DRG In Delve/Plasm Farm?

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DRG In Delve/Plasm Farm?
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 Bismarck.Bloodrose
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By Bismarck.Bloodrose 2013-06-07 17:16:16
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Cerberus.Cruxus said: »
SE ever elaborate on when/if they ever plan on working on letting angon stack with Gungnir effect? I'd imagine that would be quite useful (and long overdue) for this type of content...
Unfortunately, they haven't indicated anything of the sort. At best, we can get Fully merited Angon, Dia III and Geo Debuff going on any mob at once (though I assume there's a -defense cap) for -66% defense, give or take.

I see people mentioning Ophidian Trident like they've never heard of the Naakual NQ from the Wildskeeper Reive boss. The again, I would also think that the obvious STR path on Ophidian would help to eliminate some of DRG's severe lack of attack in comparison to the other DD's
 Leviathan.Kaparu
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By Leviathan.Kaparu 2013-06-07 17:23:54
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Tlamini is immensely worse than the already terrible Ohpidian Trident
 Leviathan.Kaparu
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By Leviathan.Kaparu 2013-06-07 17:33:06
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For reference, a fully upgraded STR Ophidian against Ryunohige(which ranges from being slightly better than to ~equal to a DRK) buffed to the nines trails by ~22%. That's a massive gap by melee output standards. While I maintain that a DRG is probably outright essential for some(/all) of these bosses, the above is why I really don't think anyone but truly exceptional(ly geared) players should be taking on the role.

Edit: and do keep in mind that this is assuming a 30-some odd million gil investment. Take the "fully upgraded" tag off of it and you drop an additional ~3%
 Asura.Ryndo
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By Asura.Ryndo 2013-06-08 01:19:57
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You guys say exceptionally well geared? How do u mean? What sort of sets should a drg have apart from the obvious tp ws jump and healing breath...

Id say mine is well geared but you may have different ideals?
 Bismarck.Xzeikx
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By Bismarck.Xzeikx 2013-06-08 01:32:18
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Leviathan.Flashbangx said: »
Quetzalcoatl.Datian said: »
Then you must be playing with retards :) because i have yet to come across a drg with delve pole keeping up with me on drk.

Very possible so. Haven't been focusing on other people's gear too much or anything like that. Either way, my DRG is proving more useful as a DD than literally like 90% of the other DDs that I've done delve with. I'm not trying to say ANY DRG can be a top DD, a bad player is a bad player, but I'm doing fine with mine. If anyone disagrees that actually plays DRG, then they probably are just terrible DRGs.

Man that server must be terrible. But hell i dont invite people without delve weapons.
 Leviathan.Flashbangx
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By Leviathan.Flashbangx 2013-06-08 20:04:11
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Ravenn42 said: »
Leviathan.Flashbangx said: »
Quetzalcoatl.Datian said: »
Then you must be playing with retards :) because i have yet to come across a drg with delve pole keeping up with me on drk.

Very possible so. Haven't been focusing on other people's gear too much or anything like that. Either way, my DRG is proving more useful as a DD than literally like 90% of the other DDs that I've done delve with. I'm not trying to say ANY DRG can be a top DD, a bad player is a bad player, but I'm doing fine with mine. If anyone disagrees that actually plays DRG, then they probably are just terrible DRGs.

I would love to see a parse. If you said delve polearm maybe but the skirmish polearm thats crazy. The last drg I played with had top notch gear and the delve weapon and my sam beat him by 200k....

How much plasm you make a run?

Been getting like barely over 5k plasm. No idea if that is good or bad, I've only done a few runs so far. Since I posted that I got with an incredibly group and got like 6.5k with a group that had like 6 BRDs lol. I doubt I was on the top of that parse, though. I don't think anyone ran one.
 Quetzalcoatl.Lanien
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By Quetzalcoatl.Lanien 2013-06-08 20:19:19
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I don't understand the development standpoint between Upukirex and Ophidian.

Upukirex is incredible.

Statistically, Ophidian makes zero sense by comparison.
 Bismarck.Bloodrose
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By Bismarck.Bloodrose 2013-06-08 20:25:45
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I still run with a Herja's Fork, since I don't have the current gil investment to make a Ryunohige (nor the appropriate assault rank/clears at this time) and I couldn't justify dropping 30k plasm on the Ophidian Trident. I've honestly been looking into the Skirmish Polearm because of the potential augments on it would allow me to keep my 5 hit, and be of comparable dps or higher, than the Ophidian - problems arise though in getting it, and then again when augmenting it.

Once I do get the polearm from Muwingya though, it'll be a sweet, sweet ride to victory.
 Bismarck.Xzeikx
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By Bismarck.Xzeikx 2013-06-08 20:27:08
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Leviathan.Flashbangx said: »
Ravenn42 said: »
Leviathan.Flashbangx said: »
Quetzalcoatl.Datian said: »
Then you must be playing with retards :) because i have yet to come across a drg with delve pole keeping up with me on drk.

Very possible so. Haven't been focusing on other people's gear too much or anything like that. Either way, my DRG is proving more useful as a DD than literally like 90% of the other DDs that I've done delve with. I'm not trying to say ANY DRG can be a top DD, a bad player is a bad player, but I'm doing fine with mine. If anyone disagrees that actually plays DRG, then they probably are just terrible DRGs.

I would love to see a parse. If you said delve polearm maybe but the skirmish polearm thats crazy. The last drg I played with had top notch gear and the delve weapon and my sam beat him by 200k....

How much plasm you make a run?

Been getting like barely over 5k plasm. No idea if that is good or bad, I've only done a few runs so far. Since I posted that I got with an incredibly group and got like 6.5k with a group that had like 6 BRDs lol. I doubt I was on the top of that parse, though. I don't think anyone ran one.
i get 5700 in ceiz a friend i know gets around 7500~ in morimor.

Ive even seen some get up to 10k its just the caliber of players and knowledge of the zone/nms
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By Ophannus 2013-06-08 21:27:29
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DPS on Ophidian is still incredible, I mean technically its the same DPS as a Bereaver or Bloodbath axe. The only thing that hurts when comparing Ophidian with other weapons is the WS damage. But jeez when I'm fully buffed, at capped Haste, I have like 80-90 delay and the swing speed on Ophidian is pretty ridiculous.

Also doesn't a 6 hit with 396 delay gets 100% TP faster than than a 5 hit at 492?


396Delay x 6hits = 2376 total delay for 100%
492Delay x 5hits = 2460 total delay for 100%

Ophidian also has the highest DPS of any polearm besides the final boss Delve weapon and basically the same DPS as other delve weapons.

[(DMG rating of weapon) x 60] / (Delay of weapon)

Ophidian Trident: 27.42 DPS
Bloodbath Axe: 27.50 DPS
Bereaver: 27.50
 Leviathan.Kaparu
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By Leviathan.Kaparu 2013-06-08 21:29:41
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"DPS" taken out of context is completely meaningless. Ophidian DRG is not good relative to more prominent DD. Period.
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By Ophannus 2013-06-08 21:40:52
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You guys make it seem like DRG is falling like 20-30% behind other DDs when in actuality its more like 5-10% and even that can be a stretch considering buffs/gear/skill, and like I said the extra damage dealt to the target due to Angon more than makes up for that 5-10% and then some, mostly when discussing single target NM fights and not roaming fighting several mobs. When fully buffed, I'm still busting out 4-6k Stardivers many times back to back, I swing like a maniac with delay that low. The only jobs that really stick it to DRG from my experience are SAMs due to Shoha's craziness and Annihilator RNGs. I've seen SAMs do wtf8k Shohas spam and of course RNG destroys most things due to not getting debuffs, and dropping 2k crits/relic procs, 11k barrages,4k+ coronachs and just hitting things for 800-900 and generally pretty much never dying or getting paralyzed/stunned. Ive seen some DRKs do 9k+ resolutions but usually those DRKs have Galkan HP and ride Souleater pretty much fulltime which is suicide unless you have healers willing to cure bomb.
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 Leviathan.Kaparu
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By Leviathan.Kaparu 2013-06-08 21:45:33
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That figure almost exactly represents its deficit. You're comparing anecdotal parses and weapon-based DPS. Seriously, stop.
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By Ophannus 2013-06-09 04:16:37
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You're parsing 30% behind other DDs with a 6 hit Ophidian Kaparu?
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By macsdf1 2013-06-09 04:24:04
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I look for sam drk and mnks when I pick DD for my plasma runs.
 Ragnarok.Takagi
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By Ragnarok.Takagi 2013-06-09 05:37:49
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Ragnarok.Sekundes said: »
They have not. And it's been over a year and a half.

Hey, look at the bright side. They finally mentioned Atomos and Cait Sith summons again after who knows how long. Maybe Angon/Gungnir update is right around the corner (but I seriously seriously doubt it)
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By Quetzalcoatl.Jakey 2013-06-09 20:10:13
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DRG is not ideal dps job for plasm farming generally, it does well on NMs for angon but for basic farming it is nothing special, that said, if you know what you are doing and have at least Ophidian you can do fine dps wise and keep up or beat many other dps. The thing is if you put as much effort in gearing drk/sam/mnk you would probably do a little bit more damage in plasm farming. This is based off of parsing every plasm run I do and those are the jobs that can beat me sometimes but as most runs I do are pug runs most will still lose to me and they are either under-geared or simply terribads.

Of course given how many healers are also terribads, having a wyvern to help heal often comes in handy for pug runs :(
 Odin.Skeero
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By Odin.Skeero 2013-06-09 20:50:01
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This thread makes me sick. Drg is a fine dd. Just most drgs are awful. Maybe im dumb for making drg my main and gearing it over all other jobs. Drk and war will always be king of dps, but saying drg isnt warranted a spot in a loldelve farm is dumb.
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 Odin.Skeero
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By Odin.Skeero 2013-06-09 21:03:04
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Another thing. If you arent killing all 5 nms and then farming afterwards, you are doing it wrong. Thats 10k just for nms. Which should only take 25min. And id def not do that without a drg
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By Ophannus 2013-06-09 21:23:40
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90% of DRGs i run into on my server have no real gear strategy. They wear things they think are good but aren't. I always run into DRGs on Odin subbing /WAR, rocking Patientia Lances, TPing in 4/5 Karieyh Armor, no X hit builds. Just poor *** choices which makes the other 10% seem like a joke to everyone and ruins their image. There are even DRGs with amazing gear that don't even know wtf they're doing with the gear for example I've seen a JP Ryunohige player on Odin who doesn't swap gear when he WS and he TPs in Cassie Earring.
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 Lakshmi.Glaciont
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By Lakshmi.Glaciont 2013-06-09 21:44:58
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Quetzalcoatl.Lanien said: »
I don't understand the development standpoint between Upukirex and Ophidian.

Upukirex is incredible.

Statistically, Ophidian makes zero sense by comparison.

It makes no sense at all to suddenly give DRG a 392 delay weapon, and have a GK do more DMG.. where traditionally the roles are reversed.
 Odin.Skeero
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By Odin.Skeero 2013-06-09 21:51:38
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Well they did say they were going to add wyvern stats to delve polearms. So maybe its for "barance".
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By Ophannus 2013-06-09 21:53:52
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For the same reason why out of the 4 knight jobs DRK SAM DRG PLD, DRG is the only one without a 'Bash'. Or out of the 3 earrings you buy with Imp.Standing that have latent effects with Arcane/Holy/Warding Circles, they never implemented one for Ancient Circle. Little things like this just make it evident that SE overlooks and/or doesn't care about DRG.
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By Lakshmi.Glaciont 2013-06-09 21:56:17
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Still going to take my DRG into delve though, got to fight the current notion DRG is shoved under.
 Ragnarok.Sekundes
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By Ragnarok.Sekundes 2013-06-09 22:04:57
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Odin.Skeero said: »
This thread makes me sick. Drg is a fine dd. Just most drgs are awful. Maybe im dumb for making drg my main and gearing it over all other jobs. Drk and war will always be king of dps, but saying drg isnt warranted a spot in a loldelve farm is dumb.
So I guess you're saying drg is just fine as it is and doesn't need anything else because we're totally on par with every other dd, right?
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By Sylph.Systematicchaos 2013-06-09 22:14:19
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DRG easily falls behind by 20% or more in damage. Times where it would not fall behind by that much:

-Mob weak to piercing
-Ryunohige Dragoon
-Dragoon is using a brew
-You're running a parse like scoreboard which doesn't capture everything when people move outside of your small radius, making it seem like DRG is actually a DD.

Long story short, you don't bring DRG for damage unless it has a Ryunohige, or there's only 18 people on the server.
 Odin.Skeero
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By Odin.Skeero 2013-06-09 22:24:21
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Im not saying we have to be the top dd, but bring support along with our dmg. We have stardiver which gives everyone 5%+ crit, angon which gives everyone a huge increase in dmg. Im ok with being a support dd. I have Gungnir, Ryun, and Upukirex. Been drg since day one. I am fine with not parsing 1st as long as i do my job. Which is do dmg, and help others do more dmg, and help keep other dds alive IF needed.
 Leviathan.Kaparu
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By Leviathan.Kaparu 2013-06-09 22:32:32
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And despite having all of those things, you're a perfect example of how not to represent the job

Sylph.Systematicchaos said: »
Long story short, you don't bring DRG for damage unless it has a Ryunohige or Upukirex, or there's only 18 people on the server.

Why do people always feel the need to go any further than this? The job is poorly designed but has an important purpose for lengthier fights. End of story.
 Bahamut.Kiba
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By Bahamut.Kiba 2013-06-09 22:52:11
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this was back when my ls member's had delve weapons around lvl 5 and we didnt have any gear or it was low lvl. i do have ryu though.
Divagating Jagil
 Odin.Skeero
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By Odin.Skeero 2013-06-10 00:31:40
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Leviathan.Kaparu said: »
And despite having all of those things, you're a perfect example of how not to represent the job

Sylph.Systematicchaos said: »
Long story short, you don't bring DRG for damage unless it has a Ryunohige or Upukirex, or there's only 18 people on the server.

Why do people always feel the need to go any further than this? The job is poorly designed but has an important purpose for lengthier fights. End of story.

Dude you are garbage, continue to be happy with your 6k plasma runs and your weak *** drg. Ill continue to parse high, and be a well rounded drg, and get my 70k plasma per run.
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