This stuff reminds me of "interesting" XBOX Live bans from a couple of years ago:
Not many people back then knew that XBOX 360 profiles store a truckload of information about your gaming habits. So I seen examples of people taking their gamertag data to the PC and hacking their achievements then "getting away with it".
Years later, they get reported for something stupid as swearing on a kid's game, an XBOX Live employee scrutinize their gamertag data (enforcement policy), the hacking is seen and a permanent ban is issued for a hack that happened some three years ago. Life suck, eh ?
Ban Stick
Ban Stick
Why can't they catch the freaking players copying salvage floors again. I hate to see these players running around after being temp banned and continue to do so.
[+]
Cerberus.Conagh said: »
Jetackuu said: »
Matter of interpretation, but I can agree to disagree.
Well lets look at it logically.
Does the ToS state that you can not use any third party tools that interfere with FFXI?
Yes.
But you using a website, that simply displays someones else's info, is not you using a third party tool, someone else is using it.
So it's their breach not yours.
It's almost tantermount to watching a video of someone shouting JPRONY in Town and getting banned, you're not doing it, you're simply watching it.
We could look at it logically, but that's not what you just did.
What don't you comprehend about "up to interpretation" ?
Also your analogy isn't accurate, fyi.
I'll answer in the morning when it's not -25°C anymore hopefully. If you have questions regarding GMs and policies, you can ask me or a GM directly in game. They're supposed to answer those questions as long as you're not making drama.
I'm used to +8 in the south of france in winter. I'm in montreal atm.
Cerberus.Senkyuutai said: »
I'm used to +8 in the south of france in winter. I'm in montreal atm.
Welcome to montreal!
It appears most of the bans seem to be from using EZ Farm but there are a few others that did not use said tool and still received a ban for botting for no apparent reason or description... (also, fyi, calling someone a 'cockgobblin' in game is grounds for a ban). Some of the bigger player bans like Draylo, however, were from cheating by legitimately exploiting the game rather than doing something like simply running an AFK script.
I had pondered whether SE was screen scraping / checking processes for any 3PP (like windower/gearswap/etc) with one of their recent updates but a friend had mentioned that he dissected the application as well as monitored bandwidth usage and found the application doing nothing of the sort. Either way, best course of action from now on out is to play the game as intended ya'll bunch of cheats ;)
I had pondered whether SE was screen scraping / checking processes for any 3PP (like windower/gearswap/etc) with one of their recent updates but a friend had mentioned that he dissected the application as well as monitored bandwidth usage and found the application doing nothing of the sort. Either way, best course of action from now on out is to play the game as intended ya'll bunch of cheats ;)
Hmmm, posted 18 minutes ago, not on the latest forum thread topics on main page... Someone trying to hide the thread~
Bahamut.Malothar said: »
Cerberus.Senkyuutai said: »
GMs are here to enforce policies. Why do people cry when they do? No matter if there are 3 players left, policies exist, GMs are here to enforce them.
Either stay clean or get your *** enforced, that's all.
Either stay clean or get your *** enforced, that's all.
Such a muddy issue overall. Even staying clean isn't enough though. Back in 2006 my original character was hacked/banned. Was all bad luck from my understanding. Maybe a week or two prior to the happenings, a friend had quit and left his account in my hands. I transferred everything over from it, gil, gear, even the most basic of NPCables cause my main had capped fame for more gil lol. That apparently flagged me as RMT. Fast forward a week or two and I catch that iframe issue that was going on with...ffxi.somepage? I forget the site. Anyways, hacked, personal info changed, all that fun stuff. CS was less than helpful, but I was able to get the notarized form that you had to fax them back. Send that in, give em a call 2 days later, and find out the account was banned for RMT activity before the hacking. And this was at a time when bannings weren't reversed. :/
Besides, it's difficult to take the white knight approach and say stay clean and you're safe when you see dozens of people speed/pos hacking daily, people botting reives, botting skill ups, bragging about dupping, farming Ramparts, etc. Hell, on Bahamut 3 of my friends pretty much straight bot JPs 24/5 and only actually play on the weekends. It's even had the interesting effect of making our Unity rank 1 for over a 1.5 months in a row with 1.5-2x the points of the 2nd ranked Unity. Nothing has been done. Not saying I want it to, but seeing these things happen, it's difficult to imagine people actually getting banned anymore. Besides the recent-ish Salvage temp bans, I can't even recall the last person that I know that was banned.
Regarding the second paragraph, well, either you want to stay clean and stick to your principles, or you don't.
I have personally done things that were against the ToS, a lot of them. Some of them that weren't used by most people, I had this bad habit of trying anything I'd find from a specific place. But the thing is, I didn't use any of that in a way that would make me be banned. I didn't fishbot, I didn't flee hack (not even that small % most people use), I didn't skillbot, no claim bot either (JPs did that for me), whatever, those are retard traps. And when I did stuff, I didn't go on BG to brag about it in my own thread, like some people did, thinking they were safe (even private BG isn't safe, I thought people knew that).
I'm not saying stay clean at all cost, I can perfectly understand wanting to use a couple things that make life easier yet are punished, all I'm saying is, if you're an idiot that is going to get caught one day due to your practices, then play on PS2 (and by you, I mean anyone that got caught, ever, not you specifically). I was jailed a few times and I always came out of it without any punishment, at all. That was before I was an employee. Was I clean? No. Was anyone able to prove I did anything against the ToS? Nope. People would report me every day, 4 of them at least due to HNM competition, which is why I was jailed, but false reports are just that, false reports.
I join you in being frustrated that specific players bot (any bot) every day and nothing is done. I can't say too much here but, you're right, those people won't get punished, but for very specific reasons. The policies are sometimes flawed but not by mistake, it's completely intended to be flawed. I can tell you that there is a good reason as to why, but at the same time there is a bad reason. Those players can still be punished, though, it's just more difficult.
There are a few names from here and BG who specialized in that "smart" flee hacking, for example. Only putting max speed within instances, and only using 12%~ at best in cities. Some of them got banned, but that was difficult enough that running after every single one of them would have taken 2 years at the very least, and I had other things to do.
All I can tell you if to play for yourself and what you think is right. If it turns to ***, accept the consequences. It's honestly difficult to get punished as long as you don't anger other players and don't brag on forums. If you avoid these 2 steps, and don't try to test their item/gil system either, you'll be fine. But even then, nowadays, the item/gil system can be bypassed with a phone call.
Jetackuu said: »
Bahamut.Malothar said: »
Cerberus.Senkyuutai said: »
GMs are here to enforce policies. Why do people cry when they do? No matter if there are 3 players left, policies exist, GMs are here to enforce them.
Either stay clean or get your *** enforced, that's all.
Either stay clean or get your *** enforced, that's all.
Such a muddy issue overall. Even staying clean isn't enough though. Back in 2006 my original character was hacked/banned. Was all bad luck from my understanding. Maybe a week or two prior to the happenings, a friend had quit and left his account in my hands. I transferred everything over from it, gil, gear, even the most basic of NPCables cause my main had capped fame for more gil lol. That apparently flagged me as RMT. Fast forward a week or two and I catch that iframe issue that was going on with...ffxi.somepage? I forget the site. Anyways, hacked, personal info changed, all that fun stuff. CS was less than helpful, but I was able to get the notarized form that you had to fax them back. Send that in, give em a call 2 days later, and find out the account was banned for RMT activity before the hacking. And this was at a time when bannings weren't reversed. :/
Besides, it's difficult to take the white knight approach and say stay clean and you're safe when you see dozens of people speed/pos hacking daily, people botting reives, botting skill ups, bragging about dupping, farming Ramparts, etc. Hell, on Bahamut 3 of my friends pretty much straight bot JPs 24/5 and only actually play on the weekends. It's even had the interesting effect of making our Unity rank 1 for over a 1.5 months in a row with 1.5-2x the points of the 2nd ranked Unity. Nothing has been done. Not saying I want it to, but seeing these things happen, it's difficult to imagine people actually getting banned anymore. Besides the recent-ish Salvage temp bans, I can't even recall the last person that I know that was banned.
It's kind of hard to argue against a guy who thinks they're doing nothing wrong, and everything for the sake of getting RMT is justified.
Personally I don't care if the rest of the playerbase is flee hacking and buying/selling gil 24/7/365, I'm not, and a lot of others aren't either. Hell technically just by using this site is a violation of the ToS if we want to get to the bottom of the barrel.
GMs actually advise you to use "community websites" when you have gameplay questions. Says enough to me.
Sylph.Staleyx said: »
Why can't they catch the freaking players copying salvage floors again. I hate to see these players running around after being temp banned and continue to do so.
My advice is to report those players before you know they'll cheat. If they had never cheated before, they got a 72h suspension, meaning they are one punishment away from a ban, but that doesn't mean SE will track them specifically. Just report them, if they're seen doing that they'll be gone.
Leviathan.Klue said: »
It appears most of the bans seem to be from using EZ Farm but there are a few others that did not use said tool and still received a ban for botting for no apparent reason or description... (also, fyi, calling someone a 'cockgobblin' in game is grounds for a ban). Some of the bigger player bans like Draylo, however, were from cheating by legitimately exploiting the game rather than doing something like simply running an AFK script.
I had pondered whether SE was screen scraping / checking processes for any 3PP (like windower/gearswap/etc) with one of their recent updates but a friend had mentioned that he dissected the application as well as monitored bandwidth usage and found the application doing nothing of the sort. Either way, best course of action from now on out is to play the game as intended ya'll bunch of cheats ;)
I had pondered whether SE was screen scraping / checking processes for any 3PP (like windower/gearswap/etc) with one of their recent updates but a friend had mentioned that he dissected the application as well as monitored bandwidth usage and found the application doing nothing of the sort. Either way, best course of action from now on out is to play the game as intended ya'll bunch of cheats ;)
Odin.Nikia said: »
Cerberus.Senkyuutai said: »
Jetackuu said: »
Bahamut.Malothar said: »
Cerberus.Senkyuutai said: »
GMs are here to enforce policies. Why do people cry when they do? No matter if there are 3 players left, policies exist, GMs are here to enforce them.
Either stay clean or get your *** enforced, that's all.
Either stay clean or get your *** enforced, that's all.
Such a muddy issue overall. Even staying clean isn't enough though. Back in 2006 my original character was hacked/banned. Was all bad luck from my understanding. Maybe a week or two prior to the happenings, a friend had quit and left his account in my hands. I transferred everything over from it, gil, gear, even the most basic of NPCables cause my main had capped fame for more gil lol. That apparently flagged me as RMT. Fast forward a week or two and I catch that iframe issue that was going on with...ffxi.somepage? I forget the site. Anyways, hacked, personal info changed, all that fun stuff. CS was less than helpful, but I was able to get the notarized form that you had to fax them back. Send that in, give em a call 2 days later, and find out the account was banned for RMT activity before the hacking. And this was at a time when bannings weren't reversed. :/
Besides, it's difficult to take the white knight approach and say stay clean and you're safe when you see dozens of people speed/pos hacking daily, people botting reives, botting skill ups, bragging about dupping, farming Ramparts, etc. Hell, on Bahamut 3 of my friends pretty much straight bot JPs 24/5 and only actually play on the weekends. It's even had the interesting effect of making our Unity rank 1 for over a 1.5 months in a row with 1.5-2x the points of the 2nd ranked Unity. Nothing has been done. Not saying I want it to, but seeing these things happen, it's difficult to imagine people actually getting banned anymore. Besides the recent-ish Salvage temp bans, I can't even recall the last person that I know that was banned.
It's kind of hard to argue against a guy who thinks they're doing nothing wrong, and everything for the sake of getting RMT is justified.
Personally I don't care if the rest of the playerbase is flee hacking and buying/selling gil 24/7/365, I'm not, and a lot of others aren't either. Hell technically just by using this site is a violation of the ToS if we want to get to the bottom of the barrel.
GMs actually advise you to use "community websites" when you have gameplay questions. Says enough to me.
Sylph.Staleyx said: »
Why can't they catch the freaking players copying salvage floors again. I hate to see these players running around after being temp banned and continue to do so.
My advice is to report those players before you know they'll cheat. If they had never cheated before, they got a 72h suspension, meaning they are one punishment away from a ban, but that doesn't mean SE will track them specifically. Just report them, if they're seen doing that they'll be gone.
WIKI is considered a community site, BGWiki and FFXIAH are not, so they are considered third party and are against the TOS.
BG wiki is, well, ahem, a wiki, so, yeah, and FFXIAH is mostly advised for its forums. The whole character profile isn't really something worth getting angry over, or worth talking about when you advise a player to ask for help on how to guess a drop rate.
ok just here to call *** on them investigating temp bans i created a new char right the *** now put that *** on vomp hill and reported her botting from main instant warp to hp no tell no anything
btw she had yet to swing her onion dagger even once they are just blindly taking peoples word for it
You'll get a message redirecting you to the STF. Doesn't mean they won't investigate, they just go if they're sure to catch something.
so they warped her even though she has never performed any action on a mob or even used windower lol
I've actually had GMs direct me to this website as well as BG and FFXIclopedia so I don't think we're going to get banned for using them. Although one of them did feel iffy about me interacting with the people on the BG forums and recommend I ask questions here instead xD
well at the very least if someone is in your cp camp just gm them so they get warped and you get your camp
Cerberus.Anjisnu said: »
so they warped her even though she has never performed any action on a mob or even used windower lol
I don't think anyone here ever said people don't ever get grabbed quickly. Probably goes case by case and if investigation is needed, it would be done. If the current case info on hand doesn't seem to merit further investigation, you get what happened to your character.
The system isn't by any means perfect but after working at various companies that handle this type of thing, I cant say IMO that there one.
wouldn't mind seeing some proof of a claim like that
pretty pathetic if they don't even investigate
pretty pathetic if they don't even investigate
If you were banned while afk and you don't see stuff in logger it might be due to them asking with a box to click on yes, it happened to me once while fishing but I wasn't afk and this never appeared on logger.
Asura.Ccl said: »
If you were banned while afk and you don't see stuff in logger it might be due to them asking with a box to click on yes, it happened to me once while fishing but I wasn't afk and this never appeared on logger.
Leviathan.Comeatmebro said: »
wouldn't mind seeing some proof of a claim like that
pretty pathetic if they don't even investigate
pretty pathetic if they don't even investigate
I'd say its par for the course and I don't mean just for S-E. I've worked with (and in some cases, for) some payment processors (Paypal and Visa included) that enforce policy in this manner. It's just how it goes sometimes.
Leviathan.Comeatmebro said: »
wouldn't mind seeing some proof of a claim like that
pretty pathetic if they don't even investigate
pretty pathetic if they don't even investigate
would have to record her red dotting from main since i put her on an xbox
Leviathan.Klue said: »
lol @ vomp hill
Odin.Nikia said: »
I kinda amazes me, one day you can read post after post how SE doesnt ban for anything anymore. Read posts about people in dyna flee hacking day after day with multiple reports with no bans.
Then other days people act like there is literally a GM running through zones with a "ban-stick" randomly smacking folks.
Then other days people act like there is literally a GM running through zones with a "ban-stick" randomly smacking folks.
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