DNC Merits?

already stated i would use the body if i had a +2 one, which i dont

Evade rate caps. Once you reach that cap on a given NM, there is no point adding more. Getting SB to a reasonable level really isn't that difficult and AGI should be autocapped given Gnarled Horn. Thus, any eva added once capped is a waste, and you should instead be working other gear into the eva set (multiple eva sets OH MY GOD). ***is situational, and eva sets do not necessarily need to be 100% defensive.

also dropping mirke is roughly a loss of 12 and a half evasion, not something 2 point in closed position is going to make up.

1) im aware, i have it at the cap i want it at
2) agi doesnt auto-cap with gnarled horn
3) i do have a medium evasion/ DD hybrid and a full blown evasion set
4) no in one of the few cases i've seen ninian is not right.

I don't see why you're trying to disagree then.

This. <_<;

My point was--and maybe I wasn't explaining myself properly--was that most mobs don't require that much evasion. Having Closed Position gives you more evasion space to work with to have a more efficient hybrid build.

And if you have a hybrid evasion build, and you say I'm wrong... then you're wrong too. <_<;

because for me to drop a piece of equipment (that doesnt have haste) and to keep the gear set balanced correctly i'd have to nearly cap out closed position, which personally i wouldn't do to since i like my no foot rise equally as much as ninian who publically announced that she does not have an eva kila, likes her closed position. like i said we play differently and it's obvious.

I'll agree to disagree, it's not like I'm going to be changing your mind anytime soon.

likewise, i think the feeling is mutual. (dont get me wrong i love you to death {same for nightfyre})

I have 5/5 NFR since the day DNC merits came out. Trust me, it's always been wasted merits, even before Presto. More than two would be wasted merits. You have to wait on Reverse Flourish recast anyway, so you can easily fit a Presto+Step in there. And if your role for a fight disables your ability to TP (for some reason I can't really think of since you can step+flourish without facing the monster or usually can find some others monsters nearby to TP on) then get regain atmas for the fight.

Just how much evasion would you need anyways... I mean I haven't tanked too many things so far on thf but usually the only thing I use to increase my evasion is GH no merits either... and dnc is only like down 45 evasion between jt and skill and the evasion set you list more than makes up for that by alot.

Makes me almost regret making 2 evasion kila+2s lol.

Also why would you use 3 DW over 4 haste...

over a certain % (i haven't done the math for it in quite a long while) in a solo situation 3% dual wield gives more than 4% haste, nevermind the fact that mirke has 5 str/dex/agi and 10 evasion. even then situational ***is situational

edit: and yeah 2 eva kila's really are overkill, i personally use daka/evakila

@flippant: you can only get 5fm in 30 seconds (granted if you were riding timers) and reverse flourish is not the only FM eating job ability we use, violent flourish and now striking flourish to name a few.

I typically Reverse with 4FM. That's technically 15 seconds (counting from 0).

Violent Flourish, I'll give you that. That's 1FM. Hardly a loss, and 5NFR merits isn't going to make a huge difference here (especially not the difference other potential merits could provide). And if you have 2NFR merits, then there's your 4FM at the end.

Striking Flourish...I think if I'm in a situation that causes me to be that concerned about the extra 15 seconds 'til another step or the however-many TP from the loss, then I am probably not focusing on extra WS damage.

But that's just my opinion. To be honest though, I have not played DNC since before Abyssea (well, I played it to level it but all I actually got to do was pull buffalos across Uleguerand for 5 hours).

Actually it's based on comparative percentages. However that's for attack speed. Assuming solo going from 31 to 35% haste will beat 3% DW in attack speed increase as long as you have less than 48.25% DW.

Haste and/or march would make it pretty much impossible for DW to catch up unless rapp was overcapping you and you weren't switching something out for more DW

4% haste will pretty much always win for tp gain.

Also tping 5str/dex/agi is pretty much useless in abyssea for a dagger wearing as long as you have cruor buffs GH and RR.

Now outside of abyssea yeah that will help out a nice bit.

Also one day I actuallly hope to use double kila+2... they are still pretty good dps enough where the loss from using most evasion gear/atmas would be greater

yeah i usually have around 50% dw (i still <3 my nuskus for soloing)

flip hearing dnc being made to pull makes me cry inside :(

Well, it was just me, a dboxing PUP and a RDM lol :x

thats not so bad i guess, just hate hearing full alliances making dancers pull :(

Having 5 merits in Reverse flourish saves you time and TP. Using your extra step AND Presto does slow you down a good 2 seconds, as well as cost you 10 tp. Given that you lose like 6 evasion/acc (should be capped on acc anyway).. I'd say its a fair trade off. While this little difference to delaying tp gain momentarily, and 10 tp cost per 3 minutes may seem like not much, over time it'll equate to a lot of damage dealt and tp gained. It also allows for the use of other flourishes faster, and can get you out of bad situations if you need TP quickly.

i like fan dance a lot, but on just about anything i solo anymore i've found a mixed eva/tp set with GH/Dark Depths/RR paired with saber dance/drain samba gives the best results. maybe i need to solo harder mobs?

I strictly built my DNC for soloing. My merits are:

5/5 Haste Samba Effect
5/5 Reverse Flourish Effect
5/5 Fan Dance
5/5 Closed Position

I never had too much issues with step acc, so figured that was a waste. No foot raise, In all honesty I get steps extremely fast anyway without it. Saber dance, like I said i barely use dnc for anything other then soloing or duoing. If I where to use saber dance it would only be for a split second, then I'd take it off. Sooo meh.
Love my DNC set up.

87 TP return from Reverse Flourish is hot hot hot!
I'm a speed fenatic so of course I had to 5/5 Haste. Fan dance is for them sketchy mements when you need the defense and being able to use it more often, is better. Soloing, what can ever go wrong with more Haste and Accuracy from Closed Position?

Oh my numbers meant less than 48 before the peice in question... and of course any other form of haste would do skew things into rappare so greatly there isn't enough DW to make 3 DW mirke faster

that doesnt sound right =/

regardless, you should be able to cap haste without body to begin with

It's not easy getting 26% haste for most people I would think, unless you got a really good group to get +2 AF3s of course.
5 Head
3 Hands
5 Legs
4 Feet
7 Waist
Thats only 24% without body >.<
Got me Charis Tights +2 today though!

What can I say 4 is usually greater than 3 ;).

Haven't looked into gear sets but while yes it probably is it might open up more options for other peices of DW or double/triple attack or something....

Hell right now I'm trying to find a way to use thf jse belt while still capping haste despite having twilight lol

I mainly use my DNC for soloing for these are my merits:

Group 1:
Reverse Flourish 5\5
Haste Samba 5\5
Group 2:
Fan dance 5\5
Closed Position 5\5

I swear with this merits I have never had so much fun on a single job in FFXI, soloing mobs I could never have on any of my other jobs. DNC is just pure awesomeness.

Head is 6 haste which puts you at 25% which is really good enough. If you really want that last 1% can use the haste neck but its relaly only giving you .39% haste so not really worth it.

After much un-meriting and re-meriting I've ended up with what is probably my final setup.

5/5 Samba, 5/5 Reverse
3/5 Saber, 2/5 Fan, 5/5 NFR

If dnc is the only job you play and/or you want to be versatile I'd suggest a similar setup. My arguments for 5/5 NFR:
1. Starting everything with 100%+ tp (+2 hands) is nice. This wasn't an issue back when VV was cool. I miss regain..
2. There are times when you shouldn't engage and/or shouldn't be standing next to the mob. You can still cw if things go bad.
My thoughts on the arguments against 5/5 NFR for my play style:
1. No, I'm not going to waste my ls's time changing jobs/atma mid event unless it's really needed.
2. FF isn't a nonstop melee burn. There is occasionally a short downtime.
3. Running off to pull a tp mob isn't always an option.
Arguments I agree with for not having 5/5 NFR:
5/5 saber or 5/5 fan could fit your play style. Since I would advise at least 1 in each, that leaves you with <5 NFR.
My eva/dd hybrid set doesn't cost me very much in the DD department, but if you don't currently have optimal gear, closed position might allow an extra dd piece. I used 3/5 closed, 1 saber/fan, 5/5 NFR before acquiring the af+2 set.

It's hard not to have 20 merits saved up these days. Change it up and see what fits best.

Why are people getting pissed over other dnc's merits? If they feel it is best let them have it. Just say what merits you think are good for dnc and let the person who made the thread decide what merits they want.