Effects Of MAB Vs Magic Damage+ & When To Use Ea

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Effects of MAB vs Magic Damage+ & when to use ea
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 Bahamut.Rubican
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By Bahamut.Rubican 2014-12-14 14:01:22
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Okay! I would like to have a discussion (that I have not found around yet) That is when does Magic Damage+ become inferior to MAB.
I understand that lower tiers MD+ is much better and for high tiers MAB is better. But where does that line cross over? is it at Fire III like I have been told? or is it just after tier 3s. I have attempted to use some of the damage calculators and failed. So I am hoping there is some good feed back from you, my fellow blms :3
 Asura.Darvamos
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By Asura.Darvamos 2014-12-14 14:55:36
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Probably because I personally haven't seen a calc that has ever been updated to use the new mdmg formula.

P.S. - Easy enough to do when I get some time tomorrow I'll make one.


Nevermind -> DPS/Magic Spreadsheets
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By FaeQueenCory 2014-12-14 15:01:20
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It really depends on the slot more than the tier of spell. (Though obviously Mdmg is most noticeable with T1s, it still is potent even on a T5...)
So you basically want both.
For things like shoes, pants, and hands: the BiS are Umuthi (Marjami Delve), Hagondes+1, and Otomi regardless of any other gear.
There's some that have more INT, or more Mdmg, and even some with slightly more MAB...
But it's the fact that these all have Mdmg AND MAB that make them the absolute best in slot for all nukes.

But then you have belts, ammo, capes, body, and hats.
That's a give and take dependent more on what else you have in other slots.
The +13Mdmg ammo generally tends to perform much better than any of the MAB ammos... But that can change based on tier of spell and what else you're using.
The Incursion belt is also extremely potent. Namely because it has MAB and INT.
Same thing with capes. A perfectly augmented JSE can outperform the WKR cape... But iirc the difference tends to favor the WKR due to dINT.
As for bodies... I have no idea why all Mdmg bodies lack refresh... But at the moment they do. So I tend to favor massive MAB in that slot personally. (Hagondes+1, Artesiq, or even Bokwus)
Hats are basically the opposite. One of the best for nukes is the tree WKR hat with +35Mdmg. But the MAB on many of the hats can be more potent. (Iirc RF2+1 is BiS for nukes due to it having MAB and just a massive ***ton of Macc.)

So it really depends on your target, spell tier, and what else you have gear wise.
But what I've laid out is a general guideline for the most potent.
 Ragnarok.Martel
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By Ragnarok.Martel 2014-12-14 15:02:05
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I'll just leave this here...
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 Asura.Darvamos
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By Asura.Darvamos 2014-12-14 15:08:39
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Ragnarok.Martel said: »
I'll just leave this here...

I never noticed the magic dmg calc files. I always use them for the dps ones.
 Bahamut.Rubican
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By Bahamut.Rubican 2014-12-28 12:26:28
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yea. . . me and dps spread sheets do not get along well . . .
i never seem to be able to work them LMAO
which is ironic, as I make spreadsheets to track and calculate things for a living LMAO >.<
But definitely thank you for the links to them. I will try and figure them out.
 Siren.Kyte
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By Siren.Kyte 2014-12-28 13:01:43
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What about them isn't working?
necroskull Necro Bump Detected! [85 days between previous and next post]
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By lhova 2015-03-23 18:49:45
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I don't have a pic atm (on iPad) but curious if anyone could post sets they use for V2 Yorcia skirmish on blm and which augs to target. Thank you!
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By Miang 2015-03-23 19:05:43
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I've only stared on blm in the past day or two, so it's basically my SCH nuke set but with toro cape instead of bookworms (with INT+5). I've got Ombre+1 and Elder Grip +1 because T3+ they start to pull ahead over zuuxowu and dosis, and when I do yorcia I'm using T3+. The augs I have on hago is +28 MAB on body and +26 on head/legs. The augs I have on helios are INT+7,MAB+25 and Occult acumen+8. I'd prefer to have INT+10 and occult+10, but random augs are random, and I've not tried for long.

ItemSet 334068
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 Siren.Sieha
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By Siren.Sieha 2015-03-23 19:06:04
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what do you need a pic for?
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By lhova 2015-03-23 19:27:45
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Siren.Sieha said: »
what do you need a pic for?
Pc, damn auto correct... Thanks Miang. Are you able to 1 shot the eles in yorcia? I'm alway on book so not sure how well blms do in this content other than if I have great blms we win, shitty ones and I lost on a 221 on the first floor...
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By Miang 2015-03-23 19:37:48
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I've not done Yorcia on BLM yet, only SCH, but T4 of the correct opposing element always 1 shots them for me, assuming they aren't *** wind or light eles who always have blink up.

I suggest learning your ele weaknesses so you can T4 spam each, but if it's a wind or light ele, use T1/T2.
 
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 Lakshmi.Amymy
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By Lakshmi.Amymy 2015-03-23 19:56:25
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Miang said: »
I've only stared on blm in the past day or two, so it's basically my SCH nuke set but with toro cape instead of bookworms (with INT+5). I've got Ombre+1 and Elder Grip +1 because T3+ they start to pull ahead over zuuxowu and dosis, and when I do yorcia I'm using T3+. The augs I have on hago is +28 MAB on body and +26 on head/legs. The augs I have on helios are INT+7,MAB+25 and Occult acumen+8. I'd prefer to have INT+10 and occult+10, but random augs are random, and I've not tried for long.

ItemSet 334068

6 intelligence on ammo beats 13 magic damage?
And 4 mab on grip beats 10 magic damage?

Just wondering cause I thought those magic damage beats those.
 
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By 2015-03-23 20:06:52
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By Miang 2015-03-23 20:07:03
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For higher tier nukes yes the INT and MAB start to outdo mdmg, you can do a quick test on lvl 1 mobs in starter zones to see for yourself. Also on higher content, the macc/INT helps with resists too.
 Lakshmi.Amymy
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By Lakshmi.Amymy 2015-03-23 21:59:19
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Miang said: »
For higher tier nukes yes the INT and MAB start to outdo mdmg, you can do a quick test on lvl 1 mobs in starter zones to see for yourself. Also on higher content, the macc/INT helps with resists too.

thanks for the explanation ^^
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By lhova 2015-03-24 07:37:24
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Is there a reference chart to determine which spells are strongest against which elementals? Also do these elementals have relatively low hp? I just don't get how peeps can one shot them but in my 555 runs I see some of the blms taking significant damage and sometimes dying.
 Lakshmi.Byrth
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By Lakshmi.Byrth 2015-03-24 07:47:02
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Elementals are the same on a 1/1/1 run or a 5/5/5 run. There's no difference. I one-shot them with Tier 4s, -aga IIIs (single target), or -aja (up to 6 targets).
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By lhova 2015-03-24 09:04:24
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Lakshmi.Byrth said: »
Elementals are the same on a 1/1/1 run or a 5/5/5 run. There's no difference. I one-shot them with Tier 4s, -aga IIIs (single target), or -aja (up to 6 targets).

When you are talking about 1 shotting them are you implying that the "average" blm should be able to do this or just really pimped out Blm's? I'm only asking because there are runs when I'm seeing Blm's dying or taking massive damage and if they should be 1 shotting them, then I don't get it.

Also is their a reference somewhere to determine which spells ele's are weak to?
 Ragnarok.Martel
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By Ragnarok.Martel 2015-03-24 09:18:24
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Lakshmi.Byrth said: »
Elementals are the same on a 1/1/1 run or a 5/5/5 run. There's no difference. I one-shot them with Tier 4s, -aga IIIs (single target), or -aja (up to 6 targets).
I thought -ja spells didn't have a number of targets factor in it's dmg calculation? But looking around on wiki's I can't find anything on this now... Just a misconception of mine? No idea where I got it if so.
 Asura.Carrotchan
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By Asura.Carrotchan 2015-03-24 09:20:43
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On mobile so this is painful

Fire ele: water
Fire/light ele: water
Earth ele: wind
Earth/dark ele: wind
Water ele: Thunder
Water/ice ele: Thunder
Wind ele: ice
Wind/thunder ele: ice
Ice ele: Fire
Thunder ele: earth

Hope this helps?
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 Lakshmi.Byrth
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By Lakshmi.Byrth 2015-03-24 09:23:10
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There is still a number of targets in the -ja calculations, iirc.

Elementals aren't really weak to a particular magic. They are strong against their own element and the element that makes sense. Light/Dark elementals are only strong against light or dark, respectively.

Earth > Wind > Ice > Fire > Water > Thunder > Earth

Hybrid elementals are wonky and don't appear to be strong against the next element in the chain for both of their elements. I haven't done much testing on this because I still just cast what they wouldn't resist.
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 Siren.Sieha
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By Siren.Sieha 2015-03-24 10:04:56
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Ok so I have seen this go a few different ways. Assuming equally geared, which is a better nuker on this, sch or blm?

I am sure that sch would be able to maintain mp better but does blm really have a spot with being better at nuking or are they about equal and sch has better mp efficiency?

I usually run it with blu and smn so kind of curious.
 Sylph.Scummy
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By Sylph.Scummy 2015-03-24 10:06:20
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lhova said: »
Lakshmi.Byrth said: »
Elementals are the same on a 1/1/1 run or a 5/5/5 run. There's no difference. I one-shot them with Tier 4s, -aga IIIs (single target), or -aja (up to 6 targets).

When you are talking about 1 shotting them are you implying that the "average" blm should be able to do this or just really pimped out Blm's? I'm only asking because there are runs when I'm seeing Blm's dying or taking massive damage and if they should be 1 shotting them, then I don't get it.

Also is their a reference somewhere to determine which spells ele's are weak to?

If you are doing Eudaemon Sword pops, the later floors start to hit really hard, upwards of 500/hit. Also, some BLM's still only "Thunder all the things!".
 Bismarck.Snprphnx
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By Bismarck.Snprphnx 2015-03-24 10:09:24
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As far as I've seen, BLM is better for -agas, since SCH/BLM only gets a few tier 2 agas. But single target, SCH should win, with the ability to use tier 2 storms and up to tier 5s.

Not sure about MP efficiency. SCH is pretty good, not sure about BLM.
 Asura.Psylo
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By Asura.Psylo 2015-03-24 10:29:22
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Quote:
Not sure about MP efficiency. SCH is pretty good, not sure about BLM.

Just use an MP convert Body, meeble one or AF reforge one for BLM.
I use it as RDM in aluvion yorcia, Tier V one shoot ele, and never (never) have mp issue.

and all ele (exclude dark based) can be aspir (I/II) very well, as RDM my aspir go up to 150 mp per ele, BLM or SCH can break it easly (since aspir/drain augment on helios too)
 Bismarck.Snprphnx
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By Bismarck.Snprphnx 2015-03-24 10:42:00
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Asura.Psylo said: »
Quote:
Not sure about MP efficiency. SCH is pretty good, not sure about BLM.

Just use an MP convert Body, meeble one or AF reforge one for BLM.
I use it as RDM in aluvion yorcia, Tier V one shoot ele, and never (never) have mp issue.

and all ele (exclude dark based) can be aspir (I/II) very well, as RDM my aspir go up to 150 mp per ele, BLM or SCH can break it easly (since aspir/drain augment on helios too)

SCH and /sch can Manifestaion > Aspir
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