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Chick-Fil-A Scandal v2.0 with Firefox CEO
Server: Shiva
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By Shiva.Onorgul 2014-04-05 08:03:55
Ok, I know you're not as stone-headed and ridiculous as this, Ravael, so I can only assume you either have a dark horse in this race or you've gotten so caught up in your rhetorical spiel that you've wound up with your head in the sand.
Not considering an opinion puts you in a box of limited thought. At what point has someone not considered someone else's opinion here?
I will repeat:
At what point has someone not considered someone else's opinion here?
Consideration requires that one hear what is said and judge it. The criterion by which one makes a judgment may be verifiable facts, cold logic, emotional response, or none of the above, but the problem with your argument is that you are not asking that we consider another opinion; you are demanding that we never judge its merit.
In other words, you are using lies about what tolerance implies as a means of creating a judgment-free zone in which the sound of someone violently throwing up is regarded with the same attentiveness and appreciation as a Debussy quartet.
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2014-04-05 08:43:46
This whole "Our actions are justifiable because the other guys are equally as bad or worse than us" nonsense is just getting old. Own up to your own problems and quit assuming I'm disregarding the stupidity on either side. But didn't you get the memo?
Only Republicans are evil dictators here.
Democrats are just good little monarchs. They would never do anything to harm their voters, just the ones that don't vote for them~ If their voters were harmed by regulations, it was because they got in the way....err....unintended victims of the war against the rich...err.....Republicans.
Bahamut.Milamber
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By Bahamut.Milamber 2014-04-05 08:58:39
This whole "Our actions are justifiable because the other guys are equally as bad or worse than us" nonsense is just getting old. Own up to your own problems and quit assuming I'm disregarding the stupidity on either side.
/sigh
You do realize that some of the people you are accuing of discounting opinions arbitrarily are actually trying to engage you in understanding your opinion, and understanding or otherwise trying to not say "your opinion is stupid, shut up?".
Having an opinion on a matter, any matter (but particularily with regards to social interactions), does not entitle that opinion to equal mindshare.
They also need to be considered in their relative frameworks; opinions on social matters should be considered with regards to equality of humans (at least the US, as that was one of the core tenets) and other social contexts.
But in many/most social cases, opinions are just vaguely veiled attempts to enforce a particular doctrine or morality, and are far from unique.
Lakshmi.Zerowone
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By Lakshmi.Zerowone 2014-04-05 09:38:46
Phoenix.Amandarius said: »Bismarck.Bloodrose said: »A lot of people are unaware, that indirectly, as we work for someone else, or more so for ourselves, regardless of the position we hold, we are emissaries of our workplace.
As long as what we do doesn't harm the image of our workplace, they could care less. If what we do promotes business, increases total sales, or inspires productivity, new and profitable ideas, they care just as much as anything we'd do that would tarnish our reputation as an employee, and subsequently, the reputation of the workplace or business.
They can hire and fire people for any kind of meaningless *** they want - as long as it's not something that's a legally protected status. Regardless of how we feel about it. Doesn't make it right, nor does it make it wrong.
Also for people who tend to relay arguments with "logic" in them, and then pander ceremoniously to emotional logic: That's hypocrisy.
Yep. Its called corporate branding and corporate culture. If someone regardless of hierarchical standing says or does something that comes into conflict or is contrary to the specific brand image and culture, they're 86d
I agree fire this bigot and homophobe. Once a bigot always a bigot amirite? And he represents all of us yet.
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As much as you might hate that person, the US is not ran like a corporation.
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2014-04-05 09:41:35
Phoenix.Amandarius said: »Bismarck.Bloodrose said: »A lot of people are unaware, that indirectly, as we work for someone else, or more so for ourselves, regardless of the position we hold, we are emissaries of our workplace.
As long as what we do doesn't harm the image of our workplace, they could care less. If what we do promotes business, increases total sales, or inspires productivity, new and profitable ideas, they care just as much as anything we'd do that would tarnish our reputation as an employee, and subsequently, the reputation of the workplace or business.
They can hire and fire people for any kind of meaningless *** they want - as long as it's not something that's a legally protected status. Regardless of how we feel about it. Doesn't make it right, nor does it make it wrong.
Also for people who tend to relay arguments with "logic" in them, and then pander ceremoniously to emotional logic: That's hypocrisy.
Yep. Its called corporate branding and corporate culture. If someone regardless of hierarchical standing says or does something that comes into conflict or is contrary to the specific brand image and culture, they're 86d
I agree fire this bigot and homophobe. Once a bigot always a bigot amirite? And he represents all of us yet.
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As much as you might hate that person, the US is not ran like a corporation. Absolutely true.
Corporations at least has standards they go by.
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By Shiva.Onorgul 2014-04-05 09:43:52
Standards that are laudable when you want to oust Barack Obama but that we should totally ignore when someone else wants to oust Brendan Eich.
Hypocrite.
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2014-04-05 09:50:19
Standards that are laudable when you want to oust Barack Obama but that we should totally ignore when someone else wants to oust Brendan Eich.
Hypocrite. Standards that are laudable when you want to oust Brendan Eich (and anyone else you disagree with) but that we should totally ignore when somebody else wants to oust Barack Obama.
Hypocrite.
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By Bahamut.Baconwrap 2014-04-05 09:58:22
You mean like conservatives (or Republicans) passing laws defining marriage as between only man and woman?
Oh so because one group does it, it's justifiable. Fantastic logic!
Lakshmi.Sparthosx said: »Again, I'll ask real slow. Why. Should. anyone. take. bigots. opinions. into. mind? What is the argument that is supposed to make tolerate the idea of denying rights to a subsection of Americans? Lets hear it.
Do we take the concerns of tinfoil hat wielding conspiracy theorists into account when we chlorinate drinking water or print money? No. Because their arguments are ***and not worthy of anyones time other than the History channel and public access. You take them into account here's the keyword "accordingly." By not taking a bigots opinion into mind, oneself then is a bigot.
Quote: big·ot
noun \ˈbi-gət\
: a person who strongly and unfairly dislikes other people, ideas, etc. : a bigoted person; especially : a person who hates or refuses to accept the members of a particular group (such as a racial or religious group)
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By Shiva.Onorgul 2014-04-05 10:02:35
Standards that are laudable when you want to oust Barack Obama but that we should totally ignore when someone else wants to oust Brendan Eich.
Hypocrite. Standards that are laudable when you want to oust Brendan Eich (and anyone else you disagree with) but that we should totally ignore when somebody else wants to oust Barack Obama.
Hypocrite. False. I never wanted to oust Eich.
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2014-04-05 10:03:23
Aren't we all bigots in heart anyway?
Because anyone who strongly dislikes anyone else can be categorized as a bigot just on the sole fact that they strongly dislike the other person. The "unfairly" part of the definition is open to interpretation and is also by the opposing party's opinion.
So, just for the fact that we all dislike each other makes us all bigots.
Lakshmi.Zerowone
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By Lakshmi.Zerowone 2014-04-05 10:03:55
Bahamut.Baconwrap said: »You take them into account here's the keyword "accordingly." By not taking a bigots opinion into mind, oneself then is a bigot.
Then would you say that there is nothing wrong with "accordingly" discounting them, after taking them into account "accordingly"?
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2014-04-05 10:05:19
Standards that are laudable when you want to oust Barack Obama but that we should totally ignore when someone else wants to oust Brendan Eich.
Hypocrite. Standards that are laudable when you want to oust Brendan Eich (and anyone else you disagree with) but that we should totally ignore when somebody else wants to oust Barack Obama.
Hypocrite. False. I never wanted to oust Eich. You want to oust somebody else you don't agree with though.
Like the Koch brothers. Or Rush Limbaugh. Or <insert anyone from Fox News>. Or Rupert Murdoch.
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By Bahamut.Baconwrap 2014-04-05 10:05:53
Bahamut.Baconwrap said: »You take them into account here's the keyword "accordingly." By not taking a bigots opinion into mind, oneself then is a bigot.
Then would you say that there is nothing wrong with "accordingly" discounting them, after taking them into account "accordingly"?
Yes, however, part of that entails actually understanding the opposition and why they arrived at such a conclusion.
Lakshmi.Zerowone
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By Lakshmi.Zerowone 2014-04-05 10:08:20
Standards that are laudable when you want to oust Barack Obama but that we should totally ignore when someone else wants to oust Brendan Eich.
Hypocrite. Standards that are laudable when you want to oust Brendan Eich (and anyone else you disagree with) but that we should totally ignore when somebody else wants to oust Barack Obama.
Hypocrite. False. I never wanted to oust Eich. You want to oust somebody else you don't agree with though.
Like the Koch brothers. Or Rush Limbaugh. Or <insert anyone from Fox News>. Or Rupert Murdoch.
That's a bad example, all 3 are not political figures in the capacity of holding office. All except Limbuagh set the corporate culture of their companies. Limbaugh on the other hand can take his show some where else if his stations canned him.
They're not very good examples to the point you're trying to make.
Lakshmi.Zerowone
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By Lakshmi.Zerowone 2014-04-05 10:09:50
Bahamut.Baconwrap said: »Yes, however, part of that entails actually understanding the opposition and why they arrived at such a conclusion.
With respect to the topic of Marriage how many times have you heard, " that bible say's it's Adam and Eve not Adam and Steve?"
Ironically Adam and Eve were never officially married, but they were all they had unless of course we acknowledge Lilith.
edit: here is a chart for the traditional marriages depicted in the bible:
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By Bahamut.Baconwrap 2014-04-05 10:19:15
Bahamut.Baconwrap said: »Yes, however, part of that entails actually understanding the opposition and why they arrived at such a conclusion.
With respect to the topic of Marriage how many times have you heard, " that bible say's it's Adam and Eve not Adam and Steve?"
Ironically Adam and Eve were never officially married, but they were all they had unless of course we acknowledge Lilith.
edit: here is a chart for the traditional marriages depicted in the bible:
I have a much better example.
Well use me and my views on gender dysphoria and how I was am referred to as a bigot edit: on FFXIAH.
I take a strictly biomedical standpoint on the issue, yet because of social norms I am referred to as a bigot. I refer to proper medical agencies, proper medical references, yet I'm a bigot...
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By Shiva.Onorgul 2014-04-05 10:23:39
Standards that are laudable when you want to oust Barack Obama but that we should totally ignore when someone else wants to oust Brendan Eich.
Hypocrite. Standards that are laudable when you want to oust Brendan Eich (and anyone else you disagree with) but that we should totally ignore when somebody else wants to oust Barack Obama.
Hypocrite. False. I never wanted to oust Eich. You want to oust somebody else you don't agree with though.
Like the Koch brothers. Or Rush Limbaugh. Or <insert anyone from Fox News>. Or Rupert Murdoch. I do so enjoy when someone else tells me what I think and how I feel. It's just like being Kingnobody or anyone else who lets his chosen political pundits ram their fists up their back.
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By Shiva.Onorgul 2014-04-05 10:26:35
Bahamut.Baconwrap said: »Yes, however, part of that entails actually understanding the opposition and why they arrived at such a conclusion. What the hell are you arguing for, exactly?
I can't discount an opinion I've never heard. Once I've heard it and, by any criterion, judge it, then I can accept, ignore, or discount it. Your argument seems to be that we stop at hearing and never move on to judging, which is not only absurd but also literally impossible.
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By Shiva.Onorgul 2014-04-05 10:34:12
Aren't we all bigots in heart anyway? What is "at heart"?
Biologically, though, yes, we all make judgments. We favor those genetically close to us, we distrust those different, and this has been observed in infants, so it is very much a part of our neurological programming. And there is a certain evolutionary incentive to make judgments that benefit ourselves and our kin.
Where we wander into the realm of bigotry is when the judgments we make provide no discernible benefit to us and inhibit someone else. Using the gay marriage debate as an example, since it is a very easy one, there is literally no benefit to denying anyone access to the legal protections of marriage. It is a decision marked entirely by irrational thinking.
Lakshmi.Zerowone
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By Lakshmi.Zerowone 2014-04-05 10:35:43
Bahamut.Baconwrap said: »I have a much better example.
Well use me and my views on gender dysphoria and how I was am referred to as a bigot edit: on FFXIAH.
I take a strictly biomedical standpoint on the issue, yet because of social norms I am referred to as a bigot. I refer to proper medical agencies, proper medical references, yet I'm a bigot...
You're going to have to refresh me on your standpoint.
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By Bahamut.Baconwrap 2014-04-05 10:38:28
Bahamut.Baconwrap said: »I have a much better example.
Well use me and my views on gender dysphoria and how I was am referred to as a bigot edit: on FFXIAH.
I take a strictly biomedical standpoint on the issue, yet because of social norms I am referred to as a bigot. I refer to proper medical agencies, proper medical references, yet I'm a bigot...
You're going to have to refresh me on your standpoint.
That gender dysphoria is a mental condition listed in the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders. Yet I get referred to as a bigot the minute I even say that.
Why because I don't agree with the opinion that it's a natural non-pathological process on par to child-labor.
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By Shiva.Onorgul 2014-04-05 10:40:23
I'm forgetting the bit that came after it: what conclusion are you driving towards by pointing out that gender dysphoria is in the DSM-IV?
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By Bahamut.Baconwrap 2014-04-05 10:44:12
I'm forgetting the bit that came after it: what conclusion are you driving towards by pointing out that gender dysphoria is in the DSM-IV?
None really whatsoever. But because I hold the same point of view as the DSM I have been referred to as a bigot, garbage, stupid, etc...
EDIT: So the question that has been presented the past few pages has been: why should one take into mind the opinion of the bigot or the ignorant?
Yet here I am hardly the ignorant on the subject matter of gender dysphoria being called a bigot.
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By Shiva.Onorgul 2014-04-05 10:46:57
Mm... so basically you're defending bigotry because someone accused you of being a bigot. You do realize how disingenuous that makes your current argumentation, right?
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By Bahamut.Baconwrap 2014-04-05 10:47:34
Mm... so basically you're defending bigotry because someone accused you of being a bigot. You do realize how disingenuous that makes your current argumentation, right?
No. I edited my post a bit.
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By Shiva.Onorgul 2014-04-05 10:54:44
My point still stands. I wandered back to read the argument you're referring to and I find it every bit as poor as I did the first time.
But I will repeat: you're making the wrong argument. You were accused of being a bigot on arbitrary grounds by someone who was keyed up to have a fight. You are now arguing that we should listen to anyone's opinion no matter how ill-supported or insane. So, in effect, you are saying that we should give at least as much shrift to the emotional knee-jerk non-logic that called you a bigot as we give to your defense based on the consensus of the medical field.
You are literally arguing against your own best interests.
Although, I am glad you're doing so because hopefully a few people will see this and maybe come to realize they've been doing the same very consistently. 30 seconds of logic and contemplation instead of parroting what someone with a vested interest in using and abusing you would turn the partisanship in this country on its ear as the masses rise up to crucify the puppetmasters.
Or we can keep up the BDSM-sub routine and ask daddy to whip us more.
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By Bahamut.Baconwrap 2014-04-05 11:01:13
Although, I am glad you're doing so because hopefully a few people will see this and maybe come to realize they've been doing the same very consistently. 30 seconds of logic and contemplation instead of parroting what someone with a vested interest in using and abusing you would turn the partisanship in this country on its ear as the masses rise up to crucify the puppetmasters.
My point still stands about respecting other people's opinions. Not respecting others'; opinions and discounting them as garbage is plain disrespectful and tactless. And I have no problem calling you or anyone else a bigoted *** for doing such.
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By Shiva.Onorgul 2014-04-05 11:07:25
"You called me a bigot, so I'm gonna call you a bigot right back!"
Tell me, should I respect the opinion of someone who arbitrarily calls you a bigot and flails constantly when trying to explain why? Or am I allowed to, having heard that opinion and its lack of argument, chuck it in the bin and mock the ignorance from whence it spawned?
Normally you guys are bang-up-alongside making judgments of others. It's not rhetorically more convenient to about-face on that in order to defend an opinion that must be very weak indeed if it requires that kind of inversion.
By fonewear 2014-04-05 11:17:15
Neither of you two even play this game anymore, can you please shut the *** up and go away. Thanks.
OkCupid protests Firefox over CEO's anti-same-sex marriage donation
Quote: CNN) -- Dating site OkCupid is calling for its members to ditch Firefox and use another browser to search for love. The company is protesting Mozilla's new CEO, Brendan Eich, who supported an anti-same-sex marriage campaign. Firefox is owned by Mozilla.
When OkCupid members navigate to the site on a Firefox browser, they are met with a message encouraging them to use an alternative browser to access the site, including Google Chrome, Opera, Safari and the amusingly misspelled Internet Exploder.
"Those who seek to deny love and instead enforce misery, shame and frustration are our enemies, and we wish them nothing but failure," reads the message.
The page points out that 8% of the matches made on OkCupid are between same-sex couples.
Last week, Mozilla promoted Eich, a longtime employee who was previously the company's chief technology officer, to the position of CEO. The move prompted renewed outrage by third-party developers and employees. Eich donated $1,000 to support Propostion 8 in 2008. The California ballot initiative sought to ban same-sex marriage in the state. The donation was made public in 2012 but Eich held onto his job.
After the announcement of Eich's promotion, app development company Rarebit announced it had pulled its apps from Firefox. "As a married gay couple who are co-founders of this venture, we have chosen to boycott all Mozilla projects," said founder Hampton Catlin in an open letter to the company.
Various Mozilla employees have also spoken up about the promotion, taking to Twitter to openly share their disappointment with Eich's politics. Some have come together and publicly called for Eich to step down.
Eich posted a blog on his personal site last week addressing the backlash. He outlined his plan to support LGBT-friendly policies at Mozilla and expressed "sorrow at having caused pain."
"I am committed to ensuring that Mozilla is, and will remain, a place that includes and supports everyone," he said.
The apology hasn't satisfied everyone, and the backlash continues to grow one week later. OkCupid is one of the most high-profile companies to take a stand against Eich's appointment.
The letter on the OkCupid home page is a bold move. However, it is not actually blocking Firefox users from using OkCupid. At the bottom of the page is a link to continue on to the site.
"Mozilla supports equality for all, including marriage equality for LGBT couples. No matter who you are or who you love, everyone deserves the same rights and to be treated equally," said a Mozilla spokesperson in a statement. "OK cupid never reached out to us to let us know of their intentions, nor to confirm facts."
Dan Cathy move over! This is a completely different issue, one that I don't support. The man donated money prior to being CEO for the company and company money wasn't used for the donation.
I never really used Mozilla Firefox anyways. I always found it a memory hog, prefer Google Chrome.
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