Best Dropped Polearm

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Best dropped polearm
 Phoenix.Gaiarorshack
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By Phoenix.Gaiarorshack 2012-01-10 10:02:57
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Im trying to gear my DRG a bit but it has never been one of my main jobs.
What dropped polearm or "normal" ToM polearm should is general considered the bests Damage wise ?

I don't wanna do the hassle of empy or empy-1 since I'm already working on others empy's and empy polearm seems a bit meh to me.


Maybe i will try for mythic way later but until then i need a good replacement polearm.
 Ragnarok.Ashman
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By Ragnarok.Ashman 2012-01-10 10:13:45
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Patientia Lance (better) or Vougier's Contus (faster) are what i'd suggest offhand for "dropped" lances.

Still should just do ToM. The OA2 Lance is one of the best trial weapons before new ws (havent played drg since 99 cap aside from dicking around). The nice thing about multi hit weapons on drg is landing on jumps.
 Phoenix.Gaiarorshack
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By Phoenix.Gaiarorshack 2012-01-10 10:37:00
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"The nice thing about multi hit weapons on drg is landing on jumps."
please explain

i might be to tuned on war but when i see those OAx weapon i see a very low base dmg so also a very low weapon ranking which again lowers the cap of Fstr
 Ragnarok.Ashman
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By Ragnarok.Ashman 2012-01-10 11:19:51
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Phoenix.Gaiarorshack said: »
"The nice thing about multi hit weapons on drg is landing on jumps." please explain

OAX weapons can occur during a jump. The high rate of DA/TA, etc coupled with the high (45%?) chance of OAX on magian/mythic means a great chance for additional TP on jumps. That on top of the increased tp that already comes from spirit/soul jump means a very very very quick rate of WS. When I first finished Corsesca and used it in Abyssea with VV/RR/Apoc my friend described it as the "meat grinder". I had missed attack animations on a 2H job at one point.

Phoenix.Gaiarorshack said: »
i might be to tuned on war but when i see those OAx weapon i see a very low base dmg so also a very low weapon ranking which again lowers the cap of Fstr

It's not as bad as you think. 102 damage on the corsesca +3 (dunno whats on the Chauve-Souris aka Chuck Sorris) for 95 cap. The other selling point to this line of spears is the 507 delay and the fact that it (was) so much easier to grab a 5-hit without massive attack sacrifice.
 Phoenix.Gaiarorshack
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By Phoenix.Gaiarorshack 2012-01-10 11:29:31
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OK so its lot of TP return on jump. well i dont jump to much on drg end probably thereby not a good drg player. (TY abyssea burn)

2nd
weapon ranking does afaik not count in augmented dmg its only the weapon based dmg so its not the 102 but the 50'ish dmg the determins the weapon rank so we have 54/9 = 6 in weapon rank and not 102/9=11 in weapon rank


"Regarding weapons augmented through Trial of the Magians: Weapons inflict accurate damage to their post-augment rating."
Source http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Weapon_Rank

.... ups POST mean after DOH >.<
now i better get it.
TY for the info
 Siren.Kyte
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By Siren.Kyte 2012-01-10 11:38:31
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Phoenix.Gaiarorshack said: »
i might be to tuned on war but when i see those OAx weapon i see a very low base dmg so also a very low weapon ranking which again lowers the cap of Fstr

Keep in mind that base damage plays smaller role as the WSC increases. Given that all WS that you would be using (Drakesbane, at 50% STR, or even more so with Stardiver, at 100% STR) have a fairly high WSC, the lower base damage doesn't hurt the weapon as much as you might think.
 Phoenix.Gaiarorshack
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By Phoenix.Gaiarorshack 2012-01-10 11:41:45
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@Siren.Kyte

Point taken
but also i was wrong on the weapon ranking on ToM weapons
 Fenrir.Skarwind
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By Fenrir.Skarwind 2012-01-10 11:44:09
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Ragnarok.Ashman said: »
Patientia Lance (better) or Vougier's Contus (faster) are what i'd suggest offhand for "dropped" lances.

Still should just do ToM. The OA2 Lance is one of the best trial weapons before new ws (havent played drg since 99 cap aside from dicking around). The nice thing about multi hit weapons on drg is landing on jumps.


I think I gave this same advice on the Patentia Lance page and for some reason it got rated down lol. Pretty accurate though.
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By Ophannus 2012-01-11 12:36:07
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OAT Lance is amazingly awesome. Almost half of your jumps will be Double attacks for like 80-120 TP
 Siren.Thoraeon
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By Siren.Thoraeon 2012-01-16 13:19:35
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Deciding to bring my DRG out of semi retirement, and I thought I would ask about different polearms available.

Top 3 are easily Ryunohige, OAT Magian, and Gungnir. I suppose Rhongo is up there too. However, Ryu is an insane amount of work, I am working on a different relic, and I don't feel like doing Chloris again. Would like to get OAT, but I would like a good alternative until I get around to Baby Blob.

Here is a list of what I consider to be some of the best polearms around. (Not in any particular order.)

Ryunohige (95 since 99 technically isn't out yet)
DMG:139 Delay:492 Augments "Jump" IV "Drakesbane" Aftermath (Incl. Wyvern): Increases Acc./Atk. Occasionally attacks twice or thrice
Pros: Best polearm in the game
Cons: Hardest polearm in the game to get

Gungnir (95)
DMG:147 Delay:492 Accuracy+35 "Geirskogul" Additional effect: Weakens defense
Pros: High damage, ~16% chance of dealing 2.5 times damage, weakens defense 17% is kinda nice but I believe it overwrites angon although it is weaker
Cons: WS is not very good, working on a different relic atm

Rhongomiont (90 since I would be using metal plates on Verethragna first)
DMG:132 Delay:492 VIT+15 "Camlann's Torment" Aftermath: Occ. deals double damage
Pros: Decent damage
Cons: WS is mediocre, would prefer to waste my time farming a different Emp weapon

Chauve-Souris - OAT
DMG: 110 Delay: 507 OAT ~45%
Pros: Super high OAT, easy 5-Hit due to high delay
Cons: Lowish damage

Chauve-Souris - DA edition
DMG: 132 Delay: 507 DA +9%
Pros: High damage and DA is nice, easy 5-hit due to high delay
Cons: This isn't the OAT polearm

Nahvalr - STR edition
DMG: 132 Delay:480 STR+11 Attack+26
Pros: High Damage/Attack/STR
Cons: 480 delay is odd for a good DRG polearm

Sixgill - TP Bonus edition
DMG: 119 Delay: 492 TP Bonus +100
Pros: Stardiver damage affected by TP
Cons: Low damage, offers little to DOT

Sixgill - WS damage edition
DMG: 126 Delay: 492 WS damage +10%
Pros: Possibly better than the TP Bonus version
Cons: Same cons as TP bonus version, but with a little higher damage

Sixgill - Store TP edition
DMG: 126 Delay: 492 Store TP +13
Pros: Incredibly easy 5-Hit
Cons: Same cons as TP bonus version, but with a little higher damage

Patientia Lance
DMG:129 Delay:492 AGI+10 Attack+15 "Conserve TP"+7
Pros: Best buyable polearm and it is cheap, good stats, upgrade from VC
Cons: Better options available

In response to TP Bonus vs WS Damage, here is a comparison using Stardiver for the two weapons at 100, 200, and 300 TP.
This test suggests that the TP Bonus is better at 100 TP and 200 TP, but if you factor in that Stardiver uses both Light Gorget and Light Belt (or the other options) and it applies to all hits, it changes.
If you factor in the Belt/Gorget there is a dramatic increase in the WS Damage +10% such that is wins at all TP%. Additionally, the WS damage +10% will probably win with Drakesbane in abyssea, but that is another story.

Due to these tests I suggest that the TP Bonus polearm is inferior to the WS Damage +10% polearm for Stardiver.

Basically, back to my original question, what would be the best polearm (non-emp/relic/mythic) until OAT polearm?
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 Valefor.Prothescar
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By Valefor.Prothescar 2012-01-16 13:41:29
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WSD is a multiplier of its own, it doesn't add to [fTP].

Final numbers, assuming 119D, capped fSTR, 195WSC, belt+gorget, and capped attack with the most favorable randomizer:

3852 for TP bonus
3858 for WS damage +10%
 Siren.Thoraeon
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By Siren.Thoraeon 2012-01-16 13:45:32
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Valefor.Prothescar said: »
WSD is a multiplier of its own, it doesn't add to http://fTP.

Final numbers, assuming 119D, capped fSTR, 195WSC, belt+gorget, and capped attack with the most favorable randomizer:

3852 for TP bonus
3858 for WS damage +10%

Damage = WD * PDIF = ( D + fSTR + WSC) * fTP * PDIF

I am aware of that, but since it is a multiplier times a multiplier, it comes out to essentially the same thing. Everything else for the 2 weapons should be the same with the fTP being the only difference.
 Valefor.Prothescar
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By Valefor.Prothescar 2012-01-16 13:53:32
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Misread and thought you wrote 1.45 for TP bonus which would have been horribly off; however that point aside, while it doesn't make a difference for the final number, WSD does not get multiplied onto the fTP normally.

I'd probably just make the TP bonus pole if I wanted to make something for pre-OA2/relic/mythic. They're relatively identical in terms of damage potential on Stardriver with the TP bonus pole offering more to Drakesbane than weaponskill damage in most situations.
 Siren.Thoraeon
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By Siren.Thoraeon 2012-01-16 14:06:02
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True, the TP bonus would basically give an extra 15% crit rate to Drakes if I read bgwiki correctly. Still, my drg would primarily be for VW (have better abyssea jobs), so I would not be using Drakesbane very often assuming if everything I hear about Stardiver is true. Considering how many Dusty Wings I get in VW, I would thing that the WS Damage +10% be better for VW, and I guess TP bonus better for abyssea.

Both are still good in both situations, and probably pretty close to the same thing.
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By Siren.Thoraeon 2012-01-16 14:08:15
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So guessing not worth it to try STP polearm for a easy 5-hit?
 Valefor.Prothescar
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By Valefor.Prothescar 2012-01-16 14:08:49
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Can coincide with BGwiki in that 100TP is most definitely 10% crit rate while 200TP is around 23~25%, though my sample size isn't large enough to indisputably suggest 25% (it is very likely though).

Yeah, they're pretty much identical for Stardriver, only off by a few points of damage in absolutely ideal situations that will never happen, while TP bonus is superior for Drakesbane. Overall you haven't got much to lose by going with TP bonus. Both trials are equally as annoying too.
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By Siren.Thoraeon 2012-01-16 14:12:45
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Sounds reasonable, I think I shall do the TP Bonus then.
 Ragnarok.Ashman
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By Ragnarok.Ashman 2012-01-16 14:28:32
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That's still a lot of work for a "placeholder" lance. I would just use AH polearm or Vougier's til you finish your "endgame" polearm.

With the 100% modifier on merit ws the low damages arent as bad as they used to be.
necroskull Necro Bump Detected! [103 days between previous and next post]
 Bismarck.Angeleus
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By Bismarck.Angeleus 2012-04-28 08:07:27
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Which magician trial path for pole-arm should I choose, so i can look it up?
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By Shiva.Galbir 2012-04-28 08:09:26
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I would say OAT Chauve-Souris.
 Bismarck.Angeleus
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By Bismarck.Angeleus 2012-04-28 08:12:30
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Shiva.Galbir said: »
I would say OAT Chauve-Souris.

Thanks a lot.
 Carbuncle.Grandthief
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By Carbuncle.Grandthief 2012-04-28 08:27:09
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Personally, I did a STR/Att one but I've started is when trials where introduced and worked on it every now and then.

I don't think you can go wrong with it, as STR/Att benefits you in a lot of situations.

Not the best but also not particularly hard to make.
 Valefor.Omerta
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By Valefor.Omerta 2012-04-28 08:53:40
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Can't wait to finish my OA2, been hard but almost done! (at the baby blob stage but I have almost everything else!) cannot wait to see how (hoPefully good) this polearm is :D anyone got one/used a test server one to confirm its as good as I hope? :D
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By Odin.Arkista 2012-05-24 15:50:27
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Ok I busted drg out after about 3 years at lvl 75 and I keep reading about this OaT is this really that great if you dont have a relic/mythic/emp weapon cause atm in using Patientia Lance? and I'm working on a 5 hit build.
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By Fenrir.Minjo 2012-05-24 16:21:45
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STR and OAT polearms are both fantastic, with OAT typically being a bit better. Patientia Lance isn't a bad choice, and if you truly don't care to do Magian trials, you'll certainly get by, but there are much better options.
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By Odin.Arkista 2012-05-28 10:50:42
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I have got pretty far with the OAT polearm but it seems im stuck on the VWNM no help,So looking at the Sixgill pole which is better ws dmg/tp+100? Store tp doesnt look so good.
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By Carbuncle.Shadowreapper 2012-06-16 08:31:23
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Herja's fork is curently he best dropped polearm hands down.
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