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Suicide
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By Ifrit.Kungfuhustle 2011-02-17 14:35:05
Caitsith.Jessie said: Ifrit.Kungfuhustle said: I'm gonna be with Elan on this one. One of the 7 deadly sins is Sloth, which in lamens terms means to be lazy and be willing to fail at life. Sloth is broken up into two sub-sins, Acedia (neglect) and Despair. I'm sure most of you who suffer from depression would know the symptoms for Despair which ultimately leads to suicide. And according to God, harming your own body (which is His temple) is the most sinful thing man could do, which in the end leads to the worst kind of punishment in Hell. I really don't appreciate the idea that you have to suffer eternal damnation as an end result of trying to escape a world of anguish.
When everything in your life sucks so bad that the only possible conclusion that you can come up with is suicide, it's really not comforting to know that not only did you make every living person in your life miserable, but you just made your own soul miserable for eternity. I will say that nothing in a person's life would suck so bad that the only way out is to commit suicide. Basically, God hates a quitter (except for smokers and alcoholics). Natural Selection however, loves people who quit on life and kill themselves, just weeding out the weak people.
There have been times where my life sucked lots of ***, but I always looked down the road where I could stop at a store, buy toilet paper, and wipe all those *** up and get back to living good.
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 Caitsith.Jessie
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By Caitsith.Jessie 2011-02-17 14:42:20
Has anyone else here seen the movie Brothers with Tobey Maguire and Jake Gyllenhaal? I think that movie was probably the best mental insight I've ever had into a man trying to commit suicide.
What happens in the movie is one character is forced to do something extremely terrible and gruesome, so much so that it haunts him for a long time after the events. It's so terrible that he cannot tell anyone what he does, so everyone treats him like nothing happened. It festers inside him to the point where even the smallest negative thing that happens to him hurts him like a ton of bricks.
His mental illness becomes so profound that he eventually winds up taking a gun out on his own family. Realizing he could never do that to the people he loves, he turns the gun on himself.
THIS is the type of event that causes suicide. It's never just one tiny little event. It's usually a life-altering situation that hurts you so badly on the inside that you just can't take it anymore. When anything you try to do ends up having a dead-end road, the only escape is death.
 Lakshmi.Flavin
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By Lakshmi.Flavin 2011-02-17 14:42:45
Caitsith.Mahayaya said: There's a Freudian concept of a person's will-to-die. I personally don't think it's "cowardly" to commit suicide. Especially when you consider the most common fear is the fear of the unknown. There's nothing more unknown than death. Though billions of people have died, not one has been able to tell the tale once passed. Such a curious event that religions have tried to explain it or reassure people of what happens when it occurs. You need some serious balls to make the final action to end your own life. I think explaining it away as a cowardly act is just something to reaffirm your attitude of the person who committed suicide. I'd assume that you'd look down on them in response to your own deep fear of death. As for reasons, the most common reason would likely be the feeling of hopelessness. Don't think this is a purely human trait, because it applies to animals as well. Once the conditions are met, the person who has the will to die usually cannot be reasoned with. It would be equatable to telling a rapist "no", it is beyond the means of the ego and has passed on directly to the very id of the person. So really, you're arguing from the standpoint of the ego. From an ego or super-ego perspective, explain lust, hunger, and the fight-or-flight response. You can't without sounding barbaric. Likewise, it's very difficult to understand the intense desire to die from an ego or super-ego perspective.
People seem to refer to it as cowardly because it seems in most cases people commit suicide to escape something heartbreak/humiliation/etc. and not to face their fear of the unknown. Not sure about you guys but I personally haven't ever heard that reason before.
Either way there's really no use in characterizing it as cowardly or courageous? (I'm not sure what you were trying to say up there in that sense). It's tragic when someone feels the only way to end their personal pain/suffering is this or that depression/mental issue drives someone to it. I figure it's best to mourn their loss in our lives and try to make sure something like that doesn't grasp at our own.
Life fails to live up to our expectations at times, but the low points only exist to make the highs all the sweeter....
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By Ifrit.Kungfuhustle 2011-02-17 14:45:42
Caitsith.Jessie said: Has anyone else here seen the movie Brothers with Tobey Maguire and Jake Gyllenhaal? I think that movie was probably the best mental insight I've ever had into a man trying to commit suicide.
What happens in the movie is one character is forced to do something extremely terrible and gruesome, so much so that it haunts him for a long time after the events. It's so terrible that he cannot tell anyone what he does, so everyone treats him like nothing happened. It festers inside him to the point where even the smallest negative thing that happens to him hurts him like a ton of bricks.
His mental illness becomes so profound that he eventually winds up taking a gun out on his own family. Realizing he could never do that to the people he loves, he turns the gun on himself.
THIS is the type of event that causes suicide. It's never just one tiny little event. It's usually a life-altering situation that hurts you so badly on the inside that you just can't take it anymore. When anything you try to do ends up having a dead-end road, the only escape is death. so you're going to compare something that graphic to some stupid kid who got dumped on V-Day by some girl who was probably out of his league? No comparison.
Caitsith.Jessie
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By Caitsith.Jessie 2011-02-17 14:49:57
Ifrit.Kungfuhustle said: so you're going to compare something that graphic to some stupid kid who got dumped on V-Day by some girl who was probably out of his league? No comparison. Who's to say this person wasn't affected by a lot of problems already? Mental illness comes from people not venting their problems, so it's very possible that his life was hell in other aspects. What if his girlfriend was the only thing left that he could count on? When you only have one person in the entire world that you can count on, and that one person abandons you-- especially when you're already feeling a lot of pain-- it's devastating.
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By Ifrit.Kungfuhustle 2011-02-17 14:55:36
Caitsith.Jessie said: Ifrit.Kungfuhustle said: so you're going to compare something that graphic to some stupid kid who got dumped on V-Day by some girl who was probably out of his league? No comparison. Who's to say this person wasn't affected by a lot of problems already? Mental illness comes from people not venting their problems, so it's very possible that his life was hell in other aspects. What if his girlfriend was the only thing left that he could count on? When you only have one person in the entire world that you can count on, and that one person abandons you-- especially when you're already feeling a lot of pain-- it's devastating. well then, that could be possible.
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By Sylph.Washburn 2011-02-17 15:12:01
Caitsith.Jessie said: Please note that I'm not trying to say that suicide is a good thing or that it's OK to do. All I'm implying is that a person on the outside has no direct knowledge of what's going on in a person's head. I'm just saying that I really don't think the individual in question here took his own life for the solitary fact that his girlfriend broke up with him. If anything, that was just the last straw for him. Suicide is simply ending a constant downward spiral. When your mind truly believes that there is no way to possibly improve your life, you just want it to stop before it gets any worse. People would not commit suicide if they didn't believe that anything they do would just make the situation worse.
Weak mind, in that case.
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 Ramuh.Vinvv
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By Ramuh.Vinvv 2011-02-17 15:21:19
Caitsith.Jessie said: Please note that I'm not trying to say that suicide is a good thing or that it's OK to do. All I'm implying is that a person on the outside has no direct knowledge of what's going on in a person's head. I'm just saying that I really don't think the individual in question here took his own life for the solitary fact that his girlfriend broke up with him. If anything, that was just the last straw for him.
Suicide is simply ending a constant downward spiral. When your mind truly believes that there is no way to possibly improve your life, you just want it to stop before it gets any worse. People would not commit suicide if they didn't believe that anything they do would just make the situation worse. Seppuku.
Suicide bombers.
peaceful immolation.
these are all contrary to those claims.
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Caitsith.Jessie
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By Caitsith.Jessie 2011-02-17 15:25:40
Sylph.Washburn said: Weak mind, in that case. In the same way a body can become weak if you're beaten to near-death, yes. Actually, that's a pretty good analogy. Imagine getting constantly beaten every moment of every day, and nobody sees it happening but you. You're always beaten to the point where you're nearly dead but it never quite gets that far. If the only escape from that constant pain was ending your own life, would you not do that?
The problem here is that most people don't understand what it's like to be mentally ill or just can't grasp just how much mental pain actually hurts. Most people look at mental pain like "sh*t happens, suck it up princess" without actually realizing what it's actually like.
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Ramuh.Vinvv
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By Ramuh.Vinvv 2011-02-17 15:30:44
Caitsith.Jessie said: Sylph.Washburn said: Weak mind, in that case. In the same way a body can become weak if you're beaten to near-death, yes. Actually, that's a pretty good analogy. Imagine getting constantly beaten every moment of every day, and nobody sees it happening but you. You're always beaten to the point where you're nearly dead but it never quite gets that far. If the only escape from that constant pain was ending your own life, would you not do that?
The problem here is that most people don't understand what it's like to be mentally ill or just can't grasp just how much mental pain actually hurts. Most people look at mental pain like "sh*t happens, suck it up princess" without actually realizing what it's actually like.That's implying that we all aren't subjected to similar mental illnesses.
IE saying most people doesn't work because if you talked to MOST people it would tell you that MOST people are subjected to the same kind of problems are subjected to many of the same things, so just saying that no-one understands the person like you are is a bit of a misnomer.
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By Halfpint 2011-02-17 15:33:15
Ppl self mutilate or cut because there is a massive release of endorphins (pleasure chemicals). They don't cut to get attention, actually most do it in secret on places that can't be easily seen. They do it because the release of endorphins is so strong they get to actually FEEL something instead of the mental, physical and emotional numbness associated with their deep depression. I am not a cutter...but I have several friends who Used to cut (one still does)and they all say it's like an addiction, the longer you do it..the more damage they have to do to themselves to get the same feeling.
Intentional suicide is not cowardly beause we are hard wired to survive at all costs. A person has to overcome all the impulses to preserve life in order to take it, they have to be emotionally, and mentally bankrupt before you can even consider it. And unless you have been in this position you will never understand the power of a mind that is so imballanced that it stops functioning as it should
It's the fools that take over the counter drugs and try to fake an O.D. are the cowards. The ones that are pulling stunts to get ppls attention instead of re-evaluating what they are doing to make ppl not pay attention to them.
Tylenol fries the liver ..Advil will destroy the kidneys..Aleve causes numbness or tingling(nerve damage), reduced urine production(kidney damage), ringing in the ears(increased blood pressure), & slow breathing(central nervous system damage). Too much of anything can and will cause death.
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By Sylph.Washburn 2011-02-17 15:34:54
Caitsith.Jessie said: Sylph.Washburn said: Weak mind, in that case. In the same way a body can become weak if you're beaten to near-death, yes. Actually, that's a pretty good analogy. Imagine getting constantly beaten every moment of every day, and nobody sees it happening but you. You're always beaten to the point where you're nearly dead but it never quite gets that far. If the only escape from that constant pain was ending your own life, would you not do that? The problem here is that most people don't understand what it's like to be mentally ill or just can't grasp just how much mental pain actually hurts. Most people look at mental pain like "sh*t happens, suck it up princess" without actually realizing what it's actually like.
I suppose most people don't. I do, however. I've been in slumps before when I started to think there was only one way out... but then I realized i was being a pussy and got my act together, and realized I was being a weak minded indivdual.
I've never attempted, but I've thought about it... What it'd be like, what people would think or say, how peolle would react... but then i started thinking about how after a few months, everyone would all just move on and i would be 'dust in the wind', per se... that's the moment I started thinking about the different reasons, and how to tell if it's *** (teenie-bopper slicers and pill poppers), if it was to end something terminal (such as cancer), or if it was because of a weak mindset.
slicers and pill poppers usually do it for attention, whether it be affection, drama, etc... Seriously though, what's the point in ending it all b/c you feel like someone dosent want you, you feel worthless, etc... all you have to do to squash that is loo kat a bum, who cant afford crap, and has it WAY worse than you, then go look at whoever it is that you're depressed over, and really compare them to what you thouht was the ideal partner BEFORE you met them... then sit back and laugh at yourself for being an idiot and move on.
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By Sylph.Washburn 2011-02-17 15:41:27
Halfpint said: Ppl self mutilate or cut because there is a massive release of endorphins (pleasure chemicals). They don't cut to get attention, actually most do it in secret on places that can't be easily seen. They do it because the release of endorphins is so strong they get to actually FEEL something instead of the mental, physical and emotional numbness associated with their deep depression. I am not a cutter...but I have several friends who Used to cut (one still does)and they all say it's like an addiction, the longer you do it..the more damage they have to do to themselves to get the same feeling. Intentional suicide is not cowardly beause we are hard wired to survive at all costs. A person has to overcome all the impulses to preserve life in order to take it, they have to be emotionally, and mentally bankrupt before you can even consider it. And unless you have been in this position you will never understand the power of a mind that is so imballanced that it stops functioning as it should It's the fools that take over the counter drugs and try to fake an O.D. are the cowards. The ones that are pulling stunts to get ppls attention instead of re-evaluating what they are doing to make ppl not pay attention to them. Tylenol fries the liver ..Advil will destroy the kidneys..Aleve causes numbness or tingling(nerve damage), reduced urine production(kidney damage), ringing in the ears(increased blood pressure), & slow breathing(central nervous system damage). Too much of anything can and will cause death.
I think you associating cutters, in the sense of self-mutilation, and wrist slicers that threaten suicide are on a completely different plane. I understand, however, what you mean about having to overcome the will to live, but, being emotionally and mentally bankrupt falls back on the weak mind theory i have.
And yes, tylenol is liver toxic, I'm not sure what advil and aleve are toxic to, but i know if you take like 20 tylenol, and your body starts digesting it, you have like 24-48 hours of a slow painful death. Completely irreversible. Basically enough time to tell everyone byebye. I'm assuming it's the same with the other two.
By Halfpint 2011-02-17 15:50:20
Situational depression is temporary..it usually goes away on it's own in 2-3 weeks. Some ppl are their own worst enimies and cause the situation that leads to the depression.
Clinical depression is caused by certain brain chemicals being out of balance and is usually 6 weeks or longer and you can't pull yourself out of it. you almost alwaay need to be treated by short term medication (usually 6 months), cognitive or behavioral therapy to get to the reason behind the depression.
Bi-polar, schizophrenia, anxiety disorders and a bunch of others are different brain chemical systems out of balance and definitely treatable but this is a long term situation, you have to stay on medications the rest of your life to be stable. Unfortunately most won't....ppl get to feeling better and stop medications, eventually sliding back to where they were. I tell ppl it's like being diabetic, you have to take the medications or insulin to stay healthy, if you don't your body turns on you and you get sick.
Unless you have actually experienced debilitation depression you have no idea what is going on in that person's head and need to judge less and educate yourself more.
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Caitsith.Jessie
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By Caitsith.Jessie 2011-02-17 15:56:12
Sylph.Washburn said: slicers and pill poppers usually do it for attention, whether it be affection, drama, etc... Seriously though, what's the point in ending it all b/c you feel like someone dosent want you, you feel worthless, etc... all you have to do to squash that is look at a bum, who cant afford crap, and has it WAY worse than you, then go look at whoever it is that you're depressed over, and really compare them to what you thouht was the ideal partner BEFORE you met them... then sit back and laugh at yourself for being an idiot and move on. ^ This is exactly what I mean by people who just don't understand mental pain.
The bum example: Sure, the bum may not even have enough money to buy his own shoes, and he certainly doesn't have enough money to pay rent in an apartment. But it's not that "he's worse off than you could ever imagine being", because if he still has friends and family that he can vent to and love then he can still be mentally satisfied.
Again, this is very largely based on the fact that a person's life is far worse than you could ever imagine. A guy just lost his girlfriend and took his own life... but now think deeper than that. The man lost his girlfriend- maybe he loved her so much that he was going to pop the question that day? Maybe he went up to his girlfriend to talk to her about how he just put his dog down that morning and needed a shoulder to cry on, but before he could say anything she said "I'm seeing someone else". And what if the day before that he found out that he'd just been demoted at work because his boss just laid off a bunch of people.
If someone is already depressed, and lots of depressing things just keep tacking on, it's a lot easier to say "sit back and laugh at it all" than it is to actually do it.
In the same way that you can't just say "It'll get better" right after you break a guy's arm, you can't just say it right after you break a guy's heart.
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By Halfpint 2011-02-17 15:58:57
I am talking about True cutters, blood running down the body and gashes sometimes more than 1/2 inch deep. NOT some Kid wo is trying to scare mommy into buying her a pitty gift because she scraped her wrist and made a tiny pink scab
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Ramuh.Vinvv
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By Ramuh.Vinvv 2011-02-17 16:01:36
Halfpint said: Situational depression is temporary..it usually goes away on it's own in 2-3 weeks. Some ppl are their own worst enimies and cause the situation that leads to the depression.
Clinical depression is caused by certain brain chemicals being out of balance and is usually 6 weeks or longer and you can't pull yourself out of it. you almost alwaay need to be treated by short term medication (usually 6 months), cognitive or behavioral therapy to get to the reason behind the depression.
Bi-polar, schizophrenia, anxiety disorders and a bunch of others are different brain chemical systems out of balance and definitely treatable but this is a long term situation, you have to stay on medications the rest of your life to be stable. Unfortunately most won't....ppl get to feeling better and stop medications, eventually sliding back to where they were. I tell ppl it's like being diabetic, you have to take the medications or insulin to stay healthy, if you don't your body turns on you and you get sick.
Unless you have actually experienced debilitation depression you have no idea what is going on in that person's head and need to judge less and educate yourself more.
i personally think that's a load of crock...(bolded)
bipolar meds make me feel like a zombie.
i'm lucky i didn't take em long enough to become overly dependent upon the ***.
Caitsith.Jessie said: In the same way that you can't just say "It'll get better" right after you break a guy's arm, you can't just say it right after you break a guy's heart. depends how you break the arm.
some wounds don't ever fully heal lol.
but in all honesty.
you guys are making this out to be like there is this mass of insensitive people in the world that can't understand this group of "sorry depressed individuals"
fun fact, the sorry depressed individuals =the insensitive people in the world that "don't understand"
two sides of the same coin.
sure you can play it off and say that they are soooooo emotionally damaged and that no one understands them.
but the sad fact is that everyone feels this way at one point in their life.
the choice to do nothing or keep on trucking is a real choice regardless if you say it is.
this is coming from a person who's suffered with depression since the age of 10(due to complicated circumstances..whooopteeedoooo)
we all have complicated circumstances that shape the lives around us.
we can either let them shape us or shape the world around us.
If you are deep into depression and you aren't getting out maybe it's because you are too unwilling to let it go just like these people are too unwilling to "understand"
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By Ifrit.Kungfuhustle 2011-02-17 16:06:16
Halfpint said: I am talking about True cutters, blood running down the body and gashes sometimes more than 1/2 inch deep. NOT some Kid wo is trying to scare mommy into buying her a pitty gift because she scraped her wrist and made a tiny pink scab
I hate to tell you, but they're all attention starved dumbasses.
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By Ifrit.Kungfuhustle 2011-02-17 16:07:31
Caitsith.Jessie said: Please note that I'm not trying to say that suicide is a good thing or that it's OK to do. All I'm implying is that a person on the outside has no direct knowledge of what's going on in a person's head. I'm just saying that I really don't think the individual in question here took his own life for the solitary fact that his girlfriend broke up with him. If anything, that was just the last straw for him.
Suicide is simply ending a constant downward spiral. When your mind truly believes that there is no way to possibly improve your life, you just want it to stop before it gets any worse. People would not commit suicide if they didn't believe that anything they do would just make the situation worse. I understand...
 Alexander.Jukie
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By Alexander.Jukie 2011-02-17 16:15:13
Occasionally I think about suicide but I don't want to upset the people who love me. It's weird, I'm usually quite content living and stuff. I don't usually get proper depression or anything. Though I do have panic attacks, phobias, social issues and OCD. My OCD is weird though. It's not like locking the door 15 times left and 15 times right or any of that. It's more like sometimes I think if I think something it will cause something to happen. So I get all paranoid about not thinking about it which makes me think about it. But yeah sometimes I think when I don't have the energy to deal with stuff I just think 'if i jumped infront of this bus right now I wouldn't have to worry about anything.' Ironically I'm also scared of death. (insert funky eyes to make this sound less depressing) <.<
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By Ifrit.Kungfuhustle 2011-02-17 16:27:22
Alexander.Jukie said: Occasionally I think about suicide but I don't want to upset the people who love me. It's weird, I'm usually quite content living and stuff. I don't usually get proper depression or anything. Though I do have panic attacks, phobias, social issues and OCD. My OCD is weird though. It's not like locking the door 15 times left and 15 times right or any of that. It's more like sometimes I think if I think something it will cause something to happen. So I get all paranoid about not thinking about it which makes me think about it. But yeah sometimes I think when I don't have the energy to deal with stuff I just think 'if i jumped infront of this bus right now I wouldn't have to worry about anything.' Ironically I'm also scared of death. (insert funky eyes to make this sound less depressing) <.< so you think you're telekinetic?
Alexander.Jukie
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By Alexander.Jukie 2011-02-17 16:33:49
Ifrit.Kungfuhustle said: Alexander.Jukie said: Occasionally I think about suicide but I don't want to upset the people who love me. It's weird, I'm usually quite content living and stuff. I don't usually get proper depression or anything. Though I do have panic attacks, phobias, social issues and OCD. My OCD is weird though. It's not like locking the door 15 times left and 15 times right or any of that. It's more like sometimes I think if I think something it will cause something to happen. So I get all paranoid about not thinking about it which makes me think about it. But yeah sometimes I think when I don't have the energy to deal with stuff I just think 'if i jumped infront of this bus right now I wouldn't have to worry about anything.' Ironically I'm also scared of death. (insert funky eyes to make this sound less depressing) <.< so you think you're telekinetic?
I tried it after watching Mallrats. Just to be sure.
Ramuh.Vinvv
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By Ramuh.Vinvv 2011-02-17 16:33:51
Ifrit.Kungfuhustle said: Alexander.Jukie said: Occasionally I think about suicide but I don't want to upset the people who love me. It's weird, I'm usually quite content living and stuff. I don't usually get proper depression or anything. Though I do have panic attacks, phobias, social issues and OCD. My OCD is weird though. It's not like locking the door 15 times left and 15 times right or any of that. It's more like sometimes I think if I think something it will cause something to happen. So I get all paranoid about not thinking about it which makes me think about it. But yeah sometimes I think when I don't have the energy to deal with stuff I just think 'if i jumped infront of this bus right now I wouldn't have to worry about anything.' Ironically I'm also scared of death. (insert funky eyes to make this sound less depressing) <.< so you think you're telekinetic? I think it's more like....hm
ex:
you watch a tv show about spiders.
you go to bed
for some reason you think about spiders
and then you are like goddamnit don't think about spiders
/becomes overly aware about bugs being on you.
/freaks out and thinks you have spiders on you.
i hate that ***.
is that about right Jukie or did i completely miss it?
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By Halfpint 2011-02-17 16:40:32
If bi-polar meds make you feel like a zombie then you are on the wrong meds, or at the wrong dose. It took me 23 years to find the right medication, and another year to get to the right dose. It can take months for your body to reset the brain chemistry with the meds, unfortunately each person has their own experiences and some are much worse than others
Alexander.Jukie
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By Alexander.Jukie 2011-02-17 16:43:31
Ramuh.Vinvv said: Ifrit.Kungfuhustle said: Alexander.Jukie said: Occasionally I think about suicide but I don't want to upset the people who love me. It's weird, I'm usually quite content living and stuff. I don't usually get proper depression or anything. Though I do have panic attacks, phobias, social issues and OCD. My OCD is weird though. It's not like locking the door 15 times left and 15 times right or any of that. It's more like sometimes I think if I think something it will cause something to happen. So I get all paranoid about not thinking about it which makes me think about it. But yeah sometimes I think when I don't have the energy to deal with stuff I just think 'if i jumped infront of this bus right now I wouldn't have to worry about anything.' Ironically I'm also scared of death. (insert funky eyes to make this sound less depressing) <.< so you think you're telekinetic? I think it's more like....hm
ex:
you watch a tv show about spiders.
you go to bed
for some reason you think about spiders
and then you are like goddamnit don't think about spiders
/becomes overly aware about bugs being on you.
/freaks out and thinks you have spiders on you.
i hate that ***.
is that about right Jukie or did i completely miss it?
Well I get that too. But I have this sleep condition called Hypnogogia or something like that, where you wake up suddenly in the night and you're still dreaming. So I wake up and see spiders in my bed or on me. Cos I'm used to them now I usually stare at it and watch it disappear. I've also seen imps, people in the room, heard noises, seen scary handprints on the bed covers.
Mine's more like I have this OCD thing about I don't want to admit that monsters/ghosts/urbanlegends aren't real because I think if I do I'll be proved wrong. So I avoid mirrors at midnight and ***like that. It's a form of OCD called magical thinking. I guess it's a bit like doing superstitious stuff. Technically it doesn't do anything but you do it just incase.
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By Caitsith.Jessie 2011-02-17 16:52:50
Ramuh.Vinvv said: but in all honesty.
you guys are making this out to be like there is this mass of insensitive people in the world that can't understand this group of "sorry depressed individuals" So if you think that it's impossible for someone to have such mental and emotional pain that they just can't take it anymore, what reasons can you come up with to explain someone committing suicide?
The only reason why I'm arguging this point at all is because to me it almost seems like the opposition is implying that people just kill themselves for no reason at all. That one tiny little bad thing happens to their perfect lives and they murder themselves because they're babies.
I don't believe this is true and that's why I argue my point that mental pain can become great enough that a person wants to end it in the same way that a person being physically tortured to the brink of death would want to end it.
Ramuh.Vinvv
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Posts: 15542
By Ramuh.Vinvv 2011-02-17 17:03:31
Alexander.Jukie said: Ramuh.Vinvv said: Ifrit.Kungfuhustle said: Alexander.Jukie said: Occasionally I think about suicide but I don't want to upset the people who love me. It's weird, I'm usually quite content living and stuff. I don't usually get proper depression or anything. Though I do have panic attacks, phobias, social issues and OCD. My OCD is weird though. It's not like locking the door 15 times left and 15 times right or any of that. It's more like sometimes I think if I think something it will cause something to happen. So I get all paranoid about not thinking about it which makes me think about it. But yeah sometimes I think when I don't have the energy to deal with stuff I just think 'if i jumped infront of this bus right now I wouldn't have to worry about anything.' Ironically I'm also scared of death. (insert funky eyes to make this sound less depressing) <.< so you think you're telekinetic? I think it's more like....hm
ex:
you watch a tv show about spiders.
you go to bed
for some reason you think about spiders
and then you are like goddamnit don't think about spiders
/becomes overly aware about bugs being on you.
/freaks out and thinks you have spiders on you.
i hate that ***.
is that about right Jukie or did i completely miss it?
Well I get that too. But I have this sleep condition called Hypnogogia or something like that, where you wake up suddenly in the night and you're still dreaming. So I wake up and see spiders in my bed or on me. Cos I'm used to them now I usually stare at it and watch it disappear. I've also seen imps, people in the room, heard noises, seen scary handprints on the bed covers.
Mine's more like I have this OCD thing about I don't want to admit that monsters/ghosts/urbanlegends aren't real because I think if I do I'll be proved wrong. So I avoid mirrors at midnight and ***like that. It's a form of OCD called magical thinking. I guess it's a bit like doing superstitious stuff. Technically it doesn't do anything but you do it just incase.
lol.
i'm going to spoiler text this because it's too long. i've dealt with too many drug related hallucinations to worry about my other ones lol.
i was diagnosed bipolar prior to getting into drugs, not that I don't think that it didn't exacerbate my condition.
i used to have sleep paralysis quite often when i stayed at my ex's house and that used to freak the ***out of me...not really the hallucinating part but more the helplessness of not being able to move.
i toyed with lucid dreaming more after i'd regularly used LSD as it opened those doors of perception a bit easier.
i could say that i regret doing some of the stuff i did...but then again i really can't because i don't know what kind of person i would be if i didn't take the course in life i did.
i have a few OCD's as well, but it's not something diagnosed.
my dad is actually diagnosed with a few(some of the typical ones like having to drive 30 miles away to make sure his garage door is closed...multiple times..***like that)
but mine aren't really as quantifiable(from what i know as of yet)
it's just like...i dunno.
if i don't go into a certain pattern of things i have a panic attack, but if i am already mentally prepared to do something differently it doesn't effect me as bad.
so essentially like lets say the other day.
my daily routine would be to go home and chill in the seat i usually sit at near my keyboard and table, the roomates were on the main couch that day and i sat elsewhere..and yeah...made me /freak out a bit.
tried to tolerate it but i felt like a chicken with my head cut off there.
and then my roomates treat me like a weirdo because i'm freaking out about something so small and then i know in the back of the mind that it shouldn't be a big deal.
and then after it's all said and done two hours later when i end up folding and just asking for my seat yeah i don't get myself fully together for a while after that lol.
i'm crazy lol.
i've contemplated suicide a few times as many others have but then my obsessive tendency kicks in with compulsions to get all my ***in order and just make it look like i ran off because i think i could get away with that being /crazy lol.
but my procrastination is a saving grace for me with that stuff because i think the fear of the unknown of doing that is a lot stronger than any feelings of despair that i may have that would cause me to contemplate my own death.
so essentially my anxiety issues...both cause me to freak out and feel the way i do and in the same hand saves me from it lol.
Caitsith.Jessie said:
So if you think that it's impossible for someone to have such mental and emotional pain that they just can't take it anymore, what reasons can you come up with to explain someone committing suicide?
The only reason why I'm arguging this point at all is because to me it almost seems like the opposition is implying that people just kill themselves for no reason at all. That one tiny little bad thing happens to their perfect lives and they murder themselves because they're babies.
I don't believe this is true and that's why I argue my point that mental pain can become great enough that a person wants to end it in the same way that a person being physically tortured to the brink of death would want to end it.
Where exactly did I say that people couldn't "have such mental and emotional pain that they can't just take it anymore"?
I don't think I did, but if you can enlighten me on that I'd be pleased.
I said:
we all have complicated circumstances that shape the lives around us.
we can either let them shape us or shape the world around us.
If you are deep into depression and you aren't getting out maybe it's because you are too unwilling to let it go just like these people are too unwilling to "understand"
you are too focused on the opposition.
these people that are making it out that they are cowards/sissies...etc are probably damaged too and obviously can't handle the concept of suicide, so they call it stupid and write it off.
the difference between the tortured individual and the depressed suicidal individual deals in how open they are to hear the words of others negative or positive.
just because they might be chemically inclined not to listen doesn't mean that they don't have the options, they've just lost the will to try these said options for whatever reason.
i'm not trying to say that they can't have great mental pain.
just that things aren't as black and white as they seem.
By Halfpint 2011-02-17 17:33:55
Kungfu, I have worked 10 years in the mental health settings and there is a difference between the ppl who are doing it for attention and ppl who are doing it because they are truely Mentally Ill.
The ones who cut for attention never go deep enough to require more than a bandage. Once in a while they might require a stitch or 2 and they never cut in a way that will cause enough damage to make them bleed very much. They avoid sensitive areas because it hurts. If they do screw up and go deep enough for it to be considered a suicide attempt they land on a psych floor they rarely do it again because psychaitric wards are frankly a scary place to be.(Especially the guy in the locked room bouncing off the door screaming). They show off their wounds because that is how they get ppls attention
The ones who are True cutters go to the sensitive area because the pain is greater and cause more endorphins to be released. They hide the scars and wounds so their Dr's and family don't know what is going on. The last thing they want is attention, if people know then they will be watched and won't be able to harm themselves anymore.
I don't know your experience with this topic but it's obviously the former and not the latter
Recently had a friend commit suicide, Valentine's Day to be exact.
What's the deal with our youth today?
Is it really that bad?
What causes us to mentally cock block ourselves into believing we can't escape the way we currently live?
What makes us believe things will never change or get better?
Personally I'm just plain tired of this. I'm fed the fuck up with it.
So give me your thoughts on suicide / experiences with people who have died on you and how it impacted you.
Personally I'm pretty shook up by it, his parents and sister are devastated. His niece and nephew are too young to understand at this point but will be impacted by it.
Why take everything you have when all you and those around you have is to lose?
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