

I don't really think fixing marksmanship skill will fix ranged attack. They probably need to rewrite the rule of ranged attack, or at least make NMs that can only be killed with ranged attack to make it worthwhile again IMO.

I've come to terms that Corsair isn't meant to contend with Ranger in terms of damage, or even ranged damage for that matter. My only gripe is having something to show for marksmanship skill in the first place since shooting is seldom used, and the skill only becomes relevant for weapon skills; even then, the best ones are highly based on magic attributes that skill likely won't alter that much if at all.

Unless I'm mistaken; if Quick Draw gives a means of skilling up Marksmanship, perhaps the damage formulation should be reflect upon the skill of marksmanship rather than being strictly based on MAB for damage and AGI/MAC for accuracy.

Of course balance will have to be a major factor. Quick Draw already is quite powerful, and can be used quite frequently. Not to mention it's magical based and gives zero TP to the mob :x
I just wanna see marksmanship become relevant again, either by making shooting awesome again somehow, or have it be part of the formula for what COR does already.

While I can respect your opinion and your mindset on the "old days" of corsair, the fact is that, for the current atmosphere of the game, we don't need (and shouldn't want) more physical damage output in terms of ranged attacks or melee. We do very well with magic damage output with Quick Draw as it is currently calculated and with Armageddon/Wildfire (and even, to some lesser extent if you don’t have Armageddon, Leaden Salute). We have a very significant buffing role (roll! hah.) in the situations in which we are useful. We can still put out respectable numbers with regular ranged attacks, even when compared to ranger. I'd say that when you weigh the damage output we lose vs. a ranger against the buffs we add to ourselves and everyone else, we come out ahead.

Marksmanship is relevant and is part of what we do. I still shoot for a TP tic here and there to fill in the gaps. When it’s useful, it’s very useful. But like everything with corsair, it fills a small part of the bigger picture. QD, rolling, shooting, melee, it all paints part of what makes corsair. There’s room to maybe make marksmanship a bigger part of that, but that will come with SE overhauling ranged attack and making it more in line with what melee damage is currently capable of; it won’t come from corsair-specific changes to the way we used ranged attacks.

Virtually every DD out there is going to beat us in a straight numbers match. Trying to boost the job’s raw damage output in order to try to compete is foolhardy. But in a support role I think we shine very well, beyond what some people even realize.

Addendum: Think of it as some old swashbuckling tale. You fight face-to-face against an oponent, cutlass in hand. You draw your gun, turn and fire at a guy running at you, sword flailing. You stow your weapons, throw caution to the wind, grab the neariest rope and swing back to the safety of your own deck, gambling on your luck that the rope is actually long enough to get you where you need to be and not give way and, as you land, you knock to the ground some jerk facing your fellow sailor.

You're drawing on a lot of different skills; any one of them isn't defining you. But putting them all together, you're of great benefit to those around you and you're doing pretty well for yourself.

Now, within a game context, this does make us a bit of an odd bird in some activities. But that's the nature of the job. If you find yourself strongly desiring a well-defined roll putting up maximum numbers in that vein, you need to focus on a different job. Corsair is simply not designed that way and short of completely overhauling the job...it's not going to be.

I'm honestly tempted to sell my ranged tp gear -_- with massive regain, time spent rolling, and the free time where I always give priority to ws and qd...I really hardly have time, or actually need to shoot at all. Tp is always there, and usually 1-2 shoots are enough and with Triple shot even redundant. These days not having tp on cor is like not having tp on sam, you must be doing something terribly wrong...having a tp set is becoming just a waste of space honestly.

None of my set is really salable so I’m not going to make any money back, but I leave my rapid shot/snapshot gear in my mog sack and pull it out only when I really need it. I have a basic set of ranged attack gear made up of stuff that I always have on me anyhow that I use far more often than my “optimal” rapid/snapshot set. The space just really is too precious.

Edit: Also, on the Triple Shot thing, totally agree. I forget about it half the time because I never actually need it in day-to-day corsair applications. I -really- like the idea someone mentioned a ways back about dropping double shot, giving ranger triple shot and giving us bounty shot. But that will never happen because ranger AF3 enhances bounty shot, so you know they've got it for the long haul. I don't remember the last time SE willingly changed a piece of gear's stats/trait/JA boosts. (Though if they just swapped the TS enhancement on our body with the BS enhancement on their hands, I'd imagine it would be very easy.)

... Courser's Roll is useful when you are skilling up Marksmanship with Awilda's gun... ;)

Try it sometime! an XI Courser's with a 210 Delay Gun... it's almost Hundred-Fists... but with Bullets!

I'd love some corsair stances giving added effect to bullets, like blood bolts.

Would have been a nice addition four years ago. Not so much now. As the prior discussion indicates, shooting non-stop is not a worthwhile venture at this point and the potency of such ammo that would be required to make it be worthwhile would be unbalancing.

They are already giving us 3rd roll and QD enfeebles. Keep up to date!

I think that if a person who plays COR enough puts his/her mind to it, that marksmanship skill revamping isn't really required. My ranged accuracy is usually fine, and with TP rolls I hardly shoot bullets. In regards to marksmanship, my main "want" is for us to be given the RNG specific weapon skills, for skillchain effects as well as procs on NMs, seeing as that's the direction the game is going with Voidwatch, and perhaps other events in the future.
Also, in regards to COR vs. RNG, a RNGs archery can push higher numbers than a CORs marksmanship, however if both are using marksmanship they are fairly equal. Wildfire, being the best marksmanship weaponskill to non magic-resisty mobs, is wielded better by a COR than a RNG, in that they both have access to the same MAB gear, but a COR would have the quick-draw enhanced damage, on top of rolls to increase MAB.

I understand what you mean in terms of competing for damage, and in no way shape or form should COR need an overhaul of any kind to make it remotely compare to ranger or any other DD class.
I simply was hoping there could be some manner of adjustment that makes shooting your gun more of a proactive part of corsair's playstyle now than one of those spur of the moment, fill the gap things.
It bugs me that ranged sets sit in the mog house most of the time because they simply aren't used enough to warrant bringing it along.
The bummer is the most simple and direct manner to help this is regarding bullet types and availability. Most of which would create imbalance if SE were to go that route. But perhaps with number crunching, COR could have their own unique bullets that are perhaps lower delay, or have a higher base damage or enhancement to quick draw and is rare (similar to Heavy Shell meant only to be used with Unlimited Shot).

I'm just brainstorming, but it's sad that guns have become primarily just magic tools than for hot lead. I would like to see physical and magical at least be comparable in terms of utility and damage, rather than shooting being a TP quick fix as so many use it for now.