[dev1243] New Job Enhancements: Gifts

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[dev1243] New Job Enhancements: Gifts
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 Bismarck.Ranthozyk
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By Bismarck.Ranthozyk 2014-11-27 22:11:48
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Seeing as high-end shells want to do things "most efficiently" they will likely not take those jobs, no. Even with 18 slots available. Just because there's room for these jobs doesn't mean that the community stigma doesn't prevent them from being included, or that "cutting down time" via throwing more "optimized jobs" is less meaningful when you expand to 18 slots. The 18 man group will still just look for more of the same bandwagon jobs. Realistically in a high tier end game linkshell, if you have GEO and, say, BST leveled, they are going to ask you to come GEO every single time. And PUG will also not take them due to previously mentioned stigma. Their only option is to get incredibly lucky with a rare understanding PUG shout group, or solo the entirety of their JPs. Grinding EXP was much faster than JP.
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By Kooljack 2014-11-27 22:12:09
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zomg 15 att&15def bonus and 'needing' 50 jp total for said job to equip SU.. guys its not a big deal. get over it.
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By Kooljack 2014-11-27 22:14:00
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@ ranthozyk. not over night but slowly the double linkpearl equip will slowly deteriorate the 'click' stigma we've dealt with throughout the game's history. its progress in right direction truely

everyone has a damn paragraph to cry about this job points? serisouly? a one time litte 15attack/acc/def bonus isn't game changing nor is needing 50 job points to equip su1'.

some people live and love the fact that there IS something to grind FOR
 Lakshmi.Aelius
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By Lakshmi.Aelius 2014-11-27 22:18:45
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Kooljack said: »
everyone has a damn paragraph to cry about this job points? serisouly? a one time litte 15attack/acc/def bonus isn't game changing nor is needing 50 job points to equip su1'.

Unless this superior piece gives +250 attack per each equipment attached, why not?

We still haven't seen what these pieces are. It's too early to make a decision about it.
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By Kooljack 2014-11-27 22:31:53
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Lakshmi.Aelius said: »
Kooljack said: »
everyone has a damn paragraph to cry about this job points? serisouly? a one time litte 15attack/acc/def bonus isn't game changing nor is needing 50 job points to equip su1'.

Unless this superior piece gives +250 attack per each equipment attached, why not?

We still haven't seen what these pieces are. It's too early to make a decision about it.

yea so is it really that big of a deal you have to grind out some xp old school style to get it?

Its bringing back the oldschool grind in an normal xp pt. there is a lot of missed connection with the old days that people reminisce about. Jesus forbid SE did something to bring something back, that a lot of people missed about the old days and are rewarding your efforts for doing so /salute SE.

next update will be for you. But let one update help bring bang the mantra of the old a little bit without you all crying about it.
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 Lakshmi.Aelius
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By Lakshmi.Aelius 2014-11-27 22:34:01
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Exactly! Kinda miss the full party connection.
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By Kooljack 2014-11-27 22:37:02
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exactly, i don't even understand..

find 5 friends. team up and go to woh gates and kill the 6 frogs right at the zone line. you kill those plus the two butterfly's and you're getting 45 merits in 1 hour of work.(30mins with campaign)

then take the merits go bang out some HTBCNMs for some goodies. rinse and repeat. its downright awesome. it's adding variety and reason to the game. the whole HTBCNM song in addition to this jobP thing going on now is a really cool thing
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By Kooljack 2014-11-27 22:43:36
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if all they ever did was add new HTBCNMs with new goodies and expand Job point system slowly I'd be happy as hell for a long time. they compliment each other quite nicely

infact my post signature is gonna be like, '/hail the new grind'. i for one, love the direction they are going with it.
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 Lakshmi.Aelius
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By Lakshmi.Aelius 2014-11-27 22:50:19
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Might resub if it brings back that old party vibe.
 Ragnarok.Afania
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By Ragnarok.Afania 2014-11-27 22:53:54
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Bismarck.Inference said: »
I don't know how this hasn't been made clear yet, but to say again: Most people don't think that the current amount of JP required to unlock the sets is a lot. For people who really enjoy a specific job, there probably is no breakpoint for when it will be "a lot".

The problem is the continuous grind for nothing. I'd have to compete with 14-17 other people for gear I want, deal with the randomness of the drops, then go out and farm the JP on every job I want to use that piece of equipment on.

It matters very little that I got 20 JP on SCH from Incursion when my job of interest is something entirely different. I'm all for needing to grind JP to get meaningful job-related upgrades such as traits/spells, but gear is something I earned from doing something entirely different already.


Just view this as lv cap increase. If you are lv 75 you can't equip higher lv gears after lv cap increase.....until you grind your lv up.

All those anti-grind comment is truly confusing. Mmorpg has been about grinding BEFORE you can do epic bosses and equip epic gears. If I create a new char in another mmo, I would start on lv1 and need time to catch up before I can even equip something better.

If you have issue with grinding in a mmorpg, then this genre isn't for you. Maybe you should play moba or something.
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 Sylph.Feary
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By Sylph.Feary 2014-11-27 22:54:40
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Quetzalcoatl.Kainstryder said: »
Just to reiterate a point from the old days that many seem to have forgotten or may not have been around for, but the small little bonuses we're getting from the Gift system and from Job Points (yes many are not worth it or way too much grinding): people use to murder each other and break linkshells over Salvage and Dynamis drops. Remember when you'd see a Valor Surcoat, Duelist's Chapeau or 35 Usukane feet drop? You ***yourself, despite most things were not game breaking, just side grades or slight boosts.

This game use to be a giant grind fest that rewarded you with marginally better equipment or side grades and you *** loved it. You'd spend a month doing something and when you finally got it, you either felt "thank *** god" or "OMG YESSSS" or both. ***was an accomplishment and set it apart from other MMOs. You wanted easy mode? There was WoW which people back then would quit FFXI, go to WoW and return in 2 weeks saying "nothing to do there, got all gear and did everything." Nowadays, every time there's an update with small things/rewards for massive grinding it's a *** fest topped with "there's nothing to do, add more hard content" I understand grinding doesn't equal hard, but remember what this game use to be and people wanting the old days back.

This game is turning into WoW with how easy/fast it is to get equipment, but still keeps some things difficult and grindy, which is why most play FFXI.

well said
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 Quetzalcoatl.Valli
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By Quetzalcoatl.Valli 2014-11-27 22:57:18
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See, that's not the complaint here. We all know what we signed up for. We all know that MMO = Grind city. The problem is the blantant bold-faced lie.

JP are supposed to be just little bonus things we get as we do events, as they said. (with exceptions like hasso that are clearly broken).

So, if you didn't want that +10 attack on berserk, that's fine, totally ignore JP no one is going to fault you for not going out of your way to grind all night and day for it.

But now it's being FORCED on us, after being told otherwise. You seriously don't understand the difference?
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 Ragnarok.Afania
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By Ragnarok.Afania 2014-11-27 23:03:35
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Fenrir.Camiie said: »
Creecreelo said: »
Proth, I have read the entire thread actually and surprisingly to myself. I think the below is an excellent argument as to why you should already have 50 CP for the jobs you actually play in this game.

Unless you're new or returning or missed the campaign, but who cares about people like that?

And of course there's no sympathy for those who didn't foresee the need to max out JP before SE retconned them into relevance.


Its not that we don't care about new player, its just how mmorpg works: time investment and progression. If you create a new char in any mmo, you would need time to catch up. If you can't accept it, play another genre.

If you don't have enough jp, grind them after update then. Jp grind efficiency only get better as time progress. If you start late you actually save more time.
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By ScaevolaBahamut 2014-11-27 23:03:46
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The tragic thing is but for the superior tiers this would actually be a pretty great shot in the arm for JP.
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 Ragnarok.Afania
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By Ragnarok.Afania 2014-11-27 23:16:34
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Quetzalcoatl.Valli said: »
See, that's not the complaint here. We all know what we signed up for. We all know that MMO = Grind city. The problem is the blantant bold-faced lie.


JP are supposed to be just little bonus things we get as we do events, as they said. (with exceptions like hasso that are clearly broken).

So, if you didn't want that +10 attack on berserk, that's fine, totally ignore JP no one is going to fault you for not going out of your way to grind all night and day for it.

But now it's being FORCED on us, after being told otherwise. You seriously don't understand the difference?


It seems that ppl are complaining about the need to grind, not how se change jp design goal though.

If se allows the player to obtain 30 jp per hr, then make every ilv 130 gears only useable with jp investment, I bet nobody would complain.

The real issue is that some ppl expect mmorpg to be something different.
 Asura.Loire
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By Asura.Loire 2014-11-27 23:17:48
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Quetzalcoatl.Valli said: »
See, that's not the complaint here. We all know what we signed up for. We all know that MMO = Grind city. The problem is the blantant bold-faced lie.

JP are supposed to be just little bonus things we get as we do events, as they said. (with exceptions like hasso that are clearly broken).

So, if you didn't want that +10 attack on berserk, that's fine, totally ignore JP no one is going to fault you for not going out of your way to grind all night and day for it.

But now it's being FORCED on us, after being told otherwise. You seriously don't understand the difference?
Just because they stated that originally doesn't mean that it needs to remain that way. Further to that extent, who knows what they'll include in adjustments to generate CP with these patches to come.
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 Quetzalcoatl.Valli
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By Quetzalcoatl.Valli 2014-11-27 23:33:43
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Ok, here's an example.

Otomi Helm gets an upgrade, it's now called Otomi Helm Su

Sure, you have your 50 JP on SAM, you can wear it, (once you jump the hoop to obtain it).

What about your WAR, your DRG, your DRK you now have to get 50 jp on each job, or use a subpar helm because you upgraded your Otomi to be worn on SAM.

You're all ok with this? Cause I'm not. And I couldn't care less, I can easily get the 50 points for ANY job. But people I know cannot, it's them I'm concerned for.
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By mortontony1 2014-11-27 23:46:17
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Quetzalcoatl.Valli said: »
Ok, here's an example.

Otomi Helm gets an upgrade, it's now called Otomi Helm Su

Sure, you have your 50 JP on SAM, you can wear it, (once you jump the hoop to obtain it).

What about your WAR, your DRG, your DRK you now have to get 50 jp on each job, or use a subpar helm because you upgraded your Otomi to be worn on SAM.

You're all ok with this? Cause I'm not. And I couldn't care less, I can easily get the 50 points for ANY job. But people I know cannot, it's them I'm concerned for.

But why would you be using war, drg or drk if you have sam?
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 Asura.Loire
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By Asura.Loire 2014-11-27 23:48:02
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Quetzalcoatl.Valli said: »
Ok, here's an example.

Otomi Helm gets an upgrade, it's now called Otomi Helm Su

Sure, you have your 50 JP on SAM, you can wear it, (once you jump the hoop to obtain it).

What about your WAR, your DRG, your DRK you now have to get 50 jp on each job, or use a subpar helm because you upgraded your Otomi to be worn on SAM.

You're all ok with this? Cause I'm not. And I couldn't care less, I can easily get the 50 points for ANY job. But people I know cannot, it's them I'm concerned for.
Example is slightly flawed for the fact that we have no idea what superior gear is going to entail. Who knows if it is even going to be for cross job gear and not another way to implement JSE (AF3 119). As others stated albeit in more robust ways accomplishing 50 job points in current end-game would take a focus to do so but not something that will take the weeks or months like producing a RME from scratch.
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 Quetzalcoatl.Valli
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By Quetzalcoatl.Valli 2014-11-27 23:51:09
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If it's JSE (and good) that's even worse. Hello inventory minus.

I already carry 5~+ pieces per slot, per job, I don't really need more 119 options.
 Cerberus.Reiden
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By Cerberus.Reiden 2014-11-28 00:01:01
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Fck CP, JP and Superior1 (Unless the equip comes from a 18 man event).
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By Fenrir.Ramzus 2014-11-28 00:15:37
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if they'd just let you farm JPs on any job like merits then -maybe- it wouldn't be literal AIDS
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 Ragnarok.Afania
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By Ragnarok.Afania 2014-11-28 00:28:19
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Quetzalcoatl.Valli said: »
Ok, here's an example.

Otomi Helm gets an upgrade, it's now called Otomi Helm Su

Sure, you have your 50 JP on SAM, you can wear it, (once you jump the hoop to obtain it).

What about your WAR, your DRG, your DRK you now have to get 50 jp on each job, or use a subpar helm because you upgraded your Otomi to be worn on SAM.

You're all ok with this? Cause I'm not. And I couldn't care less, I can easily get the 50 points for ANY job. But people I know cannot, it's them I'm concerned for.


My lv 75thf can't equip my lv 99 dagger because I didn't grind exp past 75 on thf. Is that so unacceptable?
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 Bismarck.Inference
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By Bismarck.Inference 2014-11-28 00:34:28
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That argument only really works if you assume you can fulltime one piece of gear because it is best for any idle or engaged scenario, or they release enough pieces in the first patch to cover all the bases.
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By Valefor.Prothescar 2014-11-28 00:35:53
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Ragnarok.Afania said: »
Quetzalcoatl.Valli said: »
Ok, here's an example.

Otomi Helm gets an upgrade, it's now called Otomi Helm Su

Sure, you have your 50 JP on SAM, you can wear it, (once you jump the hoop to obtain it).

What about your WAR, your DRG, your DRK you now have to get 50 jp on each job, or use a subpar helm because you upgraded your Otomi to be worn on SAM.

You're all ok with this? Cause I'm not. And I couldn't care less, I can easily get the 50 points for ANY job. But people I know cannot, it's them I'm concerned for.


My lv 75thf can't equip my lv 99 dagger because I didn't grind exp past 75 on thf.

My lv 99BLU can't equip my lv 99 sword because I didn't grind 894745 job points.

Spot the differences.
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 Ragnarok.Afania
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By Ragnarok.Afania 2014-11-28 00:40:54
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Valefor.Prothescar said: »
Ragnarok.Afania said: »
Quetzalcoatl.Valli said: »
Ok, here's an example.

Otomi Helm gets an upgrade, it's now called Otomi Helm Su

Sure, you have your 50 JP on SAM, you can wear it, (once you jump the hoop to obtain it).

What about your WAR, your DRG, your DRK you now have to get 50 jp on each job, or use a subpar helm because you upgraded your Otomi to be worn on SAM.

You're all ok with this? Cause I'm not. And I couldn't care less, I can easily get the 50 points for ANY job. But people I know cannot, it's them I'm concerned for.


My lv 75thf can't equip my lv 99 dagger because I didn't grind exp past 75 on thf.

My lv 99BLU can't equip my lv 99 sword because I didn't grind 894745 job points.

Spot the differences.

There are no difference, jp is the same as lv cap increase.
 Sylph.Malphius
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By Sylph.Malphius 2014-11-28 00:41:54
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Get a Tizona. That's as superior as you can get. Otherwise spend far less time grinding out a few JP's and get something presumably almost as good. Difference spotted.
 Valefor.Prothescar
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By Valefor.Prothescar 2014-11-28 00:51:44
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Ragnarok.Afania said: »
Valefor.Prothescar said: »
Ragnarok.Afania said: »
Quetzalcoatl.Valli said: »
Ok, here's an example.

Otomi Helm gets an upgrade, it's now called Otomi Helm Su

Sure, you have your 50 JP on SAM, you can wear it, (once you jump the hoop to obtain it).

What about your WAR, your DRG, your DRK you now have to get 50 jp on each job, or use a subpar helm because you upgraded your Otomi to be worn on SAM.

You're all ok with this? Cause I'm not. And I couldn't care less, I can easily get the 50 points for ANY job. But people I know cannot, it's them I'm concerned for.


My lv 75thf can't equip my lv 99 dagger because I didn't grind exp past 75 on thf.

My lv 99BLU can't equip my lv 99 sword because I didn't grind 894745 job points.

Spot the differences.

There are no difference, jp is the same as lv cap increase.

So what you're telling me is, JPs are worth 24 levels? maximum lol





Sylph.Malphius said: »
Get a Tizona. That's as superior as you can get. Otherwise spend far less time grinding out a few JP's and get something presumably almost as good. Difference spotted.

So we're comparing it to mythic grinding now too? Leg to stand on etc.
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 Bismarck.Inference
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By Bismarck.Inference 2014-11-28 00:53:01
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Ragnarok.Afania said: »
There are no difference, jp is the same as lv cap increase.

So merit points were then too? Leveling up is a boost to every single stat, on top of what additional utility you'd unlock from having a higher subjob which even the laundry list of JP outside of Superior Armor doesn't cover. If you want to relate gear to a level increase, I again state that it's only giving you relevant stats for as long as you can keep it equipped. Only an actual level cap increase is a level cap increase.
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