Why Do You Think Blue Mage SHOULD Be Nerfed?

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Why do you think Blue Mage SHOULD be nerfed?
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 Quetzalcoatl.Coronos
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By Quetzalcoatl.Coronos 2016-10-18 14:10:19
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It can't be denied that most of the player base are calling for a BLU nerf. We're a heavy-hitting melee class, we can superbuff our party, we can cure ourselves, and we have both physical and magical abilities. It's easy to see why non-BLUs are shouting "they took our jerbs".

I do agree that BLU is overpowered now. What kind of nerfs should happen to make both BLUs and non-BLUs happy? Or rather if you don't like that question, how should other jobs be buffed so that BLU can stay the same?
 Asura.Avallon
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By Asura.Avallon 2016-10-18 14:14:30
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Here we go. ><

EDIT: Actually, I'll add to my post. My initial reaction to this subject is due to the consistent "Nerf BLU" /yell wars that take place on Asura nearly on a daily basis.

Rather than rob Peter to pay Paul and take from BLU, why not buff other jobs and bring them to a relevant state for today's end game? I know MNK could use some love and other jobs I'm sure wouldn't mind certain upgrades.

Hell, even WHM needs some new things - like a functioning way to remove Amnesia (Baramnesia doesn't cut it).

Etc, etc.
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 Leviathan.Stamos
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By Leviathan.Stamos 2016-10-18 14:19:25
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Stahp
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 Quetzalcoatl.Commencal
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By Quetzalcoatl.Commencal 2016-10-18 14:25:21
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I could've sworn I saw RUN topping the charts of lv145 parses from Llewelyn's group. Nerf them too?

Member the days of Tanaka "balancing" everything not Samurai?
 Siren.Kyte
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By Siren.Kyte 2016-10-18 14:48:50
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MNK aside, it's not that hard to do exceptionally well on a notBLU DD. Most of the people complaining are just people that got outparsed and want to blame it on job balance rather than their own staggering incompetence. Of the remainder, most are just people that got passed over by idiot party leaders that only shout for BLU DDs in situations where any would do just as well or better.
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 Quetzalcoatl.Coronos
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By Quetzalcoatl.Coronos 2016-10-18 14:53:25
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Asura.Avallon said: »
Hell, even WHM needs some new things - like a functioning way to remove Amnesia (Baramnesia doesn't cut it).

Agreed. Erase should be updated to remove Amnesia. Or Amnesia-na spell at the very least.
 Leviathan.Comeatmebro
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By Leviathan.Comeatmebro 2016-10-18 14:56:46
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buffing jobs just makes the already limited challenging content easier and shortens the games lifespan

reducing blu's versatility takes away from the core of the job design, it just needs a reasonable reduction to damage so that you make an actual sacrifice to gain that versatility

Siren.Kyte said: »
MNK aside, it's not that hard to do exceptionally well on a notBLU DD. Most of the people complaining are just people that got outparsed and want to blame it on job balance rather than their own staggering incompetence. Of the remainder, most are just people that got passed over by idiot party leaders that only shout for BLU DDs in situations where any would do just as well or better.
neither, i'm a player who 6-12boxes and has near-perfect blu, run, war, rng but can objectively see that blu is stronger than it should be right now
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 Ragnarok.Alexhander
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By Ragnarok.Alexhander 2016-10-18 14:58:09
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I'm drg and blu as main job and i agree that blu are overpower not for dmg by for the function that they got : Acc stp dw haste 2 and mg (45 % haste) da an Ta... That aside sub job. Every job can do big dmg when they are full buffed but blu got everytime 70% haste cure blink and a lot of stuff that other job doesn't have. Solution? Decrease a bit dw and haste from erratic and from job trait and ppl can't complain anymore
 Asura.Ladyofhonor
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By Asura.Ladyofhonor 2016-10-18 15:05:28
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Asura.Avallon said: »

Rather than rob Peter to pay Paul and take from BLU, why not buff other jobs

Because that's a whole ton more work and this dev team isn't exactly doing a whole lot.

As for the topic, BLU just needs heavier drawbacks to doing "everything" at once. Mitigation shouldn't be so high while DDing, and DD should suffer while mitigation is high. BLU max DD isn't that exceptional it needs to be nerfed, it just takes care of too many other things while DDing that makes it overall so strong.
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By Draylo 2016-10-18 15:05:31
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Oh boy here we go again.
 Fenrir.Snaps
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By Fenrir.Snaps 2016-10-18 15:06:44
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Most of the bitching about BLU come from people who don't play BLU (i.e. people who have no actual perspective.) It's not some god tier job. It's good and it's handy but it has serious drawbacks. It doesn't have good self skill chaining options compared to other DD jobs. Self capped haste is cool but nothing entrusted Indi-Haste + Haste can't fix (more reliable too.) The defense boost from Cocoon/MG can be rendered moot with Wilt. It doesn't have anything up it's sleeve like RUN (One for All, Odyllic Subterfuge, etc.), THF (Larceny) or provide anything that's uniquely useful like DNC (Haste Samba). It's nice when you're buff starved but when you have actual support other DD jobs are going to put out similar or greater DPS while also bringing something useful to the table.
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 Sylph.Jeanpaul
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By Sylph.Jeanpaul 2016-10-18 15:15:49
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Fenrir.Snaps said: »
Most of the bitching about BLU come from people who don't play BLU
Let us also not forget, most people who play this game are very poor strategists.
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 Valefor.Sehachan
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By Valefor.Sehachan 2016-10-18 15:18:19
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Why so blue guys?
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 Quetzalcoatl.Trulusia
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By Quetzalcoatl.Trulusia 2016-10-18 15:23:56
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BLU doesn't need a nerf and the majority of jobs don't need a buff either. Monk does because it really just doesn't have anything going for it. You could boost H2H WS and that probably would be enough to "fix" Monk.

Other than that though, pretty much every job in the game right now is useful or has a use in a particular setup. Honor March makes Bard amazing, Inundation makes Red Mage amazing for any group doing skillchains with more than one weapon type... Is there any other job that people think does poorly at this point?
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By Calinari 2016-10-18 15:24:06
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I mean objectively, blu's traits are excessive. It gets the best of all jobs and no downsides. The 1200 gift is insanely OP. (comparatively)

CDC might be a little overpowered, thats not blu's fault, but blu's traits make it even stronger.

100% MG is really OP. MG is BASICALLY embrava from pre-nerf.

Add in it's being the best survival "DD" for the scrubs without DT sets, and even glasscannons perform too well to say blu isn't imbalanced.

Granted it's -not- the best DD, but it's the easiest to play for the masses. When you shout you want the job least likely to fail, and that job is 100% blu.
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 Leviathan.Stamos
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By Leviathan.Stamos 2016-10-18 15:27:32
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CDC isn't even the strongest WS. It is just the most SC favorable.
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By Queensryche 2016-10-18 15:30:31
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What does it all really matter at this point? If you don't like that Blu is OP. Just bandwagon it like everyone else. Problem solved.
 Bahamut.Badstreak
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By Bahamut.Badstreak 2016-10-18 15:44:31
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The funniest thing I ever saw was when the Vagary spells were added. We ran a full clear of Vagary using 18 BLU, just to prove they can do anything.

Some BLU stayed back and acted as healers.
For some mobs, the BLU all stayed at range and used Glutinous Dart to function as rangers and ping the NMs to death while 2-3 of them would stay out front and tank.
For anything that needed nukes to be cleared, BLU has no issue doing that either. Some BLU would make SCs while the others would burst it.

It really can do everything and nothing convinced me that the job is OP more than watching it literally do the entire event and fill every role.
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By Afania 2016-10-18 16:01:38
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Everytime when I see this BLU discussion I see the same things looping over and over and over.... people play the "but X job wins parse" card, or "buuut X job can do Y" card.

In this months intense VD blu is absolutely necessary for efficient runs(that I know of) and IMO more optimal than alternative gravity role job RDM due to higher output and more potent gravity.

To those who tries to play "but bst..." or "but RUN..." or "but THF....." card, the reality is I log on and see every JP pt shout for blu sub blm.....it's a job that can do nearly everything AND DD competitively.


Quetzalcoatl.Commencal said: »
I could've sworn I saw RUN topping the charts of lv145 parses from Llewelyn's group. Nerf them too?

Member the days of Tanaka "balancing" everything not Samurai?

Yes because one parse video doing an NM thats suspected to have enemy critical hit rate- trait during bracelet mode, in a super buffed situation(a.k.a situations that doesn't favor BLU but favors DD RUN) is enough to prove there are no design flaws.

How about I go out and make a parse video and create a setup that puts DD RUN at disadvantage by not giving anyone attack buffs to support my argument? Pretty sure BLU will win the parse with crit hit WS having an advantage without buffs.

Ever since this BLU discussion started I've seen all sorts of argument tries to shift focus by creating a dummy scenario that favors other DD job, such as BST SP situations, COR malaise leaden SC situations, RUN super buffed zergs, or THF SATA zerg in a 1 min ambu fight and so on. Then proceed to claim BLU isn't OP because other jobs can do this.

To me it seems like it's just trying to win the argument for the sake of it.
 Sylph.Dravidian
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By Sylph.Dravidian 2016-10-18 16:02:48
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What I would like is balance to dmg before Ultimate weapons to be more on par without somehow furthering the gap between 2 handed jobs with RMEs for example and blu dmg. Sucks that these jobs have to have RMEs to beat BLU, while significantly behind without them.
 Valefor.Prothescar
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By Valefor.Prothescar 2016-10-18 16:03:31
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Afania said: »
In this months intense VD blu is absolutely necessary for efficient runs

this is exactly the kind of hyperbole and misinformation spreading that perpetuates bandwagons. if you're incapable of beating the frog without subduction please find better people to play with and stop putting the blame on other things.

not even commenting on anything else, just this.
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By Afania 2016-10-18 16:06:41
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Valefor.Prothescar said: »
Afania said: »
In this months intense VD blu is absolutely necessary for efficient runs

this is exactly the kind of hyperbole and misinformation spreading that perpetuates bandwagons. if you're incapable of beating the frog without subduction please find better people to play with and stop putting the blame on other things.

not even commenting on anything else, just this.

I've beat the frog without subduction, stop making assumptions and not getting the point of BLU being versatile AND can DPS well.
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 Sylph.Oraen
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By Sylph.Oraen 2016-10-18 16:09:20
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Your EXACT quote is "blu is absolutely necessary for efficient runs". That is the EXACT statement you made. Editing it now doesn't change that fact.
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By Afania 2016-10-18 16:13:45
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Sylph.Oraen said: »
Your EXACT quote is "blu is absolutely necessary for efficient runs". That is the EXACT statement you made. Editing it now doesn't change that fact.


I didn't edit it, I also made a (that I know of) behind the statement.

I've done VD with PD zerg, THF run in SATA with regain roll, subduction kite, sabo gravity II kite.

So far subduction kite strat wins in terms of efficiency.

Unless there's one secret setup that I don't know of my statement is exactly like what I originally stated, subduction kite is the most efficient strat that I know of. That doesnt mean Im incapable of beat it without subduction.

Claiming Im incapable of beating frog without subduction when I only made a statement of subduction kite is a more efficient way that's known is quite an assumption.
 Quetzalcoatl.Coronos
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By Quetzalcoatl.Coronos 2016-10-18 16:17:30
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Afania said: »
Everytime when I see this BLU discussion I see the same things looping over and over and over.... people play the "but X job wins parse" card, or "buuut X job can do Y" card.

Afania said: »
In this months intense VD blu is absolutely necessary for efficient runs

Afania said: »
I've beat the frog without subduction

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 Leviathan.Stamos
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By Leviathan.Stamos 2016-10-18 16:18:45
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Your whole shout thing is also based on your experience on your server. Not every server is like yours, which we established in the last terrible thread.
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 Valefor.Prothescar
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By Valefor.Prothescar 2016-10-18 16:18:45
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Maybe there's some language barrier issue or maybe you're just trying to save face, but...

"Subduction (BLU) is useful because it makes my runs 3-10 seconds faster"

and

"Subduction (BLU) is the only way to efficiently farm this"

are not the same thing and one is far more damning and incorrect than the other.
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By Afania 2016-10-18 16:20:57
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Quetzalcoatl.Coronos said: »
Afania said: »
Everytime when I see this BLU discussion I see the same things looping over and over and over.... people play the "but X job wins parse" card, or "buuut X job can do Y" card.

Afania said: »
In this months intense VD blu is absolutely necessary for efficient runs

Afania said: »
I've beat the frog without subduction


Did you guys serious can't tell the meaning of "efficient run"??? It doesn't mean alternative method can't win, it only means it's less efficient.
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By Afania 2016-10-18 16:22:59
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Valefor.Prothescar said: »
Maybe there's some language barrier issue or maybe you're just trying to save face, but...

"Subduction (BLU) is useful because it makes my runs 3-10 seconds faster"

and

"Subduction (BLU) is the only way to efficiently farm this"

are not the same thing and one is far more damning and incorrect than the other.

I'm not trying to save face, what I meant is "subduction is faster" from the very beginning. You can't expect me to stay silent when you basically twisted the meaning of my word into something else.

You're the only one that tries to paint it into "it's the only way to win" by twisting the meaning of my word into something else.

If you read that ambu thread I was the one post several setup ideas with DD run, thf and rdm gravity II until blu sub blm being settled as current mainstream setup because it's...well... most efficient?
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