Since The New Anti-RMT Tools Came Out......

Have you guys noticed anything happening with you server's endgame LS?

aka....

Since they started hunting gilbuyers now, have all of the leaders of endgame shells just suddenly disappear, or some of the highest laughed at endgame people all the sudden "quit?"

Seems to me on Asura. Although I did watched 24/7 camp Cerby lately (I got bored, I was really there to nuke some puddings to heck and back) I noticed that there are fewer and fewer endgamers now.

Which means only one thing....

My time to rule the world has come, all who face me shall die by my hands as I send their souls to the deepest parts of heck, or Alabama, whichever is closer at the time. All who kneel before me shall be rewarded by giving me daily offerings of either eternal service or cookies.

Anyway, enough about my evil rant

Whats up with your endgame shells now? You having the same situation as I?

My endgame shell is still going on as usual, granted we're not in to HNM's

All the end gamers on Kujata are still around.

Claim bots

maybe thats related to what peoples "christmas" and "vacations with family"....
they'll be back w

Haven't noticed anything like that.

I doubt you'll see many EG shells losing members to SE's anti-RMT activities. In general the only time we on Diabolos see EG shells have members get banned is when they're notoriously known for claim botting various HNMs.

But with some of the newer systems they've installed (auto-jail, the "gil mule" thing, etc.) I'd expect to see quite a few more bannings of more well known players. I know some linkshells I've been in have used gil mules for thier communal banks. So who knows how it'll turn out.

I think you are assuming that all people in HNM linkshells have no life.

People are gone because of the holidays.

HNM gil mules are not going to be banned either. Read the STFU report carefully again and notice the part that you missed.

Yes, I do believe the majority of players in HNM linkshells have no life, or basically just have a major lack of real life responsibility. but thats a topic for another thread.

I dont know what information you got out of that report, but I didnt see it specify the criteria for which gil mules will be defined. Depending on the criteria, I have no doubt that a few "legitimate" gil mules will be banned.

But again, it depends on the criteria they use to determine a gil mule.

I believe 24/7 is hurting period, weather banning, or people got what they wanted and don't need the botting ls anymore. They posted on alla that their "starter" ls is looking for people. To you know see if your good enough to be in the main ls. Can't wait till 24/7 is gone. ><

If you read the report, then you would notice it was talking about gil mules associated with characters believed to be involved in RMT activities reported by FFXI players or their own investigations. So unless HNM gil mules are doing business with suspected RMT they will not be banned. The report never said anything about having a certain amount of gil on a mule, only those suspected of being involved with RMT.

I don't think that the tools they introduced will affect HNM ls's at all really. If they get banned it will be b/c of botting while a GM is observing not b/c of anti-rmt programs. And as previously said, it's the holidays so a lot of people are out doing stuff.

Thats the problem about EG LSs (SML, Remedy, 24/7, the old loltribe) is that they require you in their application process to: A) not have a life, B) not have family, C) always live in FFXI, D) always do what the leaders want you to do regardless if it benifits you or not.

So I do believe the following statement would be false in Asura at least, don't know about anyone else though.

When I was in Remedy I was allowed to have a life >_> When I was in AV on bahamut I was also allowed to have a life.

Theoretically you gain equivalent to the time that you put in playing. If people wanted to spend copious amounts of free time playing the game then more power to them...their time they can do what they want with it. Don't be bitter because you play just as long as someone would in an end game LS and have nothing to show for it because you wasted your time shouting in whitegate or EXPing...or trolling KI, Korpg

yeah, bring up KI won't ya?

I just remember seeing Remedy's and Tribe's application requirments, which basically made anyone who is new to the shell to work their *** off while the leaders get all the goods. I rather do something else than to better somebody else for my work.

But hey, if you want to waste 3+ hours camping HNMs just to see some bot steal it for you, then by all means, go for it.

Just remember its the leaders and their friends who get first dibs on any of the good stuff, regardless if they tell you or not. I WAS in an endgame once, I had to pass some good ***because the leader wanted the items to go to somebody else, which happens to be him.

so yeah, I do have some sort of idea on how endgames work.

I don't know, seems to me if you're the new guy and there are veterans ahead of you, why shouldn't the vets get first dibs? Most HNMLS have a points system that's kinda hard to argue against...if you have the points, you can lot...pretty simple, no? Some people build up massive points, sure, that's bound to happen. Can you argue they didn't earn them by participating though?

And those camps were never a waste--I got a lot of homework done in those 3 hours!

point system works for those who aren't corrupt. Usually endgame leaders are corrupt, and give them points just for existing. Then they make the items so much on points that the only ones who can get the items are the leaders at first. And guess what! Its those items the leaders are going to go for at first.

Even if you join later on, it will take a long time (in some shells, could be 1 year +) before you even get 1 thing, then it will be just as long just to get another thing.

So yeah, point systems work in theory, but in practice....naw.....

You're a riot man...first off, make no mistake, members are watching attendance just as closely as the leaders are taking it. I'm not saying it doesn't happen, but normally, attendances are posted in public and people can dispute and count them until their heart's content. If a leader was fudging their own attendance I'm sure a sack or another member would step up and say something.

Saying "usually end game leaders are corrupt" is a terrible generalization lol. Then saying "they make the items so much on points that the only ones who can get the items are the leaders at first"...I don't quite know what that means (poor grammar aside). Seems to me when a shell FIRST starts out they can't have ridills going for something like 500 points because then it would have to go to <ground>, so some other criteria is used. Maybe if Ridill drops it does go to the leader, but are you saying the leader is undeserving? Guess they shouldn't reap the benefits of starting their own LS, you're right. Maybe the leader or another sack appoints someone else to lot the item, and its their prerogative to do so. Maybe they just say "Well the most points anyone has is 10; therefore, anyone with 10 points lot."

Once an LS is established and points amongst members start to accumulate, item costs are naturally going to rise. Maybe the leader STILL has the most points, but maybe it's because he is legitimately putting his time in to make the LS successful and lead by example?

I think you're pretty out of touch with end game man...I don't think anything of this sort really goes on anymore, and if it does...then in my opinion, the people who stay in a shell like that are morons and deserve to be cheated lol. (KazokuLS of Bahamut?!?!)

What you have to watch for now are "cliques." Like for example, when leaders form a clique with people and are readily able to do things like salvage and nyzul, while there are other members in the shell that struggle to find a group. But rightfully so, if someone really wants to do these kinds of things then they will take it upon themselves to make their own group. This is the fundamental problem of end game today...aside for the raping of LS banks to fund relics, transferring to Remora, etc...

In point systems, players do more conspiring against one another than leaders do--for example "If so-and-so bids on ******* then run him up on points so I get ahead of him for Adaberk!"

Man 24/7 can't even take a Christmas break without people thinking we all got banned lol. Sir when camping a HNM like cerb you leave a holding party there and go on with your usual business. Having 30 ppl camping cerb for 24 hrs is totaly HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE. You gotta learn thing or two about endgame before you open your mouth lol.

You don't know anything about end game linkshells.

Camping hnm is what lets us have a life. 3 hours is a lot of time to do homework, play with the kids, and get the house in order. My daughter would rather me camp HNM than watch TV or whatever HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE thing it is you spend your time doing.

Stop personally insulting people who are better at the game than you are.

Me thinks I hit a couple of nerves.

As Mikerocca kindly pointed out, yes Attendence points are posted for everyone to see, but personally, I rather there was a log to those points also, which nobody here has said "Oh, <insert LS name here> uses a Attendance log for everyone to see." Nobody ever thinks of these things, but "assumes" that the shellholders/admins are honest enough to correctly post the right amounts of work the shellholder/admins put in. (Aka if you still don't understand what I said, lets assume the following: 1 hour of camping = 1 point. What keeps the Admins from saying they spent 5 hours camping a NM if they really just showed up when it pop'd?)

To Blue: So, next time I see 24/7 camp something, I'll stick around. That way if I see you holding it, I'll just GM ya, since you know, that is illegal, holding a NM like that. OR better yet, I'll just tell my friends who also happen to be in Remedy that "XXX has pop'd, want me to stick around and get the ToD so you can start camping it next time?" I could do that also.

To Devek: Thats just sad, you know. You could, you know, /logout to play with the kids/do homework/clean. I at least /shutdown when I want to do homework, or have to really. Kindof sad that they (the endgame LSs) rely on you to have you character up at least, since you really can't be afk if you have to be at your seat doing god knows whatever they require you to do.

To the three of you guys, and others who share the same view as them: If I was insulting people who are better at the game than I am, then I'm sorry, but I was insulting you instead. If you don't understand what I just said, I'll make it very clear for you. You ready for it? I'll even put it one word at a time

You
Are
Not
Better
Than
Anyone
Else

Hope that clears things up.

P.S. I really hoped 24/7 got banned. That would make Asura a much better place imo.

Well...I'm gonna make this short because I'm quitting, and frankly, really don't give a rat's ***.

Korpg--you don't know how things work. Holding an HNM isn't illegal as long as you are doing damage--stick a DoT on it and a GM won't say anything. An illegal instance of holding would be for a character to claim something like Leaping Lizzy and hold it without doing any damage. It's actually acceptable to claim an HNM like Cerb and hold it while your linkshell gathers to kill it.

As for your attendance theory--most linkshells keep a log of attendance, whether it is public or private. If its private then it is usually available upon request.

And finally, you're still the same idiot I remember from oh so long ago. The only nerve you hit was the one that prompted me to refute every freakin thing you said, based soley on the grounds that you're an ignorant putz. I don't know why you would think anything you said was supposed to be an insult lol.

Don't understand what I just said? I'll make it very clear for you. You ready for it? I'll even put it one word at a time.

Everyone
is
better
than
you.

Hope that clears things up.

PS - why would you hope 24/7 got banned when you don't participate in any facet of end game and their supposed actions have no direct impact on you? Good luck on finishing CoP though.

whats up peeps, I rarely post on forums because I don't candy coat anything, and i'll purposely be an *** to you if I deem that you deserve it. So bear with me, as I'm about to be perfectly clear on a few things.

To all the experienced end gammers.......... I salute you.

Korpg, man bro, you really have a long ways to go before you should spout off at the mouth about end game people. To make an honest statement is one thing, to make a rash generalization is a completely different animal. You state attendance points are what is taken and posted and would like to see a log of points, events etc. Well, I can sum that up for you in 3 little letters that most if not all end game shells have adopted....

D..
K...
P....

Check dis: dkp.visigothls.com Thats my sky shells personal website point database. What we did, when we did it, who got points, why, how many points were spent, who spent them, on what, what drops we got, etc... it's all there for you to see. This is common place end game bro... I can honestly say, that in my personal opinion (keeping in mind everyone is entitled to their own) is that your end game experience was VERY short, and was with some VERY inexperienced shell that probably should have never formed in the first place. End game takes time, but as others have stated, that 3-4 hours camping a mob, can allow me to have a life. At least... it's allowed enough time for my life to get a master's degree in network administration, work a 50 hour a week job, attend college 3 nights a week for 6 years, Get married, have a family, and on top of all of that.... actually ENJOY the game.

I think you're suffering from one of two things, only one of which, sadly can be fixed.

1.)Simple Inexperience: You just need more. Give end game another chance, get in with a good shell with good people, you'll change your tune (if not i'll send one of my Bards to come change it for you) quickly.

or

2.) You're a jelous retard who is hating on end game people because they have chosen to spend more time in the game than you, and you don't like it. To me, that's just stupid, and.... you can't fix stupid.

my 2 cents

~Reli

He was a troll non KI, what makes you think he will be any different here?

CARBUNCLE DUN RUUL DEE ENDGAYM - Translation: Nothing has really changed on the server which Square Enix has strategically named Carbuncle. Carbuncle Server shall dominate other servers in end game, watch and see. Panties for sale.

Sounds like someone got butt hurt by end game. Although there are some and it's very few people that do act the way hes talking about. But those are hard to find but once you do find them and if it's your first time doing end game you think everyone is like that. Which isn't true.

HNM camping just isn't as "endgame" as it used to be. The modern endgame areas dont need 64 people. The hardest thing to do right now is probably Einherjar, and besides the fact that you can get by in wing 3 with less than 25 and do Odin with 15, its usually not hard to pick up extras by shouting in advance. Tier1-Tier4 ZNMs can be done with as little as solo and as many as a medium to full alliance, much of which you can pick up out of shout since the battle strategies aren't that complicated. Salvage and Nyzul Isle are really popular now and Dynamis and Limbus were revitalized a bit because of all the new additions. Black Belt items, Defending Ring, Ridill, and Hauteclaire are the only real treats left from HNM camping. The Ixion, Sandworm, and even many of the ZNM items aren't exclusive drops so it's not too difficult to pass on camping and still obtain one. Even ebody is much easier to get. Friends of mine are using the your-Odin-your-choice-of-drop to try to get e.body by saving up all 9 feathers and skipping on Odins until they do.

I don't think endgame is anywhere near dead, just... different. One of the things I tend to see is members of larger endgame shells making their own endgame groups for things like Salvage Nyzul Isle, Limbus and using their bigger endgame shell for ZNMs and Einherjar. Fewer and fewer people are interested in camping anything at all.

Lol who camps it 24/7. Thats why there are windows and if you dont know the ToD you can always use /sea and stalk a camper/mule lol

Way back in the Decemeber on Siren when prices inflated on everything to like 2~300% and we stopped seeing RMT everyone thought SE waved a magic wand and actually got all the RMT. Nope after holiday was over they were back cause they were either just locked up or on vacation.

I've heard a lot of bad things about endgame but havent encountered any of it yet doing sky/dynamis though I haven't tried HNM as most shells I know require you to have 3 75 jobs.

As far as I know HNM = camp a spot till NM spawns and you got to be skilled at claiming to beat the other 10 or so people who are there also. If SE didnt want it to be like this they would have had plently of time to change spawn times / other ways of getting the item drops.

For my dynamis shell; attendance is taken, points awaded and put up on the website and those been there longest will have more points to lot. One guy had saved points because he had waited over 6 months for his item to drop and wanted to make damn sure he got it if it ever did drop.

The members of endgame linkshells watch closely what the leader does and no way are they going to stick around if they notice unfair play because endgame is pretty time intensive and the rewards are big.

Korpg ... chill man... endgame = minimum 3 hours time investment with short breaks, plan your days accordingly and do some recon on the shell you've joined by asking friends what they know about the shell.

My brother's old endgame shell required him to turn up for ~4 HNM in a row, none of which he was allowed to afk for more than 5min for drinks and wc and such for. They expected him to turn up to their LS dyna at 2am (our time) and do other stuff, such as Sky for 2-3 hours.

(That could've changed now, apparently one of the officers that was insanely bitchy about pointless stuff left, so I'm not sure what happens now. I'm also not giving any LS/Player names in case he was exaggerating >.>)

From what I've heard from other friends in EG links and situations like that, they have similar rules. I've camped some HNM in the past, Roc, Serk, KA, Behe, Cassie, Bune, etc.

More populated ones, such as Serk and Roc I hate, no real chance to AFK for an extended period of time if you expect to get claim (without stooping to the level of using Claimbots). Behe and KA I enjoy doing because of windows and Knight Crabs to tell when pops, so you don't actually need to be there all the time to claim. Cassie and Bune I don't camp perfectly while they aren't normally as populated as the rest, normally just sit near pop area, check back every 10-15min.

endgame camping requires you to be present for.....

king camps = 7 seconds during 3 hour camps. then the time to kill, all rage in under an hour, so 1 hour max?

tiamat = 144 seconds over a span of 3 days? (this might be wrong), time to kill for good shells, under 1 hour.

toau NMs = 24 seconds over the span of 1 day, good shells once again kill in about 1 hour.

this is a waste of time? besides events, if you are in a shell that does these NMs around the clock, you have more time then u think to do things besides play ffxi.